side mount points

Dukesguy

New User
I am looking for a spare set of points for my '52 8N. 6V. Who makes a high quality set, and do you know a part number. All new tune up kit last year, but I should have a spare handy.
 
Your local O'Reilley's auto parts store might have them under the BWD brand,which I have on my tractor replacing NH points which lasted a while. Ecklin and Standard are excellent also. If you could find Sorensen brand,those are the best,but would be NOS. lha
 
i like the echlin points. here's some other general #'s

Side-Mount Distributor: 8n thru 4 cyl thousand series

gap points to .025

Points:
NAPA #CS749
NAPA HEAVY DUTY PIERCED (ventilated) #CS753
Standard Ignition #FD-8081
Standard Ignition Blue Streak #FD-8081X (Premium)
Condensor:
NAPA #FA66
Standard Ignition #FD-75
Standard Ignition Blue Streak #FD75X (Premium)
Rotor:
NAPA #FA67
Standard Ignition #FD-108
Distributor Cap:
NAPA #FA352
Standard Ignition #FD-128

side mount points hold down screws #8-32 X 3/16
FORD AUTOMOBILE dealer parts counter. come with built-in lockwasher. p/n 355047-S7 (#8-32 X 0.19)

All 4 cyl models can use AL-437 or champion H12 spark plugs instead of OEM Champion H10 or AL 216 plugs.
 
For around $100 you can put electronic ignition in it and never have to worry about it again. You'll get better power and better fuel economy as well.
 
I've never been around an 8n that needed new points every year. I haven't changed mine in ten years. I bought the kit from TSC.

I really don't think electronic will improve your fuel usage. Electronic can burn out at anytime. Dad put one in his 67 Ford. it didn't last as long as a set of points.
 
defend that better power claim?

is the spark hotter too?

( will it help regrow hair also? that would be a bonus! )
 
" I've never been around an 8n that needed new points every year."

That's because you've never had one w/ bad bushings.

See tip # 68.

Many folks put a cussin' on points, or can't get a .015 gap on new points because of worn out bushings.

The pic is one of my front distributors w/ new bushings & Echlin points; the gap is opened to .030 just to show what new bushings & quality parts will get you.
IMG_20140318_115126_613_zpsee7bdda8.jpg

75 Tips
 
" You'll get better power and better fuel economy as well."

Got any specifics data on that claim as it pertains to an 8N tractor?

Like soundguy, I'd be happy to see them.

10% more power? Or more? How much more mileage?

IMHO:

--- Putting EI on a N series tractor will replace the points. Any other "advantages" will be miniscule.

---- If you have a well running tractor & just don't care to fool w/ points anymore, EI is a perfect alternative.

---- If you expect EI to cure any significant ignition problem you may have other than bad points, it won't.
75 Tips
 
I cant give you exact voltages but I know the spark is much hotter. Everything I have been around with it will start without the choke in IL January with a -20 wind chill. Gas engines all went that way back in thr 70's for a reason. I know it does better on power just from the amount of tractor pullers i know that have done it. As far as regrowing hair goes if I find something for $100 that will take care of that and make my tractor run better I think ill retire from the profits.
 
" I cant give you exact voltages but I know the spark is much hotter"

Hmmmmmm.......

Now that's something. EI increases spark voltage.

So it replaces the coil?

" Gas engines all went that way back in thr 70's for a reason."

Yep. Actually a bunch of reasons....none that apply to a 60+ year old tractor though.

" I know it does better on power just from the amount of tractor pullers i know that have done it.'

And what else have those tractor pullers done to those engines other than EI? I don't think we have a problem on 8N's w/ point bounce at high RPM's.......

EI does not give you higher spark voltage, eliminate all maintenance on your ignition system or give enough of a horsepower boost to cause the tractor to do wheelies. It replaces the points. That’s it. It will not correct or overcome other major problems in the ignition system. While it may give you more HP or improve fuel economy, both would be so insignificant as to be hardly noticeable on a 23 hp engine. As the analogy goes, putting EI on a 60+ year old tractor is like putting 12” woofers on your grandfathers 78 rpm Victrola and expecting it to sound like surround sound.

If you can’t set points or don’t care to do it, or you don’t want to spend the 30 minutes or so a year to check the gap & lube the cam, then you will be happy w/ EI. And, the EI unit itself will be maintenance free. (but the rest of the ignition system won’t)

Now, if EI will replace Viagra, we could all retire.
 
Well said.
If you haven't already you'll soon find that they mosstly hate EI here. So choose your praise for it very carefully.
One thing you can say though is: ei will give you as good of spark as a brand new set of properly adjusted points and will continue to do so indefinitely.
That alone should be enough to convince a man that ei is worth the dough to convert.
But some would still rather fuss with points.

