Bit the Bullet

Tall T

Well-known Member
Well I just bought the MF 59 Brush Hog.
Asked him for $200 taxes included and he said OK. The shafting is complete and they'll throw in a guard.

Don't worry, I'll post photos when I get it home and pay attention to all your voices of experience. I have an ORC.

I almost missed it. The Tractor Supply selling it, sent it 100 miles south to their outlet near me but then couldn't reach me by phone. Somehow I had turned the ringer off on my phone. DOH!

mvphoto18203.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 15:16:15 03/27/15)
You said you have an ORC but, does it have a stump jumper on it?

Now it begins :)

I didn't think to ask that with the other list of things I asked him.
He said the PO was using it until the day he traded up with them.
Are stump jumpers an add-on part?
Are they an absolute necessity or just strongly advisable?

I'll have to put stakes and flagging tape on any stumps after a walk-around.

Thanks,
T
 

64,

I'm hoping all I'll have to do is welding reinforcement and front and rear shields.
 
A stump jumper is a round or oval disc shaped blade carrier that 'helps' the bladed override 'some'
obstructions. Mind you the blades will have encountered said obstruction first and even if it does go over
it, it will still sound like a plane crash.

Some mowers just have a blade carrier bar. Still get the plane crash sound, and ... either way, have good
drive line protection.

PS, the rear angled sides look to have had the guards cut back, that thing is gonna be a rock hurler...
 

Lisa,
Thanks.
I've never seen them for under $800. around here; albeit, much newer [i:f55ca803b8]used[/i:f55ca803b8]. My thinking is that the dealership was just wanting to recoup what they gave the PO in trade as is often the case with trade-ins.
They are the major tractor & implement dealership around here with an outlet way up in Courtenay and just over the water in Duncan (both on Vancouver Island) and they sound like good people.
http://www.islandtractors.com/

Sound,

I have seen jumpers in videos but thanks for adding to my knowledge; i.e., that the blades are still going to whack the stump before climbing over it.

What do you think of the rear guard style where short heavy chain pieces are welded all across the rear -- making sure they are just long enough so that in reverse the chains themselves can't get hit by the blade?

Thanks,
Terry
 
(quoted from post at 15:37:26 03/27/15)
(quoted from post at 15:16:15 03/27/15)
You said you have an ORC but, does it have a stump jumper on it?

Now it begins :)

I didn't think to ask that with the other list of things I asked him.
He said the PO was using it until the day he traded up with them.
Are stump jumpers an add-on part?
Are they an absolute necessity or just strongly advisable?

I'll have to put stakes and flagging tape on any stumps after a walk-around.

Thanks,
T

Stump jumpers are usually an add on part or you pay a little extra when purchasing a mower.

The first drawing below shows the typical blade bar with the blades on it. If you run over a rock or a stump the blades will spin out of the way but the blade bar will take a heck of a jolt which is not good at all for the bearings and seals in your gear box.

In the second pic you see the stump jumper that I purchased for my Woods M5 mower. You can see the brackets that hold it onto the blade bar. If you hit a stump or rock, it's much better to have that stump jumper on it as the outer bent up flange you see will cause the mower to jump up over the object.

You can run without a stump jumper if you know the area you're mowing and you know it's clear of things like stumps or rocks or anything else that might be hiding in the weeds. But it is a very good idea to have one.

F-blades3.jpg


StumpJumper.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 16:18:24 03/27/15)
Lisa,
Thanks.
I've never seen them for under $800. around here; albeit, much newer [i:2836d81b0a]used[/i:2836d81b0a]. My thinking is that the dealership was just wanting to recoup what they gave the PO in trade as is often the case with trade-ins.
They are the major tractor & implement dealership around here with an outlet way up in Courtenay and just over the water in Duncan (both on Vancouver Island) and they sound like good people.
http://www.islandtractors.com/

Sound,

[b:2836d81b0a][color=red:2836d81b0a]I have seen jumpers in videos but thanks for adding to my knowledge; i.e., that the blades are still going to whack the stump before climbing over it.[/color:2836d81b0a] [/b:2836d81b0a]

What do you think of the rear guard style where short heavy chain pieces are welded all across the rear -- making sure they are just long enough so that in reverse the chains themselves can't get hit by the blade?

