Why No Temperature Gauge?

L.Fure

Well-known Member
My 8N doesn't have a temperature gauge, or anyplace for a temperature sending unit. Is this common with the N series Ford tractors?
 
Don't think any of the N's came with this, but there are aftermarket kits for sending units located either in the upper radiator hose or (drilled and tapped into) the "boss" on the upper left of the head near the oil filter.
 

Thanks Jim. The engineers must have had a lot faith in the cooling system not to add a gauge.
 
(quoted from post at 09:05:14 08/31/17)
Thanks Jim. The engineers must have had a lot faith in the cooling system not to add a gauge.

Never had a cooling problem on my 8N for over ten years. Here's a hint though. You need to keep the radiator fins clean especially if you use a brush hog. You'd be surprised how much crap can build up in those fins.

Blow them out with air from the back and the front. start with the back. You can also use a water hose if you want but the air usually takes care of it.

Here's a pic of what I use to do it. You can use a regular air nozzle with a brass barbed end for a plastic hose. Works great.

RadiatorBlowTube.JPG
 
(quoted from post at 12:05:14 08/31/17)
Thanks Jim. The engineers must have had a lot faith in the cooling system not to add a gauge.
t is not a car. Your face is about 4 feet from radiator. If it overheats, you will smell it or get a face full of coolant. Both excellent indicators, not easily ignored. :wink:
 
As JMOR said, Henry Ford figured out thatt tractor owners, like Model A owners, were smart enough to know when the engine overheated. Either that or he was just so tight he wouldn't pay a dime to see an ant eat a bale of hay.
75 Tips
 
(quoted from post at 12:05:14 08/31/17)
Thanks Jim. The engineers must have had a lot faith in the cooling system not to add a gauge.

They came to their senses by the time the NAA was designed ;-) Plenty of ways to add a gauge and a warning light to go with it :idea:

TOH
 

I looked over the radiator on the tractor to see how clean the fins were. They were clean as a whistle, but I did notice that it is more than enough radiator to keep that hamster wheel of motor cool.
 
Some Stationary Industrial Engines had a temperature gauge. The mid-8N production cylinder heads had a cast boss on the left front side added where the intent was to drill and tap a hole for the sending unit to a temperature gauge. That idea never saw production. One big mistake made with overheating is due to operator error -overfilling. The correct level is about 4" from the top -just enough to cover the core. Capacity is 12 quarts. Other reasons can cause overheating -loose fan belt, poor/worn points, no or bad thermostat, low coolant level, and more. Use clean distilled water, and mix with anti-freeze solution. Always use a thermostat. It goes in the upper radiator hose with the pointed end towards the radiator.

TPD
 
The N's designed to burn kerosene had temp gauges. On most 8's
there is an undrilled boss on the left front corner of the head
for the sending unit.

I added a gauge to my 9n. Made an adapter for the top hose. I
don't use the gauge to tell when the engine is over heating. I
use it in cold weather to tell me when it has warmed up enough
to use.
 
(quoted from post at 16:07:53 08/31/17) Some Stationary Industrial Engines had a temperature gauge. The mid-8N production cylinder heads had a cast boss on the left front side added where the intent was to drill and tap a hole for the sending unit to a temperature gauge. That idea never saw production. One big mistake made with overheating is due to operator error -overfilling. The correct level is about 4" from the top -just enough to cover the core. Capacity is 12 quarts. Other reasons can cause overheating -loose fan belt, poor/worn points, no or bad thermostat, low coolant level, and more. Use clean distilled water, and mix with anti-freeze solution. Always use a thermostat. It goes in the upper radiator hose with the pointed end towards the radiator.

TPD

I agree with the water level just covering the top of the core. But, if you fill it to the top as some do and it shoots out the overflow, is it really over heating? I thought that as the water heated up, it expanded and the system just couldn't hold it all in so it shoots out the overflow. So, technically that's not overheating is it? Or am I missing something?
 

No you did not miss sum'N they first read it that way the first time someone posted it and re-post it over and over... Just like a N don't need a temp gauge they acepted it and re-post it over and over... NO you don't need it if you are willing to wait till a issue that may give you a warring KILLS the engine...

Bad Wabbits are hard to break :lol:

The same could be said about the other gauges "They are not needed"

You don't need to be a rocket scientist to learn what is normal and whats not normal with temperature gauge readings... Learn whats normal and look for issues that will cause the readings to be out of the normal range..

