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8N Questions--First-Time Owner

C

CalebHummell

Member
Hi, all.

I'm the owner of an 8N that I picked up recently for $1500. It needed work of course, and I had a local tractor repair guy go through it. His only business is repairing tractors, and he's been at it for more than 40 years. He replaced the lift hydraulics (the bush mower wouldn't stay in any lifted position for more than a few seconds before it slowly worked its way all the way back down), points/plugs/condenser, ignition coil, plug wires, all oils and fluids, etc. It now seems to run reasonably well. He had to spend quite a bit of time tracking down an ignition problem that he finally traced to a short in the wire coming from the coil. The tractor came with an old brush mower, which works reasonably well, along with a blade. It's a 12-volt negative ground system.

There was a manual in the tool box with a 1952 copyright date, but the previous owner(s) didn't know what year the tractor was. Is there any way to determine what year the tractor was made?

How do I determine horsepower so I can know what Category of 3-point equipment to buy?

There's no draw bar, so I need to know what draw bar to buy.

There's a Tractor Supply not far away, but the people there don't seem to know much--they're mostly kids.

I have a small apple tree stump I'd like to pull out (about 8" diameter) using the tractor, but do I use the draw bar for that? Using second or third gear? (I already tried reverse, and the right tire just spins probably because gear ratio is too low?)

If I need to use the tractor to pull a stuck truck or our commercial mower down below the barn, is there a best way to do that?

We've had this 10-acre property for 22 years and it was finally time to get a serious piece of equipment to help out. I'm getting too old to do the kind of manual labor I'd been doing.

In the closeup photo of the attach point, is that where the pin shown next to my hand is attached? The other photo shows the brush mower setup.

Thanks for the help.
38303.jpg
38304.jpg
38305.jpg
 
Congrats on the new tractor. But be careful; they can get addictive! I've got 5.

Stay away from TSC for parts. They have good chicken feed & work shirts. Use this site or nnalert's for parts.

Be very, very careful pulling stumps. You can flip the tractor very easily. (see tip # 11 & 19)

Get the manuals; see tip # 39.
DSC03217.jpg

75 Tips
 
Thanks, Bruce. Your 75 Tips was one of the first docs I found a couple of months ago and I've read it numerous times, tip by tip.

I agree about TSC. I seldom shop there, but they're just across from the Coop, so I occasionally go just to browse.

I'm digging through HFJ's recommended web sites to see if I can find the year of my machine. There's no serial number I can determine, even using a strong raking light across the plate where the serial number should be.

The one thing I noticed about the 1952 manual in the tool box is that it assumes the buyer is already familiar with tractors. That might not have been an unreasonable assumption in 1952. As a retired instructional designer, technical writer, and trainer, I find many of these old manuals truly insufferable in what they assume the user already knows.

Even so, my 1-year-old Exmark commercial mower manual assumes you are going to be doing your own maintenance and already know how to service the machine and/or have a shop to do it for you. The manual that came with the machine is essentially worthless for maintenance.

~Caleb
 
"Is there any way to determine what year the tractor was made?" Serial number is stamped along the rear top edge of the block on left side. (above starter) do not be surprised if it is extremely difficult to read.

Year is not the critical issue on these 8N's. The important question is does it have a front mount or side mount distributor.

Sitting on the seat, if the generator/alternator is on the right side of engine it is front mount distributor (late 1947 - mid 1950). If generator/alternator is on left side of the engine it is a side mount distributor (mid 1950 - 1952)

"How do I determine horsepower so I can know what Category of 3-point equipment to buy?
There's no draw bar, so I need to know what draw bar to buy."

Category 1 three point. You might be able to get an 11 hole drawbar that fits across the 3 point arms at Tractor Supply. Also look for the "A" braces that go from the front hole of the top link mount to the rear of the three point arms. I would not be afraid of a TSC drawbar, but no ignition parts.

TSC may have the FO-4 I&T shop manual

You will need to cut all the anchor roots before the tractor will even think about pulling the tree stump. Hook ONLY to the drawbar for any pulling. Low gear. Trying to pull from a point above the front drawbar arm connections will likely result in flipping the tractor. 8N's have an extremely fast reverse.