Thanks,
Terry

Yes, the blades are still going to hit an object even with a stump jumper on it. Since the blades are free wheeling they will swing out of the way. But that blade bar is solidly connected to your gear box shaft and it doesn't swing out of the way. It takes a heck of a jolt when it hits something.

You can buy a new set of blades for around $50 but what do you think it costs when you have to start replacing parts in your gear box?
 
You wrote:
Yes, the blades are still going to hit an object even with a stump jumper on it. Since the blades are free wheeling they will swing out of the way. But that blade bar is solidly connected to your gear box shaft and it doesn't swing out of the way. It takes a heck of a jolt when it hits something.

You can buy a new set of blades for around $50 but what do you think it costs when you have to start replacing parts in your gear box?

Cary,
Sorry, I should have said the blade BAR not the blades.
When you said that the blade bar whacking an immovable object can damage the gearbox, for a sec I thought you meant the tractor transmission!
A sobering thought indeed.

I'll have to keep reminding myself that just because a tractor and it's implements are [b:ca3fa00aef]tough[/b:ca3fa00aef], doesn't mean one can be [b:ca3fa00aef]rough[/b:ca3fa00aef] with them.

I just came in from some tractor work and got myself in a fix in the process. I was between a big cedar and the ditch and because of the muddiness trying to back slightly up hill and out, I kept sliding till I was so close to the ditch edge that any more attempts would have been seriously dangerous. So it was shut her down and "don't do anything stupid" time.

What I did was drag out my 2 ton Chain come-a-long and dragged the nose of the tractor ahead and upward until I had safe ground under the right rear and could get out of there by going forward. Whew!

Thanks,
Terry
 
I'm amazed, you learn something new everyday. After 25 years of running my Woods I just found out about these. I guess I've been lucky.
 
We talked before about that tail wheel being no adjustable and with the mower apparently sitting on the ground but I think you had the same thoughts as mine in that those two collars on the shaft were the only means of adjustment. Seems like you could get a good welder to weld on an extension on that shaft so the wheel would give some adjustment to the rear of the mower.

I don't remember if your tractor has position control on it but you could get a set of height limiter chains to keep the mower at a desired height. The previous idiot owner of my mower jury rigged a non adjustable tail on my mower. It touches the ground if the mower is like one inch above the ground. So, I run it with limiter chains and the wheel actually never touches the ground unless I run over a slight gully where the tractors rear tires dip down or I start up an incline enough to lower the back end of the mower.

You'll get used to how to use it and I hope it works well for you.
 
(quoted from post at 19:34:08 03/27/15) I'm amazed, you learn something new everyday. After 25 years of running my Woods I just found out about these. I guess I've been lucky.

reddogge,

Reading your post I don't quite know what you mean by "these". You could be being sarcastic or serious. Yes one can run a woods brush hog for twenty five years without a stump jumper on it. It all depends on what kind of terrain you use it on. Woods mowers are very well made and pretty rugged.

My Woods mower has a slip clutch on it which helps when you hit an immoveable object while mowing. Some mowers just have a low grade shear bolt in the shaft. These things help some but won't help as much as a stump jumper.

Tall T mentioned damaging his tractors transmission if hitting a stump with his mower, well it won't damage your transmission as much as it might damage your PTO shaft such as twisting it.

A stump jumper, shear bolt and a slip clutch are all good things to have.

One more thing. A lot of slip clutches could be frozen up if not maintained as mine was when I got the mower. If they get rusted up and frozen they are no longer doing the job the were designed for. So, if you have a slip clutch you should check to see if it's still working. I had to reface mine and put new discs in it to get it backing working again.
 
(quoted from post at 19:29:08 03/27/15) You wrote:
Yes, the blades are still going to hit an object even with a stump jumper on it. Since the blades are free wheeling they will swing out of the way. But that blade bar is solidly connected to your gear box shaft and it doesn't swing out of the way. It takes a heck of a jolt when it hits something.

