1978 White 2-135 tractor Hydraulic issues

MinniMan

Member
Sorry for the long post but I need to outline the problem and where I am at in the diagnosis/repair stage.
Lost all hydraulic pressure. Oil level topped up. I removed the transmission cover. The pump drive appears ok. I tested for charge pump operation by reconnecting all lines except the one to the brake valve. Started the engine and oil was pumping out of the line in a good volume BUT instead of a steady flow it was spurting and appeared to have a lot of air entrained in the oil. Let the engine run for a minute or two at varying speeds but it continued to shoot out oil and air bubbles. So I removed the hydraulic pump and charge pump. The o ring on the pickup tube did appear hard along with the backup washer. Also noted wear marks/groves on the pickup tube (maybe caused by vibration?). The mounting bolts on the charge pump were not very tight, several fairly lose.
Should I only replace the pickup tube and o ring and backup washer or replace the seals in the charge pump too? Outlet and return lines on the charge pump appeared ok no leaks either end. But no hyd oil reaching the hydraulic pump. Probably not building enough pressure to open the valve to supply the hydraulic pump but I am only guessing this is the problem.
I would appreciate any and all advice as this is a new experience for me. Also suggestions for a good resource for o rings, backup washers etc. White tractor parts are not easily available in my area (Manitoba Canada) especially specialty backup washers and unique sizes for this type of hydraulic system. I think I will be looking at replacing many o rings/seals as there are many leaks throughout the system.
Thank you for you help.
 
First off was the trans lube light on indicating low charge pump pressure? Most definitely replace all O-rings and back up washers .There is a seal inside the charge pump that needs replaced also. Disassemble the pump and make sure the key that drives the pump is ok. If your lube light wasn't on it could be a problem with your piston pump oil from that pump supplies the brake valve pressure.
 
By coincidence, I too have a '78 2-135 and am in manitoba.
For the type of parts you're asking about, I've had good luck at hi-tech seals in winnipeg - found them to be good to deal with. Downside is that they do have a minimum purchase $ amount - can't remember what it is. Kepco is another source, also in winnipeg.
When I bought the 2-135 (just over a year ago) the steering was really loose, so I went through the front end - replaced the pinion shaft and various bearings, bushings, orings, seals etc.
Picked up a fair number of the parts at hi-tech as well as bearing shops etc but found that some items that I needed were not easily found. For instance the sealing rings for the steering cylinder - hi-tech could not find them as a stock size - said they could make them if I couldn't find them, but that would be $$$ So, I ordered them from agco and found that they were actually very reasonably priced... I must say that so far, agco has been able to get anything I've needed from them for the old tractor - some parts priced what I thought was reasonable, others, not so much, but as least they seem to be doing a pretty good job of keeping parts available.
I just hope that neither of us ever needs to replace a charge pump...
Good luck with it!
Herb
 
Thank you to both [b:c8a1eb9e43]2-stroke DD[/b:c8a1eb9e43] and [b:c8a1eb9e43]Herb Mb[/b:c8a1eb9e43] for you replies. I appreciate it very much.

[b:c8a1eb9e43]2-stroke[/b:c8a1eb9e43] the trans lube light wasn't on at any time so perhaps it is burned out or non functional for some other reason. Since I never noticed the lube light on it would be worthwhile to check its operation out.
I plan on replacing all O-rings, back up washers, seals (and bearings if required) throughout the charge pump since it is out and on the bench. I have also thought about the woodruff key and possible keyway wear where it fits to the shaft.
Regarding the hydraulic pump I have already considered replacing it (I know big $$'s) unless it proves to be functional following other repairs.
I have an IT shop manual and read it VERY carefully as well as any comments or suggestions I find online regarding careful disassembly and assembly.
Thank you again for your advice and feel free to add any further thoughts you may have.

[b:c8a1eb9e43]Herb[/b:c8a1eb9e43] So nice to know I am not alone in MB with a white! I actually have two of them the 2-135 and a 2-105. Great haying tractors!
I very much appreciate your suggestions re: parts sources.
I am in the southwest of MB so Bdn is my main shopping center and then Drummond's at Holland MB who handle White parts. Otherwise Wpg was my next thought for sourcing parts followed by US dealers.
Just a tip for you, Harvest Salvage in Bdn has proven very helpful as a parts source for these old beasties. Agco also has an excellent online parts book with pictures and part numbers.
I agree a charge pump and or hydraulic pump are about half the value of the tractor. Lets hope our luck holds for both of us and we don't need either.
 
MinniMan: Was your 135's hyd system working normally, then failed suddenly, or was there a gradual loss of performance?

btw, had a 2-105 years ago - wish I'd kept it...
Currently have the 135 and a pair of 4-210s.
I'm sure there're still some old whites around the province, though it's becoming rare to see one come up for sale!

I'm not far from wpg - hopefully, you can find what you need closer to home.
Thanks for the tip re harvest. I've been there in the past for combine parts - will certainly keep them in mind for white parts.

Please do let us know what you find out about your hyd issue!
Herb
 
Well I spent some time this morning in the AGCO parts book and got all the parts at Brandon Bearing including backup washers and key (if needed) However 2 specific sized O-rings were not available and I need the shaft size for the seal.
One O-ring for the plug which holds the pickup tube in the bottom of the transmission housing (1/8 x 2-11/32 ID) (Alternate #942312) and the other O-ring is for the charge pump cover .103 x 5-1/2 ID (Alternate #941610)
I haven't disassembled the charge pump yet since I wanted to try to have parts on hand before I took it apart.
However I will have to remove the shaft to measure it for the seal size as only the outside dimension is given in the book.
If I have trouble accessing these pieces locally an alternative will be to try the White Dealer but they are some distance away.
 
Just an update on the 2-135 hydraulic issues.
I disassembled the charge pump and all internal metal parts appeared in good condition however the O-rings, backup washers and seal were rock hard. They broke into pieces when I removed them from the sealing groves. I was able to replace the bearings and cups and all O-rings except for the pump cap O-Ring. That O-Ring was a unique size so had to get it from the Agco Dealer. (.103 X 5 1/2)
Considering the condition of the O-Rings in the charge pump, I have removed the Pressure control valve and filter head. Although the O-Rings in these two parts do not appear as hard, I will replace all of them. To do so though I have to order from the dealer as virtually all are of a specialty size and not available locally.
I am just waiting to hear back on the availability from the dealer and price. Once I have the parts I will replace each O-Ring and completely clean the internal valve parts before reassembly.
I noted a few of the fittings where the steel inverted flare lines attach have grooves right on the bevel. I ordered several replacement fittings as well as I wondered if it might not be possible to get a tight seal due to this grove.
Has anyone sanded this grove away on a fitting and had success with it sealing afterwards?
 

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