Folks get stressed on on oil pressure and amp meter readings that are not normal why not wait till it spits a rod out the side of the engine it will have the same effect as a radiator cap blowing hot coolant in you face...

I understand what they mean there werd'N needs tweek'N tho...
 
Good Hobo! :) ".........it spits a rod out the side of the engine it will have the same effect as a radiator cap blowing hot coolant in you face... ". OK, so an early warning is nice & the temp gauge will give you that.
 
All the replies are good but I've only overheated my 8N once and that was when I first got it and overfilled the radiator. I soon got me the essential manuals and learned fast. It sux too because if'N ya'll have a front mount dizzy, it ends up getting all wet and you hasta pull it of and dry it out...

Tim Daley(MI)
 

I have wimmen customers that have enoufh sense to call/bring in there car when they see the temp gauge indicating out of the normal range... Most every time its a indication something is going to be a problem should I show them how smart I am and tell them to wait till it blows steam to confirm the gauge is correct...

Like any other gauge you believe it till you can prove it wrong... Its my belief heating issues that cause major damage can be prevented you just have to become a operator not a driver....

One of my first thoughts when a vehicle shows up at my door huff'N and puff'n steam is to look at the gauge if its pegged its reading correct :lol: If not then part of the diagnostic would be to confirm gauge operation...

After a heating repair I am constantly confirming a fix while operating the vehicle by the gauge "whoda tunk'it"

I don't care if you have a temp gauge are not and you can bet your sweet arse anyone you loan it to don't care either. Its just flat out wrong to dream up reasons why they did not come with one other than the cost of production...

About the only time I have seen were the gauge was of no help till it ran hot and killed the engine is when a bottom radiator hose blows and dumps the coolant fast. The gauge scenes coolant no coolant then its dependent on metal and steam once they cause it to rise its often to late call in the family.... I often relate a overheated engine to having a stroke it will never be the same... Its just a indicator when it functions they are hard to beat...
 
(quoted from post at 08:49:39 09/01/17)
I I often relate a overheated engine to having a stroke it will never be the same...

I share that opinion and unfortunately all too often it winds up giving my wallet a stroke as well.

TOH
 

"HUH? What is your definition of 'overheating' ???"

:roll:

how about: getting hotter than it's supposed to be.

these engines will spew excess coolant at acceptable, normal operating temperatures, right?
 
(quoted from post at 11:37:36 09/01/17)
"HUH? What is your definition of 'overheating' ???"

:roll:

how about: getting hotter than it's supposed to be.

these engines will spew excess coolant at acceptable, normal operating temperatures, right?
ot unless you do what Tim described & overfilled the 'expansion tank' at top of radiator core.
It doesn't need to overheat to expand the water & if no air space, then it is going to escape.
 
(quoted from post at 12:47:53 09/01/17)
It doesn't need to overheat to expand the water & if no air space, then it is going to escape.

and that's the whole point. it didn't overheat, it was overfilled.
 
(quoted from post at 09:00:44 09/01/17)
(quoted from post at 12:47:53 09/01/17)
It doesn't need to overheat to expand the water & if no air space, then it is going to escape.

and that's the whole point. it didn't overheat, it was overfilled.

Ding Ding Ding Ding...we have a winner. :mrgreen:
 

I had to get a new head for my 52 8N. I drilled out the boss and installed a temperature gauge. While I was at it, just for kicks, I also installed thermocouples with the spark plugs and added a cylinder head temperature gauge to the dash. I wanted to see the temperature variation between cylinders. When I cleaned out the block (after #4 Welch plug failed) I noticed a LOT of dirt and crap in #4 and #3. Bonus: that one time I had a misfire, I could easily identify the errant plug!

Next project: Pitot tube, OAT gauge and fresh air vents. :lol:

Jimps in GA. (N9616M)


2886.jpg


2887.jpg


2888.jpg
 
Well,
I heard the theory that ford put oversized
cooling systems in those tractors and
figured it was cheaper and more effective
than a temp gauge which most people don't
pay much attention to anyway - till
something goes wrong.
And that theory still makes sense to me.
I don't have a temp gauge on my tractor.
Or an amp or volt gauge or fuel gauge or
any wires on it for that matter.
I just pay attention to it. And would
smell it if it gets hot. The farmers who
bought these tractors new could tell the
feed requirements of their horses by how
much farting they did when pulling a plow.
They didn't need a temp gauge on their
tractor. It was assumed they paid
attention to how it smelled.
If you want a temp gauge on your tractor
though it's ok with me.
I'll just stick with the theory. And my
nose.
 