Ps
You will also find that for many topics opinions are acceptable here.
As examples, mineral oil vs 134D vs 90 wt, or 6V vs 12V, Goodyear tires vs Firestones or Generals, liquid ballast vs cast iron, rattle can vs brush vs spray gun, standard pan seat vs Rest O Ride, 9N vs 2N, 5' finish mower vs 6',
1 1/8" pto vs 1 3/8", 10w30 vs 15w40, sway bars vs no sway bars
In all the examples above and on many others, one's opinion and experience will suffice.
But when it comes to whether EI seems to give better performance than points, opinions count for nothing and only the highest scientific research will suffice..
 
the only issue with making claims about EI, is they need to be correct. ;)

Plenty hop on the 'hotter spark' bandwagon without understanding the physics behind what determines spark potential, and what needs to happen for it to truly increase!
 
Tractors do not care about wind chill temperatures. Wind chill is for human skin.

I thought about changing to EI on my 8N 6V because I keep forgetting to turn off the switch and I burn up coils! Would EI fix my forgetfulness?
 
I cant give you exact voltages but I know the spark is much hotter. Everything I have been around with it will start without the choke in IL January with a -20 wind chill. Gas engines all went that way back in thr 70's for a reason. I know it does better on power just from the amount of tractor pullers i know that have done it. As far as regrowing hair goes if I find something for $100 that will take care of that and make my tractor run better I think ill retire from the profits.
 
so far you've typed that in with -0- to backup the hotter sparky comment.

I guarantee you just popping in an ei does not up the potential at the arc gap, given no other variable changes.

lots of people parrot that ei does this or that. yet can't actually explain why or backup those claims. :)
 
" Would EI fix my forgetfulness? "

Some units have a cut-off feature, but most don't. So, instead of burning up a $35 coil, you burn up a $100 module. Check w/ the manufacturer.

Same thing w/ 6v.....most units will not operate below 4.5 volts. Get a cold day, weak battery or dragging starter.....you don't get a weak spark like w/ points, you get no spark at all w/ EI. Again, check w/ the manufacturer.
75 Tips
 
(quoted from post at 12:26:23 11/01/14) I am looking for a spare set of points for my '52 8N. 6V. Who makes a high quality set, and do you know a part number. All new tune up kit last year, but I should have a spare handy.

The guys have given you the numbers,
I'd like to add for other readers, that when you change your points, save the old ones for back-ups.
In most cases today, the old ones you take out are far superior, quality wise, to the new ones.

I like reading the EI-points debate. fun
I run both/either/whatever here so it doesn't matter to me.
EI is better of course, because of the absolute, repeatability, no variance, in the spark event. (same spark naturally)
Like said, after their first spin, points are wearing = variance possible or a change in the time of the spark event = inefficiency.
An engine is capable physically of X amount of power.
After you get to the max, eliminating variance/inefficiencies, to keep it at X is the goal.
(drag racing in a tight rules class or in a run-what-you-brung
ET class showed me the importance of repeatability/no variance)
So the argument shouldn't be that EI makes more power, it's that points make less after that first turn of the engine.
 
Bruce,

While it is incorrect to think that EI makes a spark hotter or higher voltage, doesn't EI make a spark "longer?" That would explain why (to me) that there is some improvement in starting and fuel economy/power. The combustion mixture has a chance to more completely combust.

Jim
 
Yes.

When you have more energy out of the coil, you have a longer duration spark which allows you to open the plug gap wider. That's what soundguy was talking about. So, a "larger & longer" spark does indeed give you more power.

That being said.....

It's application on a 23 hp engine would be like, as I said, putting 12" woofers on the 78 rpm Victrola.
 
So a guy shouldn't bother trying to increase the efficiency of his tractor because it's only an old, 23hp engine?
Maybe you didn't know that most increases in efficiency and longevity have been incremental.
There were a couple of big leaps forward over the years. One was EI and another was fuel injection.
But most were small, plodding improvements.
As for your talk about Victrolas, I wonder if you still use one.
Since they are of the same era as points, generators and mechanical Vregs which you so doggedly advocate.
 
You will also find that for many topics opinions are acceptable here.
As examples, mineral oil vs 134D vs 90 wt, or 6V vs 12V, Goodyear tires vs Firestones or Generals, liquid ballast vs cast iron, rattle can vs brush vs spray gun, standard pan seat vs Rest O Ride, 9N vs 2N, 5' finish mower vs 6',
1 1/8" pto vs 1 3/8", 10w30 vs 15w40, sway bars vs no sway bars
In all the examples above and on many others, one's opinion and experience will suffice.
But when it comes to whether EI seems to give better performance than points, opinions count for nothing and only the highest scientific research will suffice..
And don't even bring up the ACC or Big Ten! :D
 

Liar Liar pants on fire.... But as you say believe it are not A cold engine doped up on EI sure-nuff starts and runs better... Its magic :wink:

I think I will run to town and get me a biscuit... Its cold out this morn I will hit the starter not touch the gas it will fire up i will drop it in gear and haul arse... I luv EI and fuel injection 8) Magic is good....

