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Ordered electronic ignition

R

Rodeo man

Member
I needed a water pump, and I had been wanting an electronic ignition ('52 side mount). While I was on the phone, I broke down and got one. I know many here frown on the use of them. I hope simple minded me can figure the thing out.
 
Did they sell you the suppression plug wires needed to keep the module from burning up? It does not like the RFI from the copper wires. And don't ever leave the key on or reverse the polarity.

Or install a voltmeter.


OK, that last one was a joke. ;)
75 Tips
 
601 Ford......6 years ago
4000 Ford......5 years ago (63 model)
Ford Jubilee....4 years ago
Minneapolis Moline BF....2 years ago (sold it)
8N Ford.....last year
All tractors still running good on electronic ignition, going to put it on a 2N Ford , 420 John Deere and International Cub when I have some extra money to spend, lol
 
(quoted from post at 02:36:36 08/07/18) Did they sell you the suppression plug wires needed to keep the module from burning up? It does not like the RFI from the copper wires. And don't ever leave the key on or reverse the polarity.

Or install a voltmeter.


OK, that last one was a joke. ;)
75 Tips
Click to expand...

I aint much of a mechanic. I barely know what you are talking about. Do I need different plug wires?
 
(quoted from post at 17:53:02 08/06/18) I needed a water pump, and I had been wanting an electronic ignition ('52 side mount). While I was on the phone, I broke down and got one. I know many here frown on the use of them. I hope simple minded me can figure the thing out.
Click to expand...

I did it on my 50 8n when I converted to 12 volt. I didn’t use special plug wires. Mine has been going strong for at least 2 years now with zero issues. She just starts and runs every time.
 
I called Pertronix when the EI burned up on
my 1950 MG. They told me about the problem
of using copper core wires. Not much after
that, someone on here reported the same
problem with EI on their tractor and got
the same reply from Pertronix.
75 Tips
 
I believe you only need the suppression wires with the Ignitor II system. I do like the extra insurance with the Ignitor II system, it has a built-in system, that if you mistakenly left the ignition key on, it will not hurt the system. You do that with a Ignitor I, you will burn it out.
 

I have 6 of them running now on everything from my C-2 Corvette to my Farmall Cub. The longest has been running over 20 years on the 390 in my 65 Ford pickup. I just put one on my 8N and for the first time I had a problem. The rotating magnet would not sit down on the dist shaft like it should. All I had to do was take my pocket knife and scrape the plastic flats just a little and it fell into place as it should have.
 

I have 6 of them running now on everything from my C-2 Corvette to my Farmall Cub. The longest has been running over 20 years on the 390 in my 65 Ford pickup. I just put one on my 8N and for the first time I had a problem. The rotating magnet would not sit down on the dist shaft like it should. All I had to do was take my pocket knife and scrape the plastic flats just a little and it fell into place as it should have.
 
There's nothing wrong with the original 6V/POS GRN electrical systems Ford used on all their vehicles. There is also nothing wrong with switching over to a 12V/NEG GRN system as well. 99.98% of all non-starting issues are due to poor/bad/incorrect wiring regardless of which system is in use. With Electronic Ignition, you only eliminate having to mess with the points, but the system still needs to properly maintained and more importantly, wired and set up correctly to begin with. MYTH #1: Changing a non-starting/non-running vehicle over to 12 VOLTS will make my tractor start better. FACT: FALSE. If it won't start on 6-VOLTS, what makes you think it will start on 12-VOLTS? MYTH #2: I need to switch to 12 volts because I live in a cold climate. FACT: False. When properly set up and maintained, these old Fords start and run perfectly in cold climates. There are thousands of us still with 6V/POS GRN systems that can testify. Why 12V? Switching to a 12-VOLT system benefits a worn engine that needs a kick-start to get going as a rebuild is not immediately possible. 12V spins the starter faster thus quicker starts. 12 Volts are needed today to run some auxiliary equipment like sprayers and winches and 8-Track players. Unless one has an early 9N or an early 8N and are restoring it, and the tractor is going to be used as an everyday workhorse, then 12V can be done, maybe even adding EI, but isn't a necessity. Once again, these old Fords ran for 60-70 years and counting on 6 Volts. It's yer tractor, do ennythang ya want, just as long as it is right and for the right reasons. My early 9N and early 8N are still 6V/POS GRN. My 9N is in my barn being restored by myself, and my 8N I restored in 2003 but has been my work tractor since I bought it in 1992, all original, and still does all the chores. It has seen a lot work since 2003 and is getting a bit worn and ready for another rebuild. I just did a tune-up and started discing and prepping food plots for deer season over at the farm and up north.

