Royse

Well-known Member
Thought I'd see what you guys think this noise might be.
It will not be started again until I fix it, but I took this quick
video while pulling it in the shop. YouTube
 
Really tough to tell from here of course.
I would use a stick or long screwdriver and listen with it up to your ear.
Just a swag here, partly based on your oil pressure, partly based on the sound, it's something in the top end.
Wrist pin or broken piston.
 

Have you tried pulling one wire at a time at the distributor to see which one doesn't make it run any worse?

Piston hitting a valve head?
 
Threw my back out earlier today working on a different tractor,
so I'm not doing much to this one today, but I did run a quick
compression test just for general principal.
Not impressive, but I don't see a silver bullet either.
Maybe a bit of a valve issue on #2.
Dry/Wet
1- 120/130
2 - 100/100
3 - 110/120
4 - 110/120
 
Thanks Jerry, I was thinking maybe wrist pin.
Now that I checked it, compression test should rule out a
broken piston right? OP to me said fairly good bearings too.
 
No, I didn't try doing much at all to it Terry.
It hammers so loudly I'm almost afraid to run it.
As you can see I pulled the hydraulic pump off it to eliminate that.
I didn't really think that would be it, but it was easy to eliminate.
I'll have it dismantled shortly I hope.
Them loaded tires about wiped me out today.
I know better than to try to catch one, but I did it anyway. :roll:
 
Heres food for thought. This was my 8n. It
had good op but knocked. Obviously during
the video we had our rpm higher.
Anyhow..bearings were good and original.
The rods had way too much side to side
play. 1 or 2 were a little out of round
more than the others. Its a similar sound
between the 2
Untitled URL Link
 
Guess I was a little too quick on the reply!
Second link worked fine. Does sound similar.
 
(quoted from post at 03:14:02 09/22/14) Guess I was a little too quick on the reply!
Second link worked fine. Does sound similar.

That's ok I was posting on my phone while I waited for the computer to update. And its difficult to navigate with photobucket since they changed it.
 
Lisa;
"And its difficult to navigate with photobucket since they changed it."

You got that RIGHT....Took me about 30mins, to use PB, to post a pic. the other day.
Dang twiggets, gotta always be changing things around on there!!!!!!!!!!!! :twisted:

Gary
 
The compression test ruled out my first thought. A
valve seat that fell out. bent push rod won't make
that much noise.

Had a green 620 once that broke a piston at about
the 3rd ring from the top. it really hammered. Had
no compression on one cylinder of course.
 

Right! This was the first time in awhile I have signed into there and It took me a bit to figure out how to even copy the link! Always changing stuff to confuse people.
 
"Had no compression on one cylinder of course"

That's why I thought a compression check was worth while.
It would at least point me in a general direction.
This thing really hammers, even at idle.
Not complaining about it at all, just looking for the cause.
Actually, I guess I'm just talking about the cause.
If I were "looking" I'd still be out in the shop! LOL
 
(quoted from post at 18:44:24 09/21/14) No, I didn't try doing much at all to it Terry.
It hammers so loudly I'm almost afraid to run it.
As you can see I pulled the hydraulic pump off it to eliminate that I didn't really think that would be it, but it was easy to eliminate.

Good idea but as you say, it's "hammering" and my vane pump is just a mid range rattle not a bang in keeping with the piston strokes.

Has your rocker shaft always had adequate oil?
I'm still thinking that maybe a valve spring keeper let go and the piston bent the valve but left it closed enough to not cause too great a compression loss, but cocked the valve enough for the piston to hit it. Then following stuck valve, bent push rod. (?) But I'm winging it as I have no idea of the depth of the compression chamber.

Wicked noise!
Not a fun mystery sound contest that's for sure. Poor guy!

Hope it's like my scenarios . . . always waaay less serious than I imagine.

If it is your lower back muscle that's in spasm, the pelvic lift works great to make the cramped (contracted) muscle relax.

Terry
 
(quoted from post at 22:15:45 09/21/14) "twiggets" ?
Are those the folks who haven't discovered MacNaughton's? :lol:
b:3daf934e89][i:3daf934e89]

Actually, twiggets, are a group of idiots, hired by a company, to be a think tank, on 'How to make more money', BUT only come up with ideas, that confuse the issues, of hiring a 'think tank'!!!!!
:lol: :lol: :lol: [/i:3daf934e89][/b:3daf934e89]
 
"If it is your lower back muscle that's in spasm"

I was moving around some 13.6 x 28 loaded tires first thing.
Thought I got through that Ok. Got them all back on the tractor.
Then I found a CaCl filled tire leaking on one of my other tractors.
So I figured I'd take that loose, then drain the CaCl and fix it.
When I was breaking loose the age old nuts with a breaker bar
one of those 5/8 inch bolts snapped clean off. Body's natural
reaction is to jerk back upright to keep you from falling over.
I think I would have been better off falling over. :roll:
 
Royce,
Last time I heard "tappets" sounding like that, was due to "plugged oil feed line" to tappets, causing wear on the rocker arm bushing, causing the valve clearance adjustment to be excessive.

