Ford 9N Wagner WM3 Loader/Pump Issue

I'm hoping someone with more expertise than me (won't take much) can point me in the right direction. My loader on my 9N isn't getting any pressure (now). I think it warrants a story and some observations I have made.

Initial situation. One week ago the loader was working fine with one problem. The pump was leaking pretty significantly. I was still able to use it but was disturbed by the amount of fluid pouring out of the pump. I also noticed that the drive shaft seemed misaligned. I took off the pump and the connector to the drive shaft. The connector was badly worn so I got a new one of those and have installed. As for the pump, I opened it up to look for any obvious issues such as a missing or badly worn seal etc, but didn't see anything. I took it to a nearby implement to have them take a look and see if they could replace seals etc (they couldn't get new seals). Now the pumps that came on the WM3 are pretty simple, not a lot too them (my point is I'm pretty sure it's put back together correctly, not much you can do wrong?). I decided to put the pump back on and align the shaft hoping that the misalignment was causing the leak. Did that. I also drained out all the fluid and changed the hydraulic filter (naturally I drained the fluid, it all came out with the pump off!). The WM3 is supposed to hold 5 gallons, only half that drained out. That didn't surprise me as it was leaking so much.

After everything was hooked back up I refilled the fluid. Thought it was odd that only 2-2.5 gallons fit back in too. When I drained it I did so from the feeder hose that goes into the pump, I also took out the drain plug next to it (didn't see any strainer as mentioned in the manual).

So I started it back up and noted the alignment looked great now. Also didn't see any fluid leaking from the pump. Great! Or not. Tried the hydros and nothing. nadda. Not knowing where to start I took the pump off and could tell everything was still turning as expected, couldn't see any issues.

Wanted to test if there was pressure coming out of the pump, so we actually unhooked a hose just upstream of the pressure side of the pump and went behind a blast shied to just crank it and see (kidding). What happened next confused me. The fluid didn't seem to come out with high pressure, but rather hydraulic fluid came out of the air hole at the top of the loader/reservoir, the non pressure side. I have NO clue what that means but maybe it means something to someone else.

Not sure where to go next. I'd say pump for sure if it had not been working days earlier (but before it was taken apart and inspected), and the fact that I only got 2.5 gallons in, and that strange pressure relief in the reservoir when the pressure side was open. Any ideas are much appreciated! Thanks! I can post pics if any are needed.
 
On many pumps there is an inlet and outlet and if you have them back wards the pump will not pump an have any pressure so did you maybe get the 2 hoses on backwards
 
(quoted from post at 16:05:43 07/18/15) I'm hoping someone with more expertise than me (won't take much) can point me in the right direction. My loader on my 9N isn't getting any pressure (now). I think it warrants a story and some observations I have made.

Initial situation. One week ago the loader was working fine with one problem. The pump was leaking pretty significantly. I was still able to use it but was disturbed by the amount of fluid pouring out of the pump. I also noticed that the drive shaft seemed misaligned. I took off the pump and the connector to the drive shaft. The connector was badly worn so I got a new one of those and have installed. As for the pump, I opened it up to look for any obvious issues such as a missing or badly worn seal etc, but didn't see anything. I took it to a nearby implement to have them take a look and see if they could replace seals etc (they couldn't get new seals). Now the pumps that came on the WM3 are pretty simple, not a lot too them (my point is I'm pretty sure it's put back together correctly, not much you can do wrong?). I decided to put the pump back on and align the shaft hoping that the misalignment was causing the leak. Did that. I also drained out all the fluid and changed the hydraulic filter (naturally I drained the fluid, it all came out with the pump off!). The WM3 is supposed to hold 5 gallons, only half that drained out. That didn't surprise me as it was leaking so much.

After everything was hooked back up I refilled the fluid. Thought it was odd that only 2-2.5 gallons fit back in too. When I drained it I did so from the feeder hose that goes into the pump, I also took out the drain plug next to it (didn't see any strainer as mentioned in the manual).

So I started it back up and noted the alignment looked great now. Also didn't see any fluid leaking from the pump. Great! Or not. Tried the hydros and nothing. nadda. Not knowing where to start I took the pump off and could tell everything was still turning as expected, couldn't see any issues.

Wanted to test if there was pressure coming out of the pump, so we actually unhooked a hose just upstream of the pressure side of the pump and went behind a blast shied to just crank it and see (kidding). What happened next confused me. The fluid didn't seem to come out with high pressure, but rather hydraulic fluid came out of the air hole at the top of the loader/reservoir, the non pressure side. I have NO clue what that means but maybe it means something to someone else.

Not sure where to go next. I'd say pump for sure if it had not been working days earlier (but before it was taken apart and inspected), and the fact that I only got 2.5 gallons in, and that strange pressure relief in the reservoir when the pressure side was open. Any ideas are much appreciated! Thanks! I can post pics if any are needed.

Start by verifying the pump is actually pumping:
  • [*:5c427f5968] Disconnect the suction and pressure lines from the loader[*:5c427f5968]Place the suction line in a 5 gallon bucket filled with clean hydraulic oil.[*:5c427f5968]Hold the pressure line over the bucket and have an assistant start the tractor[/list:eek::5c427f5968]You should get a steady stream of oil out of the pump and back into the bucket. That said from your description sounds like it is time for a new pump. A new gear pump will run you about $125.

    TOH
 
I'm guessing the tome for a new pump assessment is correct. Strangest thing, I did just what you mentioned and it was blowing bubbles into the reservoir bucket. I also stuck the output/pressure side in a bucket (noting that nothing was coming out of it), just to make sure it wasn't sucking air, but nothing, no activity at all on that side. Almost like the input side was still sucking up some but yet expelling air (thus must be ingesting air somewhere). Has to be the pump?

That being said any pumps I've found are in the $300 range. If anyone knows of something cheaper please by all means pass on! The current one is a CCW rotation (if you were holding the pump in your hand and looking at the shaft/from the tractor side), it's 13GPM @ 2000RPM and had a 3/4" drive shaft. Thanks again!
 
Sounds like you have the suction and pressure side hook up back wards or the suction line is plugged up big time
 
(quoted from post at 18:50:09 07/19/15) I'm guessing the tome for a new pump assessment is correct. Strangest thing, I did just what you mentioned and it was blowing bubbles into the reservoir bucket. I also stuck the output/pressure side in a bucket (noting that nothing was coming out of it), just to make sure it wasn't sucking air, but nothing, no activity at all on that side. Almost like the input side was still sucking up some but yet expelling air (thus must be ingesting air somewhere). Has to be the pump?

That being said any pumps I've found are in the $300 range. If anyone knows of something cheaper please by all means pass on! The current one is a CCW rotation (if you were holding the pump in your hand and looking at the shaft/from the tractor side), it's 13GPM @ 2000RPM and had a 3/4" drive shaft. Thanks again!

I know this is 2yrs old now, but what pump did you end up going with? Model # ect? I'm in the same boat but with an 8N..

Thanks
 

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