Some pictures/questions from a 2N teardown

lastcowboy32

Well-known Member
Didn't like my compression on 3 and 4. Tried loosening the valves last fall with the ATF in the fuel method. It helped a little...maybe. It was still a little skippy, so I decided to get the manifold off and take a look. Also noticed some stuff with the governor while I was removing linkages.

I'm going to take off the head to look at the pistons too.

Here are some pics of interest so far:

First picture is under the valve cover. I have a screwdriver pointing at what looks like the two halves of a valve keeper just laying there?

Second picture is of the governor. The spring is loose, as the throttle can be pulled almost half way before the spring catches and moves the governor to carb linkage. I was moving the throttle back and forth and watching the spring.

But...

The linkages also have some slop in them where they attach to the governor itself. When I move the throttle, the linkages wobble a little and a little space opens up right where my screwdriver is pointing. Are there some kind of shims or bushings that I would need to tighten that up? Or is that normal?
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Here are those two pieces removed from the engine. Looks like the two parts of a valve keeper? Maybe one half is mangled.

Either way, they must have come from somewhere.
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(quoted from post at 06:19:05 05/17/16) If those keepers came off of one those valves you need to go buy a lottery ticket.
aybe not cleaned up from a previous job.?
 

In the pic , it looks like that spring / retainer is sitting on the lifter . these motors run surprisingly well on 3 cylinders .
 

If your exhaust valve is floating high it might not draw in much fuel / fresh air but also draw in exhaust from the other 3 cylinders
 
I would get a new set of keepers and install them and see how she runs before I remove the head. That spring sure does look like it is setting on the lifter.
 
(quoted from post at 07:44:43 05/17/16) I would get a new set of keepers and install them and see how she runs before I remove the head. That spring sure does look like it is setting on the lifter.

I don't have the experienced eye to see that. I did look at the springs relative to the lifters and tried to play "Sesame Street", as in...one of these springs is not like the others...but couldn't quite see a difference myself.

Is it possible to see the keepers inside of the springs from where I'm looking? As in, would I be able to look at the top of the springs and find which one is missing its keepers.

If those keepers are there from a previous job, they would have set there for about two years, since that's how long I've owned the tractor. This is the first time that I've looked under the valve covers, much less changed any keepers.

Maybe the little film of oil/gunk on that ledge has had enough surface tension to hold them there? If so, it's a testament to the fact that I haven't bounced this tractor up and down or abused it enough to shake them down off of the ledge :)
 

One thing that I noticed when I looked at the engine is that the lifters look different for the valves. There are eight valves total, in two banks of four.

In each bank of four, the two center valves have what appear to be nice, new springs. The lifters underneath have a little hex-headed screw sticking out of the top. "Adjustable lifters"???

The two valves on the outside of each bank have springs that look old with a lot of crud built up on them. Also, the lifters underneath don't seem to have those adjustment screws sticking out of the top.

Could someone have done a valve job some time ago and installed new lifters, springs and such on four of the valves (the two inner valves of each bank) and left the others alone???
 

Actually...the other way around here too. I was working from memory. The inner springs were nice and new...but the outer ones that were cruddy had what looked like adjustable lifters.

It's been a long day already and I'm getting loopy. Now refraining from commenting/putting my foot in my mouth until I'm better rested :)
 

I took the liberty of modify your picture a bit, made it brighter. Look at the valve stem inside the spring up a couple of coils, you will see notch or groove in the stem, that is where the keepers go. The end of the valve should ride on lifter not the spring retainer.Or if you have the rotater type the cap on that will ride on the lifter.
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(quoted from post at 11:25:15 05/17/16)
I took the liberty of modify your picture a bit, made it brighter. Look at the valve stem inside the spring up a couple of coils, you will see notch or groove in the stem, that is where the keepers go. The end of the valve should ride on lifter not the spring retainer.Or if you have the rotater type the cap on that will ride on the lifter.
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Oy! I looked at that groove and thought...maybe...but the last time I did a valve keeper was small engines class in high school back in *cough* 1985 *cough*.
 
(quoted from post at 07:44:43 05/17/16) I would get a new set of keepers and install them and see how she runs before I remove the head. That spring sure does look like it is setting on the lifter.

The weekend is coming up, and I'm going to get back into this. I've been wondering, though. What would make keepers come off? Should I put a set of calipers on the valve stem to make sure they diameter is still in tolerance?

Is it usually the keepers that go bad, or the valve wears (i.e. the groove gets wallowed out, etc.)

The mechanism of failure makes a big difference, doesn't it? If there's something wrong with the valve, I might put on a set of keepers only to have them pop off again.

Or is that really rare?
 

That's what I was thinking. Valves aren't all that expensive. I think the whole set of all four with springs and hardware and such can be had for around 150 bucks.
 

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