"If I need to use the tractor to pull a stuck truck or our commercial mower down below the barn, is there a best way to do that?" Probably get a bigger tractor

These are a fun tractor to operate as long as common sense and safe practices are observed and they are not pushed beyond design limits.
 
Thanks for the info.

A neighbor and his 8N pulled my pickup out of a muddy mess below the barn quite a number of years ago, but he's long since moved. So I know the 8N will do the job but I just don't remember how he attached the chain to the tractor.
 
Caleb, with all due respect, you are going to injure yourself or worse. You NEVER should try to pull a stump with an 8N. Maybe drag
it around after you dig it out. You could kill yourself or others in an INSTANT doing things wrong that you never knew about. Even
the simplest thing of hooking a log chain in the wrong location on the tractor will prove fatal! No we cannot tell you all the
BAD/WRONG ways.

Sorry but you do not seem to have the foggiest notion how to operate a TRACTOR. They are not toys.

Don't attempt to pull out a stuck vehicle. Call a wrecker.

It really concerns me that, not just you, all these new "wanna be" tractor owners/operators that do not have a lick of common sense
are out among us.

Sorry if I offend anyone reading this, but I have seen what happens from doing wrong stuff or STUPID things!

Roger
 

"There's no serial number I can determine, even using a strong raking light across the plate where the serial number should be."

you'll likely need to take a wire wheel to it. the numbers are hand stamped, and they were dubious enough when new, let alone covered by who knows how many layers of paint.

mine was the same way. i got to leaning on the wire wheel, et voila, numbers magically appeared. i never did figure out what the last 2 digits were, but i can live not knowing them. the beginning of the number matches up nicely to the dates on the trumpets, so those last 2 digits can keep their secret. too much like work for a limited return, my arthritis tells me to find something else to do.
 
Welcome to the forum Caleb.

"There's no serial number I can determine"
There may not be. As I understand it, replacement engines came
with that spot blank and the installer was supposed to stamp it.

There are date codes elsewhere on the tractor too that will be
close. Rear axle trumpets, bottom of the hydraulic pump, etc.
Unfortunately, all those parts could have been changed too.
The information rvirgil_KS gave you will get you very close.
It will also match up with the information on John Smith's site
that HFJ linked for you. Tons of information there and parts too.

Our hosts, YT, sell a solid mount drawbar to pull with. Bolts
right on to existing holes using existing bolts. Replaces that
part in your close-up picture. Here's a [b:4aa93ee179]link[/b:4aa93ee179] to it.
Stay safe out there!
 
Roger, that's why I'm asking for ideas and opinions. I'm very safety conscious, and have a healthy respect for machinery. Been around heavy equipment a long time, just not the 8N. No need to patronize and label folks "wannabes," as you call them.

You were a wannabe once yourself, even if you grew up around equipment. Unfortunately, most folks who consider themselves experts forget that they were also ignorant at one time.

Common sense is learned, not inherited, which is why I'm asking so many questions.

My whole life was writing technical documentation, manuals, and training programs for the very equipment I operated. And, like I said earlier, the Ford "manuals" as they were originally written are an absolute disaster from the aspect of learning about the tractor. What I've found from interviewing hundreds of subject matter "experts" is that opinions are a dime a dozen but knowledge is in pretty short supply.

Thanks anyway. I'll try other forums.
 

I see that you have the mount for the swinging drawbar there under your PTO.

Looks like you're missing the pin that goes in there. You can see the pin in my pic below. The bottom of that mount has a spring latch in it. You insert the pin and twist it to lock it in there. Since you don't have the pin, I'll bet that that latch part is filled up with hard packed dirt like mine was before I got my pin. A high pressure blast of water hose might just clean it out. You can buy the pin you need.

You can also see in my other pic, the swivel hook that I have in mine. This is a good attach point for pulling a stump if you must. As said use all caution.

F-DrawBarPin_zpssu6qglks.jpg

F-hitch_zps38htjiwh.jpg

DSC03683_zpsc44m3ujx.jpg
 
"Thanks anyway. I'll try other forums."