Possible answers are..

1)Electronic Current Limiting.
2) Automatic dwell control.
3) Energy available throughout the spark duration....
 

Yep, the ballast resistor served the same function......more current for a better spark on a cold engine.

Cold here as well; I can deal w/ the 43*, but not 43* w/ a 25 mph wind.

Got the corn meal out; cornbread & beans today.

I'm going to town to buy an aerodynamic spoiler for my 8N. All the race cars use them. I'm sure it will improve the performance of my 8N. :twisted:
 
(quoted from post at 11:27:58 11/02/14)

I'm going to town to buy an aerodynamic spoiler for my 8N. All the race cars use them. I'm sure it will improve the performance of my 8N. :twisted:

That's about the only upgrade Jack McDevitt forgot.....

TOH

Kitchen012.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 19:27:58 11/02/14)
Yep, the ballast resistor served the same function......more current for a better spark on a cold engine.

Cold here as well; I can deal w/ the 43*, but not 43* w/ a 25 mph wind.

Got the corn meal out; cornbread & beans today.

I'm going to town to buy an aerodynamic spoiler for my 8N. All the race cars use them. I'm sure it will improve the performance of my 8N. :twisted:

EI is Automatic magic....

Which brings up the rest of the system were Automatic-magic comes into play.... Its hard to get away from the fact EI reduces maintenance, that equals a engine that stays in tune over the life span of the rest of the system.... No other excuse needed...

From the first spark its all down hill with points... That includes the spark plugs Too...
 

Yep.

And when the time comes that I'm tired of annual points maintenance, or I can't find quality points, I'll install EI.

But until then, checking the gap & lubing the cam is just like changing oil & greasing it.

And because I like cheap beer, that $100 I didn't spend on EI will keep me drinking for a while. :wink:
 
It was worth posting somthing that I didn't know would be this
contriversial just for that pic. I still like EI and I drink keystone. Cheap beer and EI arent exclusive from each other.;-)
 
(quoted from post at 16:10:25 11/02/14) It was worth posting somthing that I didn't know would be this
contriversial just for that pic. I still like EI and I drink keystone. Cheap beer and EI arent exclusive from each other.;-)

Jack contacted me about a gear reduction final drive when he first started the project. I thought he was just a guy wanting to 'tinker" and had no idea how much money or how far he was going to go building that beast....

TOH
 
Jack contacted me about a gear reduction final drive when he first started the project. I thought he was just a guy wanting to 'tinker" and had no idea how much money or how far he was going to go building that beast....

TOH
Was he just going for all the options he could get?
Looks like a Sherman lever plus all the obvious changes.
I'm guessin' it never will but I'd love to see that thing push snow!
 
(quoted from post at 17:38:27 11/02/14)
Jack contacted me about a gear reduction final drive when he first started the project. I thought he was just a guy wanting to 'tinker" and had no idea how much money or how far he was going to go building that beast....

TOH
Was he just going for all the options he could get?
Looks like a Sherman lever plus all the obvious changes.
I'm guessin' it never will but I'd love to see that thing push snow!

I believe he was trying to max out on options. In addition to the Shernman he was going to put a gear reduction in the rear until he discovered the 4WD takeoff ate up all the available real estate ;-) I would be surprised if it hasn't already pushed snow as part of a parking lot promo at one of his trucking businesses in NH.

[u:a5f863510f]McDevitt Trcks[/u:a5f863510f]

If you watch the slideshow you will see some other interesting things in the background

TOH
 
(quoted from post at 19:27:58 11/02/14)
Yep, the ballast resistor served the same function......more current for a better spark on a cold engine.

Cold here as well; I can deal w/ the 43*, but not 43* w/ a 25 mph wind.

Got the corn meal out; cornbread & beans today.

I'm going to town to buy an aerodynamic spoiler for my 8N. All the race cars use them. I'm sure it will improve the performance of my 8N. :twisted:

Well if you say so but its not the same thang...

Auto dwell maintains proper timing advance by varying the dwell period in relation to engine speed tho not a biggie on a engine with a low speed governor....

Current limiting... When the ignition coil reaches full saturation the switching action of the current regulating circuit within the ignition module limits current flow until the power transistor turns off the primary current...

Why EI is a noticeable difference...

Points system, When the capactive portion of a spark plug fires it ignites some molecules then in turn ignite others and this continues until combustion is complete ... Cross yer fingers... And click your heals...

EI advantage, It is possible for combustion to stop with much of the air fuel mixture unburned. EI can sustaine the spark for the entire duration of combustion...

Is it more fire I dunno in some applications it is... I do know it will keep the match lite longer and more noticeable on a cold engine...

I have never had issues with points on a side mount. It did not matter if they were a cheap seat are a expensive set... Front mounts are the demon's... The only time I have had to fudge with side mount points is if I decided to give my baby a bath moisture is there enemy they can not tolerate it and I don't think price is the issue...
 

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