You can buy a new set of blades for around $50 but what do you think it costs when you have to start replacing parts in your gear box?

Cary,
Sorry, I should have said the blade BAR not the blades.
When you said that the blade bar whacking an immovable object can damage the gearbox, for a sec I thought you meant the tractor transmission!
A sobering thought indeed.

I'll have to keep reminding myself that just because a tractor and it's implements are [b:47a5d2d77f]tough[/b:47a5d2d77f], doesn't mean one can be [b:47a5d2d77f]rough[/b:47a5d2d77f] with them.

I just came in from some tractor work and got myself in a fix in the process. I was between a big cedar and the ditch and because of the muddiness trying to back slightly up hill and out, I kept sliding till I was so close to the ditch edge that any more attempts would have been seriously dangerous. So it was shut her down and "don't do anything stupid" time.

What I did was drag out my 2 ton Chain come-a-long and dragged the nose of the tractor ahead and upward until I had safe ground under the right rear and could get out of there by going forward. Whew!

Thanks,
Terry

Good on you for using your head and taking the safe way out of a situation. I'm sure there are a lot of people that wish they had given a little more thought before doing something.
 

I remember about the tail wheel. I'm a good enough arc welder to make that right.

I have Position Control (Jube).
I'm still wondering why the other rotary cutters I've seen all seem to have rigid struts from the center of the deck to the top link but this one has these two short chains. I presume they are to allow the deck to lift higher than it is being lifted by the wheel.

Could it be that those short chains are a type of stump jumper
because they allow the deck to "give" in an upward direction.

Thanks,
Terry
mvphoto18219.jpg
 
Yes, they will allow the mower to rise when it hits something solid. But make no mistake they don't take the place of a stump jumper.

If you have a blade bar and blades as in my drawing that blade bar is still slamming into something solid. Those chains don't really help your mowers gear box and bearings.

Below is a picture of the sliding top link I run with my mower. It will allow the mower to jump up a foot or two if the need arises. Still doesn't eliminamte the need for a stump jumper.

SlidingTopLink.jpg
 

Very interesting!

One thing(s) still unclear . . .
You mentioned height limiter chains . . . that would be the limit the deck is allowed to hang down at the tail and your deck is suspended by those chains ?
So in the event of your deck being forced upward, the chains go slack AND the top link retracts?

Which two points do the limiter chains connect to?

T
 
(quoted from post at 21:13:11 03/27/15)
Very interesting!

One thing(s) still unclear . . .
You mentioned height limiter chains . . . that would be the limit the deck is allowed to hang down at the tail and your deck is suspended by those chains ?
So in the event of your deck being forced upward, the chains go slack AND the top link retracts?

Which two points do the limiter chains connect to?

T

The limiter chains limit the height of the front of the mower to what ever height you have them set for. The bottom brackets of the chains go onto the same pins your lift arms connect to on the mower. Most people connect the top brackets of the chains to the long pin that goes through the 3 hole rocker. That's the same pin that your top link connects to. I have my top brackets of the chains bolted to the two big lugs on the rear end below the three hole rocker. I think it's better that way since it takes some of the strain off the three hole rocker.

If I have time tomorrow, I'll take a pic of the set up. If you don't have a sliding top like I do the back of the mowers height is set by your adjustable top link. Normally you will want the back of the mower a little higher than the front of the mower. This is so your blades are not trying to double cut. The front of the mower does the cutting.

With the limiter chains set you can lower your quadrant lever all the way. The mower is hanging on the limiter chains and the hydraulics don't need to work to hold it up.
 
You wrote:
"The limiter chains limit the height of the front of the mower to what ever height you have them set for. The bottom brackets of the chains go onto the same pins your lift arms connect to on the mower."

That solves my confusion......
I thought that Position Control governed the front height.

"I have my top brackets of the chains bolted to the two big lugs on the rear end below the three hole rocker. I think it's better that way since it takes some of the strain off the three hole rocker."

O.K.

"If I have time tomorrow, I'll take a pic of the set up. If you don't have a sliding top like I do the back of the mowers height is set by your adjustable top link."