That's always an option but I haven't found any better than this
one. People will give similar responses on most, if not all of them.
Take those responses with a grain of salt and move on.

We used to have a fellow on here who called all of us a doofus.
Basically just for asking a question, as if we should already know.
If we knew, why would we ask?

In any forum environment you have to weigh the opinions given
and then pick and choose what to do with the consensus of info.
Nature of the beast I guess. Don't be too thin skinned.
Best of luck with your new tractor BTW! :)
 
Caleb, attaching a chain or strap to the upper 3 point location can cause the tractor to overturn backwards. The FORD OM
specifically states NOT to pull from that location. The info is in there where to pull from and how. I just read it.
The pin you are holding is for the upper location. I have seen the upper bracket go thru two walls of a house and imbed
in the third when the upper bracket broke. A nylon strap was being used to pull a stump when the bracket broke. Luckily
no one was injured and the tractor did not overturn which would have in all likely hood killed the driver.

Roger
 
(quoted from post at 15:25:35 07/23/16) Caleb, with all due respect, you are going to injure yourself or worse. You NEVER should try to pull a stump with an 8N. Maybe drag
it around after you dig it out. You could kill yourself or others in an INSTANT doing things wrong that you never knew about. Even
the simplest thing of hooking a log chain in the wrong location on the tractor will prove fatal! No we cannot tell you all the
BAD/WRONG ways.

Sorry but you do not seem to have the foggiest notion how to operate a TRACTOR. They are not toys.

Don't attempt to pull out a stuck vehicle. Call a wrecker.

It really concerns me that, not just you, all these new "wanna be" tractor owners/operators that do not have a lick of common sense
are out among us.

Sorry if I offend anyone reading this, but I have seen what happens from doing wrong stuff or STUPID things!

Roger
Click to expand...

Roger,

Let me tell you a story, My sister had a mobile home here in the hills. To make the pad for the home, the dozers basically leveled the top of a hill. On one side was a downslope of maybe 30 or 35 degrees. My nephew used to park his El Camino at the edge of the hill. He came home one night and his brakes went out. He went straight over the hill and it came to rest against a boulder that stopped it.

He came and got me the next morning and I took my 8N up there and took a look. The back bumper was about 20 feet down the hill. I didn't know if my 8N would do it but I decided to give it a try. I hooked a chain to that mount under my PTO and my 8N pulled that thing up that hill like it was a toy.

My point is that not everyone is a bloomin' idiot as you seem to assume. Things can be done safely if you use your head.

It's when people get careless that bad things happen.
 
Some people wake up and wonder what they'll
worry about today. Others wake up and wonder
what they can get done.
We have both types here - though fortunately
there's more of the latter than the former.
Your tractor is not inherently unsafe though
you could easily make it so by doing unsafe
things. Most of us trust that you know the
difference.
Just go have some fun with it, work the heck
out of it which is what they like doing.
And don't pay attention to those who would
try to scare you unnecessarily.
 
With four 8Ns, I have accumulated and read most of the usual manuals for these tractors, and I agree with you about their shortcomings. I have a degree in technical journalism from Iowa State University and wrote and taught writing professionally from 1968 to 2015 so am fairly familiar with the subject. And from a writing standpoint, some user manuals, well, just plain suck. They assume way too much initial knowledge on the part of the reader, so asking questions of actual users on this forum and elsewhere is good. As for the 8N itself, it's plenty safe to use with experience and caution, as many others have said. I use mine all the time for pulling cars and light trucks. Don't let a few rude replies scare you away from this forum. This is the home of great information about the N series. Stick around.
 
(quoted from post at 16:33:45 07/23/16) Hi, all.

I'm the owner of an 8N that I picked up recently for $1500. It needed work of course, and I had a local tractor repair guy go through it. His only business is repairing tractors, and he's been at it for more than 40 years. He replaced the lift hydraulics (the bush mower wouldn't stay in any lifted position for more than a few seconds before it slowly worked its way all the way back down), points/plugs/condenser, ignition coil, plug wires, all oils and fluids, etc. It now seems to run reasonably well. He had to spend quite a bit of time tracking down an ignition problem that he finally traced to a short in the wire coming from the coil. The tractor came with an old brush mower, which works reasonably well, along with a blade. It's a 12-volt negative ground system.