Tim *PloughNman* Daley(MI)
 
(quoted from post at 12:47:06 08/07/18) "I know many here frown on the use of them."

On this board yes.
On most of the other boards on this site
that is not the case.
Typical Q&A on the Ford Board
Click to expand...

Several post on that thread say they also changed coils. I’m moving ahead with the project, I actually hope the parts in by Friday, so I can do it over the weekend. Do I need to get a new coil, and plug wires? I hate to admit it, but I’m not very mechanically minded. I usually watch a YouTube video, or have somebody here walk me through about everything.
 
" Do I need to get a new coil, and plug wires? "

You are putting EI on a 66 year old 23hp, low compression, low rpm engine. I doubt seriously if a new 50k volt coil is going to do anything more than lighten your wallet. As to wires.....I can only relate to you what Pertronix told me.

However.?..

This thread is full of advice and testimonials about EI on vehicles other than your 1952 8N Ford tractor (my advice was based on my experience with a 12v 1950 MG)

I suggest that you call Pertronix directly with any questions you have that are not addressed in their instructions and disregard YouTube videos as well as the well intentioned but possibly misunderstood or incomplete advice you are getting here.

Assuming you are getting a Pertronix unit...?...
75 Tips
 
No need to change the coil.
However, Pertronix likes full voltage.
So if you are using a step down resister in
your ignition circuit you will need to
bypass the resister and run a second wire
directly to the red wire on the module.
The present stepped down wire that goes to
the + of the coil stays where it's at.
Or if you do not have a resister in your
circuit and are using a coil that is
internally ballasted you can hook the red
wire directly to the + side of the coil and
the black wire to the - side and you are
good to go. You can buy a new 12 V coil that
is made for full 12 V at Napa, etc and
eliminate your resister (if you have one in
your circuit). Then you can just run the red
wire from the module to the + side of the
coil and the black wire to the - side of the
coil.
You don't need to buy the fancy Pertronix
coil.
 
(quoted from post at 03:24:11 08/07/18) There's nothing wrong with the original 6V/POS GRN electrical systems Ford used on all their vehicles. There is also nothing wrong with switching over to a 12V/NEG GRN system as well. 99.98% of all non-starting issues are due to poor/bad/incorrect wiring regardless of which system is in use. With Electronic Ignition, you only eliminate having to mess with the points, but the system still needs to properly maintained and more importantly, wired and set up correctly to begin with. MYTH #1: Changing a non-starting/non-running vehicle over to 12 VOLTS will make my tractor start better. FACT: FALSE. If it won't start on 6-VOLTS, what makes you think it will start on 12-VOLTS? MYTH #2: I need to switch to 12 volts because I live in a cold climate. FACT: False. When properly set up and maintained, these old Fords start and run perfectly in cold climates. There are thousands of us still with 6V/POS GRN systems that can testify. Why 12V? Switching to a 12-VOLT system benefits a worn engine that needs a kick-start to get going as a rebuild is not immediately possible. 12V spins the starter faster thus quicker starts. 12 Volts are needed today to run some auxiliary equipment like sprayers and winches and 8-Track players. Unless one has an early 9N or an early 8N and are restoring it, and the tractor is going to be used as an everyday workhorse, then 12V can be done, maybe even adding EI, but isn't a necessity. Once again, these old Fords ran for 60-70 years and counting on 6 Volts. It's yer tractor, do ennythang ya want, just as long as it is right and for the right reasons. My early 9N and early 8N are still 6V/POS GRN. My 9N is in my barn being restored by myself, and my 8N I restored in 2003 but has been my work tractor since I bought it in 1992, all original, and still does all the chores. It has seen a lot work since 2003 and is getting a bit worn and ready for another rebuild. I just did a tune-up and started discing and prepping food plots for deer season over at the farm and up north.

Tim *PloughNman* Daley(MI)
Click to expand...

I will disagree with you 100%. I remember well -30F, no wind chill and most new 12 volt vehicles would not start without either boosting them, pre heating and or using starting fluid. No not just me. But everyone I knew. My new or newer computer controlled stuff today will stat at -30F without a problem. I've never seen a 6 volt ANYTHING start at -30F without "help". My dad's freshly rebuilt AC CA. Farmall H's and M's belonging to farmers I did some work for, people still driving 6 volt cars and trucks. Regardless of condition they did not start well below zero.

