Running without a generator.

Muskellunge · May 4, 2017

On my NAA, if I had a fully charged 6V batt and ran the tractor with a bad generator, approx how many hrs of run time would I get where I could turn off the tractor and have enough volts remaining to restart tractor? Would there be enough volts to start/turn over tractor after say half a dozen mowing sessions with a bad genny?

Muskie

TheOldHokie · May 4, 2017

(quoted from post at 09:56:51 05/04/17) On my NAA, if I had a fully charged 6V batt and ran the tractor with a bad generator, approx how many hrs of run time would I get where I could turn off the tractor and have enough volts remaining to restart tractor? Would there be enough volts to start/turn over tractor after say half a dozen mowing sessions with a bad genny?

Muskie

The ignition draw is about 4 amps so an hour mowing is a 4 Ah drawdown. You will kill it with the starter long before you draw it down with the ignition. If it starts easy and you don't mow for hours on end maybe a half dozen start cycles.

TOH

Muskellunge · May 4, 2017

Thanks. I'm not sure if VR and/genny are working correctly, that's why I wonder. When I took the batt to be charged, the guy said I could bring down my genny and VR and he'd test them. I may do that, but I hate to pull them both.

Muskie

jimtrs · May 4, 2017

(quoted from post at 10:25:33 05/04/17) Thanks. I'm not sure if VR and/genny are working correctly, that's why I wonder. When I took the batt to be charged, the guy said I could bring down my genny and VR and he'd test them. I may do that, but I hate to pull them both.

Muskie

Remember, NAA is a "B Circuit" charging system. Both generator & regulator must be "B Circuit".

Caryc · May 4, 2017

(quoted from post at 09:55:14 05/04/17)

(quoted from post at 10:25:33 05/04/17) Thanks. I'm not sure if VR and/genny are working correctly, that's why I wonder. When I took the batt to be charged, the guy said I could bring down my genny and VR and he'd test them. I may do that, but I hate to pull them both.

Muskie

Click to expand...

Remember, NAA is a "B Circuit" charging system. Both generator & regulator must be "B Circuit".

Well, you sure left that one open. What is a "B" circuit?

JMOR · May 4, 2017

(quoted from post at 13:04:18 05/04/17)

(quoted from post at 09:55:14 05/04/17)

(quoted from post at 10:25:33 05/04/17) Thanks. I'm not sure if VR and/genny are working correctly, that's why I wonder. When I took the batt to be charged, the guy said I could bring down my genny and VR and he'd test them. I may do that, but I hate to pull them both.

Muskie

Click to expand...

Remember, NAA is a "B Circuit" charging system. Both generator & regulator must be "B Circuit".

Click to expand...

Well, you sure left that one open. What is a "B" circuit?

generator with internally grounded field as opposed to "A" ckt which has externally grounded field, like your 8n

Muskellunge · May 4, 2017

To be honest, I don't have a full grasp on the A vs B circuit, so that's why I would take them both (gen-vr) down to be tested. I would assume the tester, owner of the place, would know it were a B circuit by appearance...would he not?

JMOR · May 4, 2017

(quoted from post at 14:49:53 05/04/17) To be honest, I don't have a full grasp on the A vs B circuit, so that's why I would take them both (gen-vr) down to be tested. I would assume the tester, owner of the place, would know it were a B circuit by appearance...would he not?

e will know!

Skip Burney · May 4, 2017

We have a 2N and the generator hasn't worked in years, we put a resister in front of the distributor and use a small 12 volt battery and it will go darn near all summer without a charge and we use it hard. You wont hurt the starter unless you just sit and grind and grind on it.

Muskellunge · May 4, 2017

When I've have to jump it, I go direct to the starter w/12V. It turns over so quick it makes me want to convert to 12V.

If I take the gen in and it tests bad, this would probably be the best time to covert to 12v.

Royse · May 4, 2017

When I first posted this picture, JMOR noticed that all my electrons
were running out on the ground. Indeed they were.

I ran it that way for a year while I was fixing all the other things.
Charged the battery about once a month, even though I was
cranking it and starting it for various things regularly.
This was all 6V.

Do you have a hydrometer to check the specific gravity in your
6V batteries? That's how you really know what shape they're in.
If you run the battery completely dead, I would expect it to come back.

Mine didn't turn out all that bad. Still had the same battery
when I sold it, and the new owner hasn't replaced it either.