I have several slotted and bolted together bars that came with the tractor, one of which I could turn into a sliding link bar like yours.
Perhaps the adjustable bars I have are the perfect equivalent of the limiter chains. Maybe that's what they are for. (?)

"Normally you will want the back of the mower a little higher than the front of the mower. This is so your blades are not trying to double cut. The front of the mower does the cutting."

Yep . . . that point sunk in a while back but a good reminder.

"With the limiter chains set you can lower your quadrant lever all the way. The mower is hanging on the limiter chains and the hydraulics don't need to work to hold it up."

Ah so! The mystery of the limiter chains resolved. I could make some up. My slow leak-down wouldn't be forcing all the continual and jerky auto Position Control correction, saving wear and tear.

Picture of your chain setup would be helpful.

Thanks for the generous help.
Terry

mvphoto18222.jpg
 
Nice score for $200!
I never use limiter chains. Haven't since I got position control.
My tail wheel is adjustable so I have it adjusted to it's highest setting.
Then I just carry the front half of the mower on my lift arms and the tail wheel carries the back half. Adjust the height of cut with a combination of the top link and lift arms. You want the mower set lower in the front. I like the idea of chains and not solid rods from the A frame to the rear of the mower. Mine are solid. I mow a lot of hills and valleys and in one area where it is rolling you can get "stuck" down in the valley because all the weight is on the front tires and the tail wheel - no traction. Chains from the A frame to the rear of the mower would prevent that but you want to make sure your driveline is not too long or you'll drive the pto shaft into the tractor.
Shredding is probably the least enjoyable thing I do with my tractor but it's what I do the most of. It used to be worse when I first got a tractor and shredder and didn't know where the rocks, ant hills and stumps were. Broke a lot of shear bolts on my King Kutter. Now I pretty much have everything mapped out in my head and it doesn't sound like the sinking of the Yamato back there. (And any rocks have already been turned to dust)
The mower I have now has a slip clutch which helps too.
 
Jerry,

You wrote:
"Nice score for $200!
I never use limiter chains. Haven't since I got position control.
My tail wheel is adjustable so I have it adjusted to it's highest setting."

Thanks. Does that mean that even with minimal and repeated leak-down correction, the lift arm front support of the mower won't really impose any significant, above normal stress and strain on my hydraulics? How high would you say your blade ends up being at the rear?

"Adjust the height of cut with a combination of the top link and lift arms. You want the mower set lower in the front."

Is it all right for the front skids to be riding on the ground for the shortest cut, or is it preferable to have the front always higher than that?

"I like the idea of chains and not solid rods from the A frame to the rear of the mower. Mine are solid."

Do you mean like how mine has the two short lengths of chain to the gearbox -- when you refer to the "rear" of the mower?

"I mow a lot of hills and valleys and in one area where it is rolling you can get "stuck" down in the valley because all the weight is on the front tires and the tail wheel - no traction. Chains from the A frame to the rear of the mower would prevent that but you want to make sure your driveline is not too long or you'll drive the pto shaft into the tractor."

Not sure what you mean by that worse case scenario; i.e, how would one have the driveline "too long"?

"Shredding is probably the least enjoyable thing I do with my tractor but it's what I do the most of. It used to be worse when I first got a tractor and shredder and didn't know where the rocks, ant hills and stumps were. Broke a lot of shear bolts on my King Kutter. Now I pretty much have everything mapped out in my head and it doesn't sound like the sinking of the Yamato back there. (And any rocks have already been turned to dust) The mower I have now has a slip clutch which helps too."

King Kutter . . . NICE!
. . . or the sinking of the poor S.S. Liberty! The truth about that non-investigated massacre is shocking!
What do you mean by "shredding" cause you've got me picturing wood chippers?

Thanks for the handy pocket guide to Brush Hogging. :)

Terry
 
In pic A you see the top limiter chain bracket, you see how you can set the chain for any height you want.

In pic B you see where I have my limiter chains hooked at the top.

In pic C you see where the bottom of the limiter chains hook up.

In pic D you see the right stabilizer bar where the arrow points

In pic E you see the height of my mower when it's just hanging on the limiter chains. This is generally the height I mow at. The position control does not have to work to hold the mower up. The mower is actually about 4" above the ground.