Charles Krammin SW MI
 
good luck Royce
hope it is something minor.
had a pushrod pop out from under a rocker once. It was noisy, but the engine miss was obvious.
Another, a Ford I think, can't remember which, the oiling tube under the rocker cover broke loose and it was very noisy while the rockers were 'eating' it.
another, a valve got stuck/wedged/not allowed to close completely = huge gap. pretty loud, not as loud as yours though.
and an unknown...had a 8N with a very loud upper front whack like that when I got it. quick check narrowed it to maybe an exhaust valve problem, noise loudest at muffler outlet (not a leaky valve a solid metal whack) Got a offer and sold it before I fixed it. brave soul is still using it...as-is....couple years now. I'm still curious what it was.
hope for easy.....
 
Royse,

Did your oil pressure change at all after it happened, even slightly but noticeably?
 
(quoted from post at 23:27:08 09/21/14)
(quoted from post at 22:15:45 09/21/14) "twiggets" ?
Are those the folks who haven't discovered MacNaughton's? :lol:
b:9c3986b5a7][i:9c3986b5a7]

Actually, twiggets, are a group of idiots, hired by a company, to be a think tank, on 'How to make more money', BUT only come up with ideas, that confuse the issues, of hiring a 'think tank'!!!!!
:lol: :lol: :lol: [/i:9c3986b5a7][/b:9c3986b5a7]
Dang! So that's why they hired me! LOL
 
(quoted from post at 21:59:59 09/22/14) Royse,

Did your oil pressure change at all after it happened, even slightly but noticeably?
I can't answer your question T, I bought it as-is.
Still pretty good OP, I'm guessing Jerry has it right being top end.
 
NNP, I'll pull the valve cover and look, but this sounds to me like
something more significant than valve lash. Wish it were.
I won't know without tearing it down, but my first thought was a
wrist pin. Total guess of course without looking, but OP makes me
think it is not in the lower end and the compression test makes me
think the valves are working close to normal.
Do you see something I overlooked? That's always possible! :)
 
(quoted from post at 19:50:07 09/22/14)
(quoted from post at 21:59:59 09/22/14) Royse,

Did your oil pressure change at all after it happened, even slightly but noticeably?
I can't answer your question T, I bought it as-is.
Still pretty good OP, I'm guessing Jerry has it right being top end.

I said piston hitting a valve . . . that's [b:72ac11623d]top end too. [/b:72ac11623d] :)
Too loud to be a wrist pin but could very well be a broken piston.

A friend of mine just delivered me his wood splitter to use. He has been the Highways equipment mechanic (only one) here on the island for the last 30 years and is retiring this Thursday! He used to own the old Esso station in town before that.

Anyway, for your sake, I dragged him in to listen to your NAA sound and he added an interesting possibility. He had the top land break off a piston in one of his inboard boat engines and it ended up on top of the piston, smacking the head.

In the final analysis he said, "I'm going with your 'piston hitting a valve" theory."

He's anxious to hear what you find. :)

Cheers,
T :)

P.S.
Valve spring keepers don't necessarily have to fail for conditions to exist where a piston hits and cocks a valve. the point of my best guess is that I think a piston is hitting a valve.
 
(quoted from post at 19:55:38 09/22/14) NNP, I'll pull the valve cover and look, but this sounds to me like
something more significant than valve lash. Wish it were.
I won't know without tearing it down, but my first thought was a
wrist pin. Total guess of course without looking, but OP makes me
think it is not in the lower end and the compression test makes me
think the valves are working close to normal.
Do you see something I overlooked? That's always possible! :)

your reasoning is logical.
Of course, I'll leave the best guesses to the very talented pros we have available here.
One thing I've done with very loud noises where I fear damage
when trying to find it.
I take all the plugs out and turn the engine slowly with a hand crank or rear tire in gear.
When the noise slowly 'clicks' your eye and brain will focus on the area without thought. That 8N I sold that I didn't get to tear down, I did that and knew immediately it was top right front. Laying my hand on the area, I could actually feel it.
If I would have got to tear it down, the head, piston and pin, valves would have got the look there first.
 

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