(quoted from post at 22:13:35 09/01/17) Well,
I heard the theory that ford put oversized
cooling systems in those tractors and
figured it was cheaper and more effective
than a temp gauge which most people don't
pay much attention to anyway - till
something goes wrong.
And that theory still makes sense to me.
I don't have a temp gauge on my tractor.
Or an amp or volt gauge or fuel gauge or
any wires on it for that matter.
I just pay attention to it. And would
smell it if it gets hot. The farmers who
bought these tractors new could tell the
feed requirements of their horses by how
much farting they did when pulling a plow.
They didn't need a temp gauge on their
tractor. It was assumed they paid
attention to how it smelled.
If you want a temp gauge on your tractor
though it's ok with me.
I'll just stick with the theory. And my
nose.

My grandpa used to say; A farten horse will never tire, a farten man is a man to hire.

One thing a horse knew that a tractor doesn't know. When to go back to the farm at dinner time.
 

How much oversize is it... It does not seam to be any bigger than any other radiator at that time are today far as that goes... Its noting more than a 2 row radiator I don't consider that a HD cooling system...
 

Nutter thought... Why is it tractors that came with a temp gauge folks go to the trouble to fix it if its broke... Why is a few in the N community are the only ones that dream up all this hog wash...

They don't even know the difference between blowing off gas verses overheating... Every car/truck you own will de-gas if not for the de-gas bottle they would be dumping coolant on the road....

Nuttin like the smell of cooking antifreeze... Smells like Chinese cook'N...

Good enoufh just ain't good enoufh for me...
 
L.Fure, you told us you usually dealt with another brand. Right?
I can't recall which one it was off the top of my head.
Many of my Farmalls have no temperature gauge.
Some of my Allis Chalmers did not have them either.
It seems to me that they came along with newer models.
Across many of the brands anyways.
Or some may have had them as an option?
I know some Farmall BN's had them. Mine does not.

None of the tractors in this picture have a temp gauge.
Granted, the short stop is air cooled. ;)

2900.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 20:47:54 09/01/17) L.Fure, you told us you usually dealt with another brand. Right?
I can't recall which one it was off the top of my head.
Many of my Farmalls have no temperature gauge.
Some of my Allis Chalmers did not have them either.
It seems to me that they came along with newer models.
Across many of the brands anyways.
Or some may have had them as an option?
I know some Farmall BN's had them. Mine does not.

None of the tractors in this picture have a temp gauge.
Granted, the short stop is air cooled. ;)

My 1958 MF202 Workbull has a temp gauge.
 
CaryC,
Probably everyone had gone to temp gauges by
then. Ford had them from the Jubilees
onward.
Royse, I'm pretty sure our Allis B had one.
Iirc it was located on top of the hood, up
front by the radiator. The OP gauge was down
on the side of the engine on one side or
the other. Ammeter in the box on the dash
with the on/off switch.
Ours was a later one with foot brakes. Don't
know what year it was.
Hobo,
We could all critizize Ford for one thing or
another but the lack of a temp gauge is not
very high on my list. A million Ns with
several thousand hours of run time equals
several Billion hours. Overheating issues
aren't so common on them. Not a bad record
I'd say.
If I were to start bashing the Ns the lack
of a real drawbar on the 9/2s and reverse
gear on the 8s would be much higher on my
list.
 
(quoted from post at 04:47:54 09/02/17) L.Fure, you told us you usually dealt with another brand. Right?
I can't recall which one it was off the top of my head.
Many of my Farmalls have no temperature gauge.
Some of my Allis Chalmers did not have them either.
It seems to me that they came along with newer models.
Across many of the brands anyways.
Or some may have had them as an option?
I know some Farmall BN's had them. Mine does not.

None of the tractors in this picture have a temp gauge.
Granted, the short stop is air cooled. ;)

2900.jpg

Case is the brand I have dealt with the most. Everyone I've owned had a temperature gauge on it. One poster said he needed a gauge to tell him when an engine was warm enough, not when it was over heating. Back in the day that was most likely the information a person needed to know when cheap distillate or kerosene fuel was being used. When the higher compression higher horse power engines showed up it became more important to monitor an engine for over heating.
 