There was a manual in the tool box with a 1952 copyright date, but the previous owner(s) didn't know what year the tractor was. Is there any way to determine what year the tractor was made?

How do I determine horsepower so I can know what Category of 3-point equipment to buy?

There's no draw bar, so I need to know what draw bar to buy.

There's a Tractor Supply not far away, but the people there don't seem to know much--they're mostly kids.

I have a small apple tree stump I'd like to pull out (about 8" diameter) using the tractor, but do I use the draw bar for that? Using second or third gear? (I already tried reverse, and the right tire just spins probably because gear ratio is too low?)

If I need to use the tractor to pull a stuck truck or our commercial mower down below the barn, is there a best way to do that?

We've had this 10-acre property for 22 years and it was finally time to get a serious piece of equipment to help out. I'm getting too old to do the kind of manual labor I'd been doing.

In the closeup photo of the attach point, is that where the pin shown next to my hand is attached? The other photo shows the brush mower setup.

Thanks for the help.
Click to expand...

You have a ~25 horsepower tractor. I am sure tens of thousands of small stumps have been pulled with N series tractors and I have pulled quite a few of my own ;-) When pulling anything always hitch below the axle, never pull from the top link, and use care. Although I don't have hard data to back it up I suspect many more people have been killed or injured by tractor runaways than flip overs from pulling too high. The overly high gearing, light front end, and marginal at best brakes make N series tractors hard to handle and especially dangerous on hilly terrain. They can get out of control in a heartbeat and that is always my primary concern.

TOH

PS> I share your opinion of most operator/user/service manuals. Sadly quality writing in general and technical writing in particular are becoming lost arts.
 
As a "new wanna be" I will add this.
Great old tractor. Will work hard.
Enjoy it. Common sense is top
priority. If it's scary don't do it.
We bought a ford 640 a few months
ago. Loved it. Bought it some
friends. A ford 960. And a 9N. Also
if you can load it up and take it to
tractor shows. Not every tractor
there is 100% restored. Mine go in
work clothes!! Lots of knowledge can
be picked up at shows. Enjoy.
 
Thanks for the information.

Yep, I understand not attaching to the top link. I'm a pilot and flight instructor and understand full well the concepts of CG and moment arm.
 
Thanks, rossow. Fortunately, many modern manuals are written with a more comprehensive view of their audience. That, and the product liability lawyers have gotten involved.

An old flight instructor once said that you can't always avoid stupidity, but you can at least avoid ignorance. Unfortunately, the aircraft doesn't make that distinction. Either one will kill you in an eye blink.
 
An old flight instructor once said that you can't always avoid stupidity, but you can at least avoid ignorance. Unfortunately, the aircraft doesn't make that distinction. Either one will kill you in an eye blink.
Click to expand...

To paraphrase the old joke about the Piper Cub, "The Ford 8N is about the safest tractor in the world - it can just barely kill you."

Here's how I removed some old peach trees with my 8N (yootoob link). Depending on the size of your tree(s), this is about the safest way I can think of to use an 8N to take one out. Sounds like you'll use your head, whatever method you choose.

My '50 frontmount is one of the handiest tools I have on our 15 acres. I've cut, raked and baled with it, plowed and disced, run a corn picker, planter, John Deere 30 combine, box and back blades (dug us out of 3-4' drifts one winter), pulled a manure spreader, given innumerable hay rack rides and rescued an occasional stuck pickup truck…

Stay safe, and enjoy using yours!

es

2016_discingfirstrow.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 16:53:04 07/24/16)
An old flight instructor once said that you can't always avoid stupidity, but you can at least avoid ignorance. Unfortunately, the aircraft doesn't make that distinction. Either one will kill you in an eye blink.
Click to expand...

To paraphrase the old joke about the Piper Cub, "The Ford 8N is about the safest tractor in the world - it can just barely kill you."

Here's how I removed some old peach trees with my 8N (yootoob link). Depending on the size of your tree(s), this is about the safest way I can think of to use an 8N to take one out. Sounds like you'll use your head, whatever method you choose.