Fast forward to today. I rebuilt the engine on one of my 8Ns. Went through the carb, new bushings in the the distributor plus a new wiring harness. Was one of my "daily drivers" when I was still farming. While it was still 6 volt i had to pre heat it below -10F. From -10F to -20F it was hit and miss on if it would start or not without pre heating. After I converted it to 12 volt it pops right off, no pre heat right down to about -25F and has to crank over a few more revolutions when it's a bit colder. But it will reliably start at -30.

Heck things improve all the time. And alternator is a huge improvement over a generator. A battery and a starter was a huge improvement over a hand crank. Back in the 60's a flashlight left on would kill the batteries in a few hours. Today, with lithium batteries a flashlight with an LED bulb can be on for days. Just a tid bit of an improvement.

Rick
 

i'm with u, rick. my 6 volt 2N was a complete pain in the *** to start when i got it. the first thing i did to it was convert it to 12 volts. lo and behold, it started a whole lot easier. it needed a rebuild, but i was not prepared for the cost or the time it would take right then. it got the rebuild later. in the meantime, it still smoked and bogged down, but it started.

calling something a fact doesn't make it a fact, and capitalizing it doesn't either.

whether you'll admit it or not, tim, u are biased on this topic.
 
I would upgrade the wires no doubt... All my tractors that I added EI to all ready had modern plug wires used ones at that, that I had taken off cars I have worked on...

Sparex offers a nice set of Taylor made Graphite spark plug wires for a side mount... I do not like solid core OEM plug wires it drives all my nice digital test equipment crazy :cry: If your ducks are all in a row you don't need solid core plug wires anyways... Its a myth they are a must have...

As for the coil you will have to read the directors that come with the kit...
 
(quoted from post at 15:53:28 08/07/18) No need to change the coil.
However, Pertronix likes full voltage.
So if you are using a step down resister in
your ignition circuit you will need to
bypass the resister and run a second wire
directly to the red wire on the module.
The present stepped down wire that goes to
the + of the coil stays where it's at.
Or if you do not have a resister in your
circuit and are using a coil that is
internally ballasted you can hook the red
wire directly to the + side of the coil and
the black wire to the - side and you are
good to go. You can buy a new 12 V coil that
is made for full 12 V at Napa, etc and
eliminate your resister (if you have one in
your circuit). Then you can just run the red
wire from the module to the + side of the
coil and the black wire to the - side of the
coil.
You don't need to buy the fancy Pertronix
coil.
Click to expand...

I have a resistor, so thanks for posting. I hate to throw parts at something, but plug wires are cheap. I'll probably get new wires as well as plugs while I'm at it.
 
I live in central NH, we had 2 weeks straight last winter where the high temps were at 0 or below 0 and the lows got down as low as -29. My 6V Ford 9N with generator started no problem in temps as low as -20. I'm not anti-12V by any means, I actually prefer it for convenience but as long my 9N starts in temps like that I can't argue with 6V either.
 
79 years and still going strong on 6V, both my early 9N and my early 8N. I explained my stance below, so no need to reiterate, but your post exemplifies my position as well. It starts and runs fine in all weather conditions so no need to switch over to 12V, not that there's anything wrong with that, just be sure you do it for the right reasons. A major key factor with any system is to properly keep it maintained with periodic PM. "6-VOLT MANTRA: Clean, Bright, and Tight". There are some who poo-poo 6V, never owned an N, or haven't owned an N in 10 years or more, and most likely switched to 12V because they didn't understand the 6V/POS GRN system and for reasons already listed assumed 12V was the way to go. In this life there are those who get it, those who don't and those who never will.

Tim *PloughNman* Daley(MI)
 
Biased? Opinion, not fact. Did you read my reply? In a nutshell, I have an early 9N I am restoring to all original, as it was my grandfather's, and an early 8N that I restored in 2003, both 6V/POS GRN and the 8N has been my work tractor since. Further stated they start and run fine on 6V and I have never had any reason to switch over. Maybe, if I had a tractor that I needed to use everyday and not concerned about originality, I'd consider a 12V switch over job. As it is now, the 8N does not get much work nowadays, and never had any 12V accessories to run and since the engine was rebuilt so was good and strong. The 9N is getting the engine rebuilt now and since it will be all original, no need to change the 6V system. It's yer tractor do ennythang ya want to it.