HFJ · May 4, 2017

(quoted from post at 23:21:49 05/04/17)

love this pic, i have the identical black on red look - on mine, it's the right-hand side of the 3 point, of course

now that it's rebuilt, i really ought to get around to cleaning that off.

Royse · May 4, 2017

"If I take the gen in and it tests bad, this would probably be the best time to covert to 12v."

The generators were never the problem for me, it was the voltage regulators.
I never have found a reliable new 6V regulator.

Royse · May 4, 2017

(quoted from post at 22:49:31 05/04/17)

(quoted from post at 23:21:49 05/04/17)

Click to expand...

love this pic, i have the identical black on red look - on mine, it's the right-hand side of the 3 point, of course

now that it's rebuilt, i really ought to get around to cleaning that off.

That picture looks really good HFJ, compared to where it started!
This picture was taken with the same short exhaust pipe on it.
It was also running in the finished/painted picture.
They clean up quite nicely.

HFJ · May 4, 2017

wow. did that come with a hazmat suit, or did u have to buy your own? :shock:

Muskellunge · May 5, 2017

Mighty fine looking restore, Royse! I really like the black & red look.

vidaliaman · May 6, 2017

is the only problem with this scenario("we put a resister in front of the distributor and use a small 12 volt battery") the battery won't get charged? and if so could you trickle charge this small 12v battery with a small solar panel?

Royse · May 6, 2017

Thanks Musky, it was a fun project!

Royse · May 6, 2017

(quoted from post at 20:11:00 05/06/17) is the only problem with this scenario("we put a resister in front of the distributor and use a small 12 volt battery") the battery won't get charged? and if so could you trickle charge this small 12v battery with a small solar panel?

That's true IF you disconnect the generator wires.
In a perfect world, disconnecting them wouldn't matter, but
nothing in my world is ever perfect. So I would disconnect them.

Hobo,NC · May 7, 2017

(quoted from post at 05:03:56 05/05/17) We have a 2N and the generator hasn't worked in years, we put a resister in front of the distributor and use a small 12 volt battery and it will go darn near all summer without a charge and we use it hard. You wont hurt the starter unless you just sit and grind and grind on it.

A guy I know has done just dat for the last 30 years... He mows with it twice a year its a 2/3 day event... He has not burnt a coil up yet far as i know but I don't know what coil he is using :shock:

Other than dat I would at the least charge the bat tween usage just to keep it active...

I did dat on a farmall 140 for quite a few years because I will not buy a 6V battery. Its just not gonna happen all 6V systems should DIE :!: I got slow and put my helper to converting it to 12V. I don't use it more than 30 min a year the 12V bat is grave yard dead now if I need it I jump it and move on with life...

A good excuse to have one of these...

https://www.amazon.com/Antigravity-Batteries-AG-XP-10-Multi-Function-Starter/dp/B00MQ5Z5F2

Caryc · May 8, 2017

(quoted from post at 18:53:58 05/07/17)

(quoted from post at 05:03:56 05/05/17) We have a 2N and the generator hasn't worked in years, we put a resister in front of the distributor and use a small 12 volt battery and it will go darn near all summer without a charge and we use it hard. You wont hurt the starter unless you just sit and grind and grind on it.

Click to expand...

A guy I know has done just dat for the last 30 years... He mows with it twice a year its a 2/3 day event... He has not burnt a coil up yet far as i know but I don't know what coil he is using :shock:

Other than dat I would at the least charge the bat tween usage just to keep it active...

I did dat on a farmall 140 for quite a few years because I will not buy a 6V battery. Its just not gonna happen all 6V systems should DIE :!: I got slow and put my helper to converting it to 12V. I don't use it more than 30 min a year the 12V bat is grave yard dead now if I need it I jump it and move on with life...

A good excuse to have one of these...

https://www.amazon.com/Antigravity-Batteries-AG-XP-10-Multi-Function-Starter/dp/B00MQ5Z5F2

Hobo,

You should check out that Amazon ad. Check the customer reviews. The thing is a counterfeit product. It has very bad reviews.

Hobo,NC · May 8, 2017

(quoted from post at 11:49:50 05/08/17)

(quoted from post at 18:53:58 05/07/17)

(quoted from post at 05:03:56 05/05/17) We have a 2N and the generator hasn't worked in years, we put a resister in front of the distributor and use a small 12 volt battery and it will go darn near all summer without a charge and we use it hard. You wont hurt the starter unless you just sit and grind and grind on it.

Click to expand...

