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Ford 9N, 2N & 8N Discussion Forum
Show Parts for Model:

Is Tip 38 no joke, or do I have bigger problems?

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wingmanchris

06-15-2014 18:02:45
24.105.224.181



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I recently picked up a 1945 2n and have been slowly going through it. It has low compression but runs well enough for now. I plan on rebuilding it this fall/winter.

I changed the plugs, wires, points, and condenser. It was running well but when I shut it down to make sure all my wires were clear of the fan and belt, I forgot to turn off the key. Side note: when I push the throttle all the way up, lowest setting, should the engine die out? It was only like this for about a minute and then I tried restarting it, but got nothing. Checked for spark and had none. When I check the voltage at the coil(the top wire on outside of coil) I get a low voltage reading. About 3.5 vdc and dropping. I checked the points and condenser, they seemed ok. The condenser had a good ohm resistance reading. The coil on the other hand was outside of the normal ohm reading.

I replaced the coil with a new aftermarket from ebay. Worked great for a couple days. I have been remembering to lower the idle and kill it with the key. I have also been very quick with starting. I have one hand on the key and one on the starter button. Well today I was giving my son a ride and ran out of gas. Between him freaking out because his tractor ride was unexpectedly cut short and me trying to quickly maneuver the tractor to level ground, the key switch slipped my mind. I lowered him off of the tractor, hopped off myself and we began the walk back to the garage for the gas can. It had not been 30 seconds since it died and I remembered the key. I ran back and turned it off. But once filled with gas, it again wouldn't start. I checked the coil again and it is shot.

So... is there something else going on, or do I need to invest in an ignition buzzer? :lol:
This post was edited by wingmanchris at 18:06:37 06/15/14 2 times.

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wingmanchris

06-16-2014 09:45:56
70.195.139.147



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 Re: Is Tip 38 no joke, or do I have bigger problems? in reply to wingmanchris, 06-15-2014 18:02:45  
I cannot find any info on bench testing the coils in any manual or anywhere online. I did happen upon this post though:

http://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=nboard&th=557601

I checked the coil according to what Soundguy recommended and both the primary and secondary are reading way outside of what he suggested. I tested the condenser in the same manner as he suggested and it reads ok.
The last coil is definately bad. I tried multiple times resetting and cleaning the points and finally replaced them again and still no spark. I tried to start it one last time before changing the coil and had no spark. Replaced the coil and it fired right up. Drove it around the property for a few days and then ran it out of gas.

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Bruce (VA)

06-16-2014 10:12:21
24.125.183.11



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 Re: Is Tip 38 no joke, or do I have bigger problems? in reply to wingmanchris, 06-16-2014 09:45:56  
" I checked the coil again and it is shot."

So this is where you are?

Tell us exactly what you are seeing on the ohm meter that leads to that conclusion. And here's why.......

There are a few ways to see if a coil is bad, but itís not possible to determine if a coil is good w/o some expensive testing equipment. If you detect a dead short or high resistance in the coil w/ an ohm meter, itís bad. If itís cracked, itís bad. If a sidemount coil w/ battery voltage to the primary will not jump a ľĒ gap from the secondary wire to the block, itís bad. But, here is the hard part: even if you do not detect a short, even if it will produce a spark, even if itís not cracked, that doesnít mean the coil will work when itís hot & under a load. So, itís a process of elimination. If the tractor starts & runs fine for 30 minutes or an hour then cuts off & refuses to re-start, and you checked for spark at the plugs & it had no spark at all, AND you have the correct voltage at the coil thatís a good sign that you have a bad coil. Let it cool off, restart it & if you have a good spark, odds are itís a bad coil. But, even then, you might end up w/ a spare coil on the shelf!

Bottom line.......coils do go bad, but I'll venture a guess that 75% of new N coils sold today are sold to folks who do not understand how to diagnose a poor spark problem or how a coil works. So, for those who donít know any better, in a no spark situation the first suspect is usually the coilÖÖand, more often than not, it isnít the problem.

Or as one regular around here humorously suggested: "Well, it is like this...I don't know or really understand what that black thing does & I am suspicious of the unknown, so I think the problem is the black thing."

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soundguy

06-16-2014 06:55:00
108.112.16.37



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 Re: Is Tip 38 no joke, or do I have bigger problems? in reply to wingmanchris, 06-15-2014 18:02:45  
explain more on the condensor test, and what the coil value was?



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Bruce (VA)

06-16-2014 06:11:45
24.125.183.11



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 Re: Is Tip 38 no joke, or do I have bigger problems? in reply to wingmanchris, 06-15-2014 18:02:45  
" About 3.5 vdc "

That means you have battery voltage to the points & they are closed.

" The condenser had a good ohm resistance reading."

And that doesn't tell you anything.

" The coil on the other hand was outside of the normal ohm reading."

And that would be what?

You're not burning up coils in 30 seconds.

Chances are this coil & the other one were fine.....so do tell us what the "normal" reading is supposed to be & how you are checking coil resistance.

" I replaced the coil with a new aftermarket from ebay"

And that could easily be the problem. Get your parts here at YT or from Just8N's.

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flembo

06-16-2014 03:00:45
69.95.213.9



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 Re: Is Tip 38 no joke, or do I have bigger problems? in reply to wingmanchris, 06-15-2014 18:02:45  
I had a 52 8n and when it ran out of gas I had to loosen the gas line at the carb to get gas flowing again.



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SWITCH...John,PA

06-16-2014 02:46:38
69.72.12.14



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 Re: Is Tip 38 no joke, or do I have bigger problems? in reply to wingmanchris, 06-15-2014 18:02:45  
Try this..........jumper wire the ignition switch . Sometimes the oem switch dies-out.

John,PA



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wingmanchris

06-15-2014 19:20:29
24.105.224.181



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 Re: Is Tip 38 no joke, or do I have bigger problems? in reply to wingmanchris, 06-15-2014 18:02:45  
It is 6 volt and has ther original ballast resistor. It is also the single pole style generator.



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Royse

06-15-2014 18:13:35
69.36.49.186



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 Re: Is Tip 38 no joke, or do I have bigger problems? in reply to wingmanchris, 06-15-2014 18:02:45  
The square can front mount coils can burn up if you leave the key

on, but not in 30 seconds. There's something else going on there.

How do you have it wired? 6V? 12V? Original ballast resistor plus?



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