My '50 frontmount is one of the handiest tools I have on our 15 acres. I've cut, raked and baled with it, plowed and disced, run a corn picker, planter, John Deere 30 combine, box and back blades (dug us out of 3-4' drifts one winter), pulled a manure spreader, given innumerable hay rack rides and rescued an occasional stuck pickup truck…

Stay safe, and enjoy using yours!

es

2016_discingfirstrow.jpg
Click to expand...
I saw your front wheels come off the ground there Ed.
Not too surprising with the weight of that disk on there too.
Suppose that disk would have kept you from flipping completely
over backwards? I think it probably would have. Good method.
BTW, I always love seeing your pictures, they're awesome!

This young man seems to have far less fear of the front
wheels being off the ground then most. All about attach point.
He will loose traction before it flips backwards and he knows it.
He's the son of a fellow forum member here in Michigan.

38362.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 15:40:03 07/24/16)
(quoted from post at 16:53:04 07/24/16)
An old flight instructor once said that you can't always avoid stupidity, but you can at least avoid ignorance. Unfortunately, the aircraft doesn't make that distinction. Either one will kill you in an eye blink.
Click to expand...

To paraphrase the old joke about the Piper Cub, "The Ford 8N is about the safest tractor in the world - it can just barely kill you."

Here's how I removed some old peach trees with my 8N (yootoob link). Depending on the size of your tree(s), this is about the safest way I can think of to use an 8N to take one out. Sounds like you'll use your head, whatever method you choose.

My '50 frontmount is one of the handiest tools I have on our 15 acres. I've cut, raked and baled with it, plowed and disced, run a corn picker, planter, John Deere 30 combine, box and back blades (dug us out of 3-4' drifts one winter), pulled a manure spreader, given innumerable hay rack rides and rescued an occasional stuck pickup truck…

Stay safe, and enjoy using yours!

es

2016_discingfirstrow.jpg
Click to expand...
I saw your front wheels come off the ground there Ed.
Not too surprising with the weight of that disk on there too.
Suppose that disk would have kept you from flipping completely
over backwards? I think it probably would have. Good method.
BTW, I always love seeing your pictures, they're awesome!

This young man seems to have far less fear of the front
wheels being off the ground then most. All about attach point.
He will loose traction before it flips backwards and he knows it.
He's the son of a fellow forum member here in Michigan.

38362.jpg
Click to expand...

If you get an "N's" front that high off the ground and still don't flip it over you may wind up with your tractor sitting down on it's oil pan. They aren't made for doing wheel stands. :mrgreen:
 
"If you get an "N's" front that high off the ground and still don't flip it over you may wind up with your tractor sitting down on it's oil pan."

Granted, that Co-op is a lot longer tractor than an N is.

I've tried to lift too much on my 3 pt pallet forks with my 9N.
It lifts the weight but then when I try to drive forward the front lifts.
Even though I'm being ever so gentle on the clutch.

Once, to the point that it was resting on the pallet forks.
At least I think it was. I stopped, lowered the 3 pt and set the
front wheels down gently, then took some weight off the forks
and started over. Had an even more scary situation when a 3 pt
post hole digger caught a rock or tree root and lifted the front end.
That was an instant glance at the sky!
BTW, there's no reverse on those post hole diggers! :)

I'm not trying to make light of the dangers with these machines.
They are machines that have no feelings.
They will kill you in a heartbeat and not even care.
If we let them.
Keep your head straight, pay attention, stay safe.
 
(quoted from post at 19:02:14 07/24/16)

If you get an "N's" front that high off the ground and still don't flip it over you may wind up with your tractor sitting down on it's oil pan. They aren't made for doing wheel stands. :mrgreen:
Click to expand...

I've had my 9N in that position so many times it thinks it's name is "Hi Ho Silver" ;-) The front axle and oil pan are still quite fine.....

TOH
 
(quoted from post at 16:47:41 07/24/16)
(quoted from post at 19:02:14 07/24/16)

If you get an "N's" front that high off the ground and still don't flip it over you may wind up with your tractor sitting down on it's oil pan. They aren't made for doing wheel stands. :mrgreen:
Click to expand...

