previous thread has me wondering (oil seals)

LisaK

Member
The recent post about the oil seals has me wondering about mine. I also soaked my seals for a few hours before installing and they were just as stiff as when I put them in the oil. I installed anyhow and they leak. Less than 15 hrs on the rebuild. I also have a leak on both sides on the front corners of the oil pan/engine mating surface. So are the oil seals supposed to swell or soften when soaked in oil? I wouldn't really care because its a really minor leak but enough to annoy me and plans are to paint it at some time. I trimmed the seals so about 1/16" stuck up, did not put sealant in the ends and trimmed the gasket to meet the seal retainer. I saw someone mentioned over lapping onto the seal? So i'll order a new gasket set and try again sometime this winter. What can I do to ensure it wont leak?
 
I install the seal DRY then use a 1/2 extension about a ft long and work the seal in the grove... I can lay both hands on the extension and with my weight work the seal into the grove good I do both seals that way... I then remove the seal and apply a little permatex aviation gasket maker in the grove are RTV... Aslo apply sealer to the rear seal retainer to engine block

Then I trim the ends as flush as I can get them a little may protrude... I run some assembly lube on the sealing face of the seal and none on the ends that will butt together... While I am laying other parts out I go back and add the lube to the seal a few times more. I then lay the crank in Finnish up bolting it down installing the rods ETC...apply Permatex ultra grey to the ends that butt together and install the pan.... The pan gasket overlaps the rear seal ends...

I have soaked them I did not like it... Fel-pro offers a graphite impregnated rear seal like the original ( BS10642-2 )... Two different seals come in the pack... One is to big and the other to small I have not had the gonnas to install them... I have a few of what I think are the originals I removed from N engines,,, they are limp wroven rope not a brick.... I would like to see a "new" original rear seal... Why we have to put up with the chit offered I dunno...
 
I just happened to have a pic on my phone. Its like this on both sides in the front. Everything else turned out perfect besides the crank seals and this. Why would it seep out the front and not rear?
mvphoto11157.jpg
 
Dunno was the crank pulley worn were the seal ran..

On a side note I do not use a gasket on the front timing cover unless I need more end play on the cam gear... A thin bead of RTV
is all I use there... RTV is useless to seal parts if the sealing surface has oil on it how folks came up with it on a rear seal they soaked in oil has got me...

The most important rule when using RTV is its got to be squeaky clean...
 

It had minor pitting but does have a slight wobble to it. Which I have a new on to install whenever we fix it. I wondered if maybe my front timing cover was warped for some reason on the bottom.
 

You really have to hard roll that seal into its groove, keeping in mind that once the cap is torqued down, extreme pressure is placed on the wick seal that can result in a gap at the ends
if your "rolling in" pressure wasn't comparable.

. . . and if you roll towards the center from each side
you effect a kind of vertical compression on the seal where it comes up to its ends and an increased (not only to be compressed by the shaft flange) density in the hollow.

Cheers,
Terry
 
I didn't have to roll them just pressed
them in by hand. So is that the problem?
Maybe the front is I need to put the new
pulley on but why the leak on the op
gasket on front?
 
two piece rope seals just leak in gerneral. I think you can buy a one piece seal for the front.

I replaced both seals in my 9n in Jan 06. They were both leaking by oct 07.

Dad made a lot of $$ replacing the rear main seal in Ford pickups. They used the same setup as the N's. They didn't last very long either.
 
I'm not familiar with those front end seals, but if you are talking about the rear main seal, then using Hobo's good method and like we advised, each half has to be seriously worked into the grooves with elbow grease. :)

I can't say I agree with removing the seal and putting any sealant under it, especially after mating it to the groove with the rolling in . . .but that MAY be a good idea.

If I was to try that I'd be inclined to use that old black permatex #2 but definitely no silicone product. I can't remember if I put a spot of that on my dry wick ends.

Everyone including me seems to always attribute the leakage to the mating faces . . . but even if that is so, doesn't mean that the entire seal couldn't be contributing to the problem. . . so permatex in the groove . . . hmmmm :)

Oil behind the seal?
It escapes between the flange and the seal or through breaks in the wick circle.

They are designed to be oil resistant so soaking them doesn't work and you wouldn't want it to work because then oil can "wick" it's way through it.

Probably overkill after a good roll-in and trimmin'.
 

I see what you mean!

From that site:
"There are many different opinions on why today's rope seals are not as effective at controlling oil as they seemed to be years ago. The general consensus is that two main factors are impacting seal performance: the environmental laws that limit the use of asbestos and other materials used in the original seals, and the efforts of manufacturers to limit part numbers by manipulating the dimensions of the seal to fit as many applications as possible. The market for rope seals has greatly diminished, so compromises are often made in order to offer a cost-effective product."
 

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