In pic F you see the adjustable stabilizer bar I have on the left side. The two curved arrows show where you would hook up the stay bars you have. Those are the third, forth, fifth, sixth, and seventh adjustable bars from the left in your pic. They are used with the draw bars you have on the right side of your pic.

The two bars you have on the left side of your pic are stabilizer bars to keep your mower from swinging left or right.

You can see that I don't have the sliding top link on my mower right now. That's because I know my property and keep it mowed so I know there are no surprises under the weeds. If I mow someone elses property, I'll use the sliding top link.

Hope this clears up some things for you.

DSC03617_zpshd9e20hz.jpg

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DSC03619_zpswoto2uzv.jpg

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Cary,

[b:964956e488]That's great; THANKS![/b:964956e488]
About those upper connect points for your chains . . .
I'm wondering why on mine, the left hole is much larger than the hole on the tractor's right. That end of my top link with the pin chain, now stays at the implement end, not at the tractor end like here.

mvphoto18228.jpg


Thanks for setting me straight on those sliding sway bars.
I already have a pretty nice custom setup for sway on mine (they've got balls :)
but I can see where the adjustable ones could take the side play of the implement to a minimum.

mvphoto18229.jpg


The implement end. No, I'm not using that keeper THERE anymore. :)

mvphoto18230.jpg
 

About the adjustable stabilizer I have on the left side: When hooking up any implement it's always easier to put on the non adjustable stabilizer bar then put on the adjustable one. Sometimes when things are a little stubborn and you're doing it by yourself and the holes don't want to line up, you just adjust the adjustable one to where it hooks up easy. Then you can use the adjustable one to center your implement if needed. It just makes things a lot easier.
 
As for leak down, well, ahem, I have a bad habit of fixing things like that.
Top cover gasket and Oring set aint but $15 or so from this site. Put a new cam follower pin in it too.
I don't cut too close to the ground. Rear end is maybe 7" high. Front about 5".
The skids on the front of the mower gouge into the grass so I try not to let them hit the ground.

My A frame bars go to the rear of the mower deck. They are a pair of 1/4" X2" angle irons.

bushhogcover.jpg


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100_12991_zpsbe953e98.jpg


If a guy put chains instead of solid bars it would allow the mower to jack knife upwards in the bottom of the valley or ditch.
But... When it jack knifes the drive shaft gets shorter.
Put the mower on and hook the drive shaft up. Now take a highlift jack and lift the rear end of the mower a foot or 18". Watch what the drive shaft does - it gets shorter.
Too long of a driveshaft and you will damage your pto/tractor.

Yeah the Liberty was a sad affair. Especially since it was hit by our "friends".
Harumph!
But consider that Yamato took something like 11 torpedos and 6 bomb hits before she went down. A lot more noise than the Liberty if you know what I mean.
 

Ultradog is correct about the drive shaft. The main reason some of them start to get short is putting on an ORC.

Of course you need an ORC but do take a look at the length or your drive shaft after you install your ORC.
 
UD,
[b:694d33edaf]KIng of the cutters for sure![/b:694d33edaf]
What a beaut, nice color too!

I am planning to do the piston & pin, but like the wise man said,
"Never put off till tomorrow what you can do the day after."

I see what you are saying about making sure the shaft has enough telescoping length available to keep end force off the PTO shaft.

Thanks for everything,
T
 

Thanks and will make myself a check list of this critical info . . .
kind of like making sure my compressor tanks are purged of water before spray painting. :)

Cheers,
T
 
can I quote you on that? :D

Cary,

I'm just hoping nothing like a binding shaft or whatever
happened to this tractor. So I figured I'd better get a low priced cutter to test the PTO shaft and seal. Kind of oily back down there but it only weeps while spinning I figure cause my gear lube never weeps out. It does spin nice and smoothly and quietly . . . under load as well ? . . . well I hope.

Thanks again for the complete tutorial and all good advice here
and simplifying the process
of learning how to run a brush hog properly
and living to tell the tale.
:D

Terry
 

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