TPD
 
If you are going to keep editorializing about the virtues of 6V you're going to start the whole voltage wars again.
You state:
[i:654c4848f0]"just be sure you do it for the right reasons" [/i:654c4848f0]
From reading your posts for 17 years I'm convinced that there is No right reason for you. Every single time the topic of conversion or EI comes up you come up with your 99% argument again and not very subtly imply there is something wrong with converting. You yourself quote the late Dell who said something like "it's your tractor, do as you like with it."
The whole 6V/12V thing has been hashed out ad nauseam and the reasons for converting - or staying original - are well documented here.
For 15 years I have been advocating to just help the man with whatever decision he has made. If he has 6V generator problems help him fix his problem. If he wants to convert, help him do it. If he wants EI stop trying to change his mind and help him do it.
The value of Ns is dropping fast. Their glory days are behind us. Craigslist is choked with ads for Ns. If modernizing is the thing that allows a man to get another 15 years of useful work out of one of these little tractors why try to stop him from doing it?
Let people do as they wish with their own tractor and just help them fix it.
 
Your sentimentalism over your grand dad's tractor is all well and good. But it is yours and is not a reason for everyone else to be sentimental about their tractor.
I am not sentimental. I sold the 2N my dad gave me when he passed and moved on to newer tractors. If my dad could see how I have parlayed his tractor into the ones I have now he would be proud of me.
6V and points are good. But the fact that these tractors have run that way for nearly 80 is not a reason to keep them 6V.
12V has many advantages and sentimentalism is not one of them.
 
Amen brother, well said Ultradog MN...
Whatever it takes to keep an old Ford N tractor running and being used whether it?s 12v with electronic ignition, a K&N dry air filter rather than the old oil bath filter, putting LED lights on, painting it whatever color you like, car tires mounted on the front, etc is better than the other alternative of being junked or parked in the woods and forgotten. Whatever a guy wants to do with one is fine with me, I?d rather see them still running by any means possible. I?ve never been a die hard purists at anything, if a guy wants 100% authenticity in an N Ford tractor that?s okay too but he shouldn?t shun or disrespect a guy that wants to customize one in his own way cause in the end it?s still an N tractor and it?s still running....
 

Easy as pie.. Converted mine 3 months ago. Starts practically every time in .5 seconds...
Love it.

It is very simple. Watch this vid as this guy does a superb job of walking you through it .. Be patient, the video is worth the time..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITEJt85T3rk

.
 
(quoted from post at 15:00:59 08/08/18)
Easy as pie.. Converted mine 3 months ago. Starts practically every time in .5 seconds...
Love it.

It is very simple. Watch this vid as this guy does a superb job of walking you through it .. Be patient, the video is worth the time..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITEJt85T3rk

.
Click to expand...
xcept that you should tie the red module wire to switched 12v as per the Pertronix instruction sheet for the 1244A, not to the top of coil, which is after the resistor & thus less than 12v. It did run for him, but is not as Pertronix sheet instructs.
 
(quoted from post at 04:14:21 08/08/18) 79 years and still going strong on 6V, both my early 9N and my early 8N. I explained my stance below, so no need to reiterate, but your post exemplifies my position as well. It starts and runs fine in all weather conditions so no need to switch over to 12V, not that there's anything wrong with that, just be sure you do it for the right reasons. A major key factor with any system is to properly keep it maintained with periodic PM. "6-VOLT MANTRA: Clean, Bright, and Tight". There are some who poo-poo 6V, never owned an N, or haven't owned an N in 10 years or more, and most likely switched to 12V because they didn't understand the 6V/POS GRN system and for reasons already listed assumed 12V was the way to go. In this life there are those who get it, those who don't and those who never will.

Tim *PloughNman* Daley(MI)
Click to expand...

And then there are us who cut our teeth on generators and points who did and do maintain our stuff. I switched because it's an reliability upgrade plain and simple. I want to work my tractors not work on them. I want them to start when I hit the switch.

I'll say it again. Not wind chill, but a good -25F to -30F day and I have never ever seen a parked outside 6 volt system start reliably REGARDLESS of condition. Like I said, dads AC CA was a great example. Rebuilt engine, carb and magneto, fresh battery, good starter and working charging system. 0 sized battery cables. Owned by a guy who would lecture you for days about clean tight connections, no fix all clamps and such. Starting procedure when it was -30f? Remove the nearly new plugs, place in oven to pre heat, plug in engine heater at least 4 hours before needed. Install warm plugs, put booster on new battery and start. That was every day once it got to -10F. Dad spread manure with it every day. Dad bought it from an estate. Guy took it in for have new pistons and sleeves put in it then passed. Widow sold it to dad for next to nothing with dad picking up the repair bill. That was reworked head and all. Dad brought the starter, genny and mag home and rebuilt all 3 while they were finishing the engine. Once home he did the carb and the thing ran great. Just didn't like sub zero too much. My first 2 vehicles were 6 volt. Both Chevy's. One a sedan and the other a truck. 1950 4 door and 1951 pickup. Heck dad's one year old 1900 miles on the clock 12 volt system 1969 car did not start at -30F without plugging it in.