A guy I know has done just dat for the last 30 years... He mows with it twice a year its a 2/3 day event... He has not burnt a coil up yet far as i know but I don't know what coil he is using :shock:

Other than dat I would at the least charge the bat tween usage just to keep it active...

I did dat on a farmall 140 for quite a few years because I will not buy a 6V battery. Its just not gonna happen all 6V systems should DIE :!: I got slow and put my helper to converting it to 12V. I don't use it more than 30 min a year the 12V bat is grave yard dead now if I need it I jump it and move on with life...

A good excuse to have one of these...

https://www.amazon.com/Antigravity-Batteries-AG-XP-10-Multi-Function-Starter/dp/B00MQ5Z5F2

Click to expand...

Hobo,

You should check out that Amazon ad. Check the customer reviews. The thing is a counterfeit product. It has very bad reviews.

I did a quick google to post it, I buy them from my interstate battery distributor. I have sold quite a few only one had a issue and I knew it as soon as I hooked it up. The jumper leads did not fit tight. Customer had a dodge diesel the bat was dead as a door nail it had not been started in mounts because the bats were bad. It melted the connection were the leads go into the unit. Something that requires two bats to crank and they are grave yard dead I warn customers now not to use it. It took my tow truck that has two battery's and one of these to crank/start it...

Other than that its cranked every thing I have used it for even if the vehicle does not have a battery in it. All my motorsickel riding customers tote one its the smaller version.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxMnd6F1fZo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSinktWvBuQ

HFJ · May 8, 2017

(quoted from post at 02:49:50 05/08/17)
Hobo,

You should check out that Amazon ad. Check the customer reviews. The thing is a counterfeit product. It has very bad reviews.

my take on reading those reviews is that the product itself is genuine, but not all of the people listed on amazon are selling the real thing, but rather the knockoff instead.

Caryc · May 8, 2017

(quoted from post at 09:21:25 05/08/17)

(quoted from post at 02:49:50 05/08/17)
Hobo,

You should check out that Amazon ad. Check the customer reviews. The thing is a counterfeit product. It has very bad reviews.

Click to expand...

my take on reading those reviews is that the product itself is genuine, but not all of the people listed on amazon are
selling the real thing, but rather the knockoff instead.

Yes, the actual product is real, this one is not. That's why I said it's a counterfeit product. I went to AntigravityBatteries web site, (UK) and the real XP-10 sells for $239.37.

HFJ · May 8, 2017

again, i'll say it's my impression that the only issue here is which vendor u get it from. i read at least one review saying the product sold directly by amazon itself is genuine. and i have every reason to believe that when i see antigravity batteries themselves listed as a vendor, the product from THEM is legit as well

it's not the product, it's some of the sellers.

ps: the price from antigravity themselves, thru amazon, is also $166.

6shooter · May 8, 2017

(quoted from post at 19:21:49 05/04/17) When I first posted this picture, JMOR noticed that all my electrons
were running out on the ground. Indeed they were.

I ran it that way for a year while I was fixing all the other things.
Charged the battery about once a month, even though I was
cranking it and starting it for various things regularly.
This was all 6V.

Do you have a hydrometer to check the specific gravity in your
6V batteries? That's how you really know what shape they're in.
If you run the battery completely dead, I would expect it to come back.

Mine didn't turn out all that bad. Still had the same battery
when I sold it, and the new owner hasn't replaced it either.

Jeez, you took it looking at the top pick to looking like the bottom pick, that looks really good.

When you look for project tractors like that, what do you look for in them to make sure they are some what worth it to bring back to life. You really wouldn't be able to check block or head I suppose until it was torn apart?

Where we have some property the neighbor has a 600 series for sale sitting out by the street. Its been there for at least two years. I would like to do a restoration, but would like to make sure It could be put back together.

Royse · May 8, 2017

"When you look for project tractors like that, what do you look for in them"

There are a ton of things to look for price-wise.
Besides the engine, other big ticket items like tires and sheet metal.
A new hood for one of these runs about $1300.
If the engine isn't stuck, it will probably run again but not always.
I bought a running Jubilee with a back blade. Cheap. It knocked badly.
Turned out the crank would need to be replace (~$500) and the
head was cracked in 3 places (~$500) so I opted not to fix it.
But for the price, I was money ahead.
Tires and rims, hydraulic pump, transmission, good rear end
steering gear in good shape, good hydraulic lines etc.
A hydraulic pump is not cheap either!

Running without a generator.

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