I've had my 9N in that position so many times it thinks it's name is "Hi Ho Silver" ;-) The front axle and oil pan are still quite fine.....

TOH
Click to expand...

Maybe, but with my kind of luck it would only take one time. I can't find it now but there was a video of what I remember to be an "N". View was from the front. I guess it was trying to pull something like a stump. It reared up about that far and came down and both front wheels were splayed out like the flippers on a seal.
 

during my tenure, my N has only had its wheels like that once - when some silly person (no names mentioned) thought it would lift the howse - the one that's heavy enough to have its own gravitational field.

didn't make that mistake twice.
 
Got a call from a neighbor; said he had a dead oak tree about to go through his fence & needed some help. As soon as I pulled in his driveway, I saw the problem. The tree was leaning toward the fence, so the neighbor got a rope about 15 feet up the tree & tied the rope off to the top link of his N. He put as much tension as he thought was needed to keep the tree from going through the fence when he cut it. Well, half way or so through the cut, the tree went toward the fence.......and lifted the front of the N about 3 feet off the ground! I suggested he cut the rope & let it go; boards & wire are cheaper than tractor repair!
 
(quoted from post at 17:33:07 07/24/16) Got a call from a neighbor; said he had a dead oak tree about to go through his fence & needed some help. As soon as I pulled in his driveway, I saw the problem. The tree was leaning toward the fence, so the neighbor got a rope about 15 feet up the tree & tied the rope off to the top link of his N. He put as much tension as he thought was needed to keep the tree from going through the fence when he cut it. Well, half way or so through the cut, the tree went toward the fence.......and lifted the front of the N about 3 feet off the ground! I suggested he cut the rope & let it go; boards & wire are cheaper than tractor repair!
Click to expand...

So, I assume that the tractor sat back down again with no problems ?
 
(quoted from post at 17:56:43 07/24/16)
(quoted from post at 17:33:07 07/24/16) Got a call from a neighbor; said he had a dead oak tree about to go through his fence & needed some help. As soon as I pulled in his driveway, I saw the problem. The tree was leaning toward the fence, so the neighbor got a rope about 15 feet up the tree & tied the rope off to the top link of his N. He put as much tension as he thought was needed to keep the tree from going through the fence when he cut it. Well, half way or so through the cut, the tree went toward the fence.......and lifted the front of the N about 3 feet off the ground! I suggested he cut the rope & let it go; boards & wire are cheaper than tractor repair!
Click to expand...

So, I assume that the tractor sat back down again with no problems ?
Click to expand...

Yep. He cut the rope. Tractor dropped nicely to the ground, as did the tree. Right through the fence!
 
I saw your front wheels come off the ground there Ed. Not too surprising with the weight of that disk on there too.
Suppose that disk would have kept you from flipping completely
over backwards? I think it probably would have. Good method.
BTW, I always love seeing your pictures, they're awesome!
Click to expand...

Yep, with four concrete blocks and a couple 6x6 timbers on top of the disc, I have to steer with the brakes when it's lifted! When I did the peach trees, I hitched to the drawbar, and figured the disc would act as both extra traction and wheelie bars. I was riding the clutch carefully, but you did see her wanting to rear up! I never felt unsafe doing it though.

Glad you like the photos - I enjoy capturing picturesque moments and sharing them!

es

Here's a rerun of one of my favorites:

2015_sunsetplowing.jpg
 

ed, you've got a natural eye for a great composition. your pictures are always a joy to behold. keep em coming :)
 
I lost a good friend because he hooked a tow strap to the top link bracket on an 8N to pull out a stump. It snapped over on him like a mousetrap. He never had a chance. His bride of less than two months found him two hours later. He was clearing a lot for their new house.
 
(quoted from post at 11:21:04 07/25/16) I lost a good friend because he hooked a tow strap to the top link bracket on an 8N to pull out a stump. It snapped over on him like a mousetrap. He never had a chance. His bride of less than two months found him two hours later. He was clearing a lot for their new house.
Click to expand...

Sorry for your friend but we know he hooked it up wrong don't we?
 
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