Rick

Rick
 
"Give me convenience, or give me death!"

Something like that. :lol:

I am all for a change that lets me work [b:589fe123c4][i:589fe123c4]with [/i:589fe123c4][/b:589fe123c4]something instead of working [b:589fe123c4][i:589fe123c4]on [/i:589fe123c4][/b:589fe123c4]it. Electronic ignition is on the 'round-to-its list
 

[b:946ab6144c]"Biased? Opinion, not fact."[/b:946ab6144c]

lol. i'm not the one labeling my opinions as FACT ;)

i am not addressing your rebuild. i was addressing your false claim of a fact.

[b:946ab6144c]"In this life there are those who get it, those who don't and those who never will."[/b:946ab6144c]

and yet u claim there are no advantages to a system which every auto and tractor manufacturer has switched to. i wonder who's not getting it :idea:
 
Dad changed is 67 Ford Ranger over to EI. We learned none of the
claims were true about better fuel efficiency or quicker starts.
There was no change in the old pickup performance. The EI lasted
about twenty years and then quit. Dad put points back in. Again
no difference in its performance going from EI back to points.

I know that last set of points had to be right at twenty years
old when dad sold the pickup.
 
(quoted from post at 10:04:37 08/10/18) Dad changed is 67 Ford Ranger over to EI. We learned none of the
claims were true about better fuel efficiency or quicker starts.
There was no change in the old pickup performance. The EI lasted
about twenty years and then quit. Dad put points back in. Again
no difference in its performance going from EI back to points.

I know that last set of points had to be right at twenty years
old when dad sold the pickup.
Click to expand...
hould have kept it! 1967 Ford Ranger is extremely rare!
 
(quoted from post at 20:48:31 08/09/18)
u claim there are no advantages to a system which every auto and tractor manufacturer has switched to.
Click to expand...

HFJ, Can you name ONE auto or tractor manufacturer that uses the pertronix system? (NOT denying that possibly some exist, but certainly NOT common.)

There's simply no comparison in spark intensity, timing accuracy between all the cylinders, and MOST IMPORTANTLY, long term RELIABILITY between these "systems" and a typical OEM HEI.

They are simply an electronic switch that replaces the points (a sort of "crutch"), making a spark no "hotter" than a functioning set of breaker points does with a given coil.

(THERE, I said it, let the flaming begin!)
 
(quoted from post at 02:16:27 08/11/18)
(quoted from post at 20:48:31 08/09/18)
u claim there are no advantages to a system which every auto and tractor manufacturer has switched to.
Click to expand...

HFJ, Can you name ONE auto or tractor manufacturer that uses the pertronix system? (NOT denying that possibly some exist, but certainly NOT common.)

There's simply no comparison in spark intensity, timing accuracy between all the cylinders, and MOST IMPORTANTLY, long term RELIABILITY between these "systems" and a typical OEM HEI.

They are simply an electronic switch that replaces the points (a sort of "crutch"), making a spark no "hotter" than a functioning set of breaker points does with a given coil.

(THERE, I said it, let the flaming begin!)
Click to expand...

i don't know what your point is here. did u interpret my comment to be about electronic ignition? it wasn't.
 
No flames Bob as I agree Pertronix mearly
replaces one switch with another.
Howsomever, EI does have some advantages
over points.
One is that it is not subject to that
"invisible corrosion" that points are. In
the link I posted earlier in this thread I
mention having to wipe the point surfaces
after the tractor has sat for a while.
Another advantage is it compensates for worn
distributer bushings better than points as
the air gap between the magnet and module is
quite large.
Lastly, since there is no rubbing of the
points against the cam the dwell never
changes as the rubbing block wears.
Prior to installing it on that 3000 I had an
occasional miss at idle that went away. I do
not know why it went away but it did.
Anyway, for me it really was a set and
forget upgrade as 3 cyl points are nearly as
much of a pia as those in a front mount.
 
(quoted from post at 17:53:02 08/06/18) I needed a water pump, and I had been wanting an electronic ignition ('52 side mount). While I was on the phone, I broke down and got one. I know many here frown on the use of them. I hope simple minded me can figure the thing out.
Click to expand...
I have had them on several tractors over the last 15 years and they work great, I have never had a problem with any of them.
 
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