Oil pump rebuilding service??

OK, I had a problem with my rebuilt oil pump on my rebuilt mtr, which loses prime after sitting.
Background can be found here.
http://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=nboard&th=926322

Anyway, I sent it off to a guy well known in the 8N community (please don't ask who, I don't want a pissing contest) for repair because he has a method of bench testing it.
The good news is he confirmed the the pump has great pressure and volume but loses prime after sitting overnight.
He did check the pickup tube for leaks and regasketed it before testing.

The bad news is he had it 2 months, many emails and phone calls later and he never repaired it, or attempted to repair it, or figured out what the problem was.
So I had it returned.

To the question, is there a professional shop I can send it to that can repair it, or at least determine if it is repairable that has a method of testing it and a reasonable turn around time?



thanks!

Trouble is, if it has had new gears and a new bushing installed already, there's really not anything (practical) that can be done with it.

The housings wear, increasing the distance between the tips of the teeth of even new gears and the housing, decreasing "suction" needed to prime at startup and there's no way to correct that, short of being able to precision bore the housing oversize and fit custom oversized gears, which I've never heard of anyone doing.

You may simply need to replace the pump with a new one and have the block's crankshaft "line bore" checked and corrected as needed, to fit the new main cap/oil pomp.

Yeah, that is why I want to make sure the pump is unusable before I tear that rebuilt motor completely down to have a new pump housing/bearing cap line bored.

This may sound silly,but did you replace the bearing shells when installing the pump housing? It's obvious that an air leak is occurring somewhere,allowing the oil to escape and lose prime. My old '41 9n loses prime if it sits for a long time and I plan to rebuild the pump,but for now it holds prime for a long time. lha

Have you got any pics ?

My pick up tube housing/plate had grooves worn in it which would allow air/oil to pass the end of the gear . I used a 12" direct drive bench sander and a hand held hone to smooth out the plate .

My neighbor has a large mill with a small adjustable boring bit , He was able to bore the new bushings to fit my worn shafts instead of the generic 9/16 reamer . Now my pump really sucks , he he .

Guys,


I want to put it in a box, ship it and when it comes back know that it works and has been fully tested.
Or I want to be told it is unrepairable.



Thanks!

(quoted from post at 06:52:20 10/13/14) Guys,


I want to put it in a box, ship it and when it comes back know that it works and has been fully tested.
Or I want to be told it is unrepairable.



Thanks!

Click to expand...

I spent considerable discussing your problem with you on the telephone before you sent it to me and told you I was swamped with work. After getting it I spent more time disassembling it, measuring the parts, and bench testing it with the new bushing and gears you installed. The pickup tube is tight and does not leak. The bushing is nutz on size and there is no significant scoring on the end plate. I can prime it and it pumps fine on my bench test rig but let it sit for 2-3 hours and it loses prime and won't pump again. There is no visible external leakage.

I have a least half a day of my labor invested in it. I even purchased new gears for it at MY expense in order to retest it to see if the new parts would make any difference. But you became impatient and left a rude message on my telephone so I boxed it up and shipped it back to you at MY expense. The only thing you are out for that inspection and bench testing is the cost of shipping the pump to me.

I'm sorry I couldn't work any faster but I told you I was swamped BEFORE you sent me the pump and I only agreed to do it because you sounded desperate. So now you have your pump back, my public apology for wasting your valuable time, and you are back to square one with one minor difference:

[u:80994d4b2b]Based on my bench testing I think it is worn beyond repair.[/u:80994d4b2b]

What more can you possibly want?

TOH

PS> I would have replied sooner but I am so busy in the shop I haven't had a chance to check in until today :twisted:

http://www.yesterdaystractors.com/9N6603_Oil-Pump-Body_658.htm?gclid=CjwKEAjw8O2hBRDKur2lseLW6C8SJAC-r1J378XiozvBdqBj0i9i0u0OiicCqYfAErcUyeLQmiXVWBoCBznw_wcB

Dude, you've spent more time and energy trying to fix something that is $120 bucks w/ shipping. Buy a new pump housing and get on with life.

I know I couldn't live with my tractor down that long, so you've probably spent more time working harder because your tractor is still in pieces.

You just had to go there......

OK, so you had it for about 6 weeks, claimed you were going to install the new gears you ordered "tomorrow" and waited a week to receive and apparently never did.

Then never responded to my email about 1 week later (7 week mark) asking about it.

And then never responded to my call about 1 week after that email (8 week mark) asking about if the new gears were installed, what that determined and if not, please return it.

All I got was this email message.
"No. Send me a return shipping address."

No, I did not install the gears?
No, I did and it didn't help?
No, the pump is unrepairable?

And ONLY today you say,
"Based on my bench testing I think it is worn beyond repair."
Which apparently is a conclusion you have now made based on inspection and testing you did at about the 3 week mark, since you never did anything else with it in the 5 weeks since.

Well it was exhausting and time consuming, but I finally got an answer.

Thanks!

Your economic analysis doesn't include tearing down the new motor, line boring $175??, the cost and time to drive it 120 miles one way to a competent machine shop, the time and cost to retrieve it 1 week later, the time and cost to reassemble it all,

when until today, I didn't know if the housing was usable or not.

Maybe you should have had the line boring done when you brought it to the machine shop since its such a long drive. I only had to drive 60 miles to my machinest and I had him do all machine work and check line bore.... everything including rebuild the oil pump whilst it was there. Sounds like you have just as big of issues with the low op on a brand new rebuild. What good is publicly bashing a member? Is that going to fix your oil pump?

Doug, I see you have discovered the joys of owning a 60+ year-old obsolete piece of machinery, built in an unusual fashion. (Oil pumpt of the main bearing cap.)

Since you need as reliable tractor, and seem to be wound pretty tight, IMHO, you might be better off with a NEW machine, with factory warranty, and dealer support!

I think we all knew who you sent you pump to with your opening thread. His is the only setup I know of to accomplish your request.

If you can find someone else to bench test a 60 year old tractor oil pump in ANY length of time, good luck.

People get busy, people make mistakes...life moves on.

1st off, unless the oil pump is tested off the motor or you know it's history, you don't know if you need a new oil pump housing/bearing caps/block line bored.

Mine is an example of that, it has wear but has been measured to be within specs, generates good pressure and volume.
Yet will not retain prime.

2nd, I intentionally didn't name the member, and wouldn't, nor did I bash him.
But I did supply background facts about the pump that I thought was necessary.

Since I now have a definitive answer, I don't need a pump rebuilding service and so will no longer be replying to this thread.

If a mod wants to delete this topic, great!

To the question, is there a professional shop I can send it to that can repair it, or at least determine if it is repairable that has a method of testing it and a reasonable turn around time? thanks!

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Why pi$$ around with an old pump? Man, you sound like the kind of person who in their quest to save a buck spends countless hours screwing around with something. Just get a new one and move on. I did that on my 9N, slapped it in and closed it up and it's been doing fine for the last 15 years, no line boring or anything. Didn't even take off the front end. Sheesh!