[b:9358ef4e9d]"Royse, I'm pretty sure our Allis B had one.
Iirc it was located on top of the hood, up
front by the radiator."[/b:9358ef4e9d]

i suspect your memory is correct. that's where it is on my WD.

[b:9358ef4e9d]"If I were to start bashing the Ns the lack
of a real drawbar on the 9/2s and reverse
gear on the 8s would be much higher on my
list."[/b:9358ef4e9d]

agreed. even on my 2N, reverse is bad enough, and what passes for a drawbar for it is... less than impressive.
 
(quoted from post at 05:49:39 09/01/17)
I have wimmen customers that have enoufh sense to call/bring in there car when they see the temp gauge indicating out of the normal range... Most every time its a indication something is going to be a problem should I show them how smart I am and tell them to wait till it blows steam to confirm the gauge is correct...

Like any other gauge you believe it till you can prove it wrong... Its my belief heating issues that cause major damage can be prevented you just have to become a operator not a driver....

One of my first thoughts when a vehicle shows up at my door huff'N and puff'n steam is to look at the gauge if its pegged its reading correct :lol: If not then part of the diagnostic would be to confirm gauge operation...

After a heating repair I am constantly confirming a fix while operating the vehicle by the gauge "whoda tunk'it"

I don't care if you have a temp gauge are not and you can bet your sweet arse anyone you loan it to don't care either. Its just flat out wrong to dream up reasons why they did not come with one other than the cost of production...

About the only time I have seen were the gauge was of no help till it ran hot and killed the engine is when a bottom radiator hose blows and dumps the coolant fast. The gauge scenes coolant no coolant then its dependent on metal and steam once they cause it to rise its often to late call in the family.... I often relate a overheated engine to having a stroke it will never be the same... Its just a indicator when it functions they are hard to beat...

I wish one of the wimmen I knew had looked at the temperature gauge before driving it two miles. I thought I had her well trained to watch the gauges.

I was mechaniking at a place and my lady said she would bring my 3/4 ton '53 Chev from the farm to the place I was working.
I forgot that I had drained the coolant the day before.

When I got in I smelled that dreaded smell of a cooked cooling system. What a bummer. the engine was fine after that but I could tell that the upper end had suffered.

So there's a very good reason for a temp gauge . . . but only if if you keep an eye on it. :)

For my '51 chev van I didn't have an ether-filled temp tube long enough to reach the port on the head so I plumbed the shorter one into my heater hose.

Terry

2917.jpg


Had it close to startup last week but decided to drop the gas tank and restore tank, straps and sender; good thing I did.
2918.jpg
 

Even if she did notice the temp with no coolant it would have been too late :(...

Of subject a club I was in set up a dunk'N booth at the local fair I left my ford van there so they would have a place to change out in. All done I ask a farmer bud to drive my 63 chebby pick up home for me. When he got there I jump in to take him back to the fair grounds the engine was knocking BAD with no oil pressure WTF. The Automatic transmission had stuck in low gear he drove it 5 miles in low gear. I asked him about it he said I was wondering why it would only go 35/40 MPH :evil:

So don't tell me Farmers have it going on and blessed with a unknown 8th sense...
 
(quoted from post at 19:08:36 09/02/17)
Even if she did notice the temp with no coolant it would have been too late :(...

Of subject a club I was in set up a dunk'N booth at the local fair I left my ford van there so they would have a place to change out in. All done I ask a farmer bud to drive my 63 chebby pick up home for me. When he got there I jump in to take him back to the fair grounds the engine was knocking BAD with no oil pressure WTF. The Automatic transmission had stuck in low gear he drove it 5 miles in low gear. I asked him about it he said I was wondering why it would only go 35/40 MPH :evil:

So don't tell me Farmers have it going on and blessed with a unknown 8th sense...

Was he an older person with hearing loss? When I was a teenager we had an old attorney that owned a few farms near where my girlfriend lived. He would drive out to the farms a couple times a month, during the summer months, and drive around the fields inspecting the crops. He was very hard of hearing, and when he started up his Lincoln he would rev the engine up until the valves started to float before he could hear it running. When he would drive up hill through a hay field the tires would start slipping and he would push the foot feed to the floor to get up the hill. There would be blue smoke coming off the tires and out of the exhaust by the time he made it to the top. It was always good for a few laughs watching him do this.
 

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