Master Control Spring

Can anyone explain briefly what the top link control spring has to do with position control? Problems here are nothing new and adjustment and replacement has been discussed I just wanted to know how or why it affects position control.

On my 245 I mowed all season last year without problems. A month ago I tightened the top link to the mower to lift it high to block it up for blade service ( mower has the top link swivel for mower to articulate on ground). Anyway once the mower started to rise the lift stopped because it was pulling on the top link spring to hard I guess. The spring/yoke on this tractor is loose by maybe an 1/8" meaning I can pull it in/out and up/down about the same 1/8" or a little less. [/b]

I will include this problem was noticed a year ago or better but I think the swivel in the mower top link didn't make it a problem. I have since removed the control spring assembly, replaced the bolt/rod, adjuster nut and seal. I also noticed the washer with the hole in it that goes in first was missing and I got one of those too, not sure what the washer is for or if its needed. I don't have it together yet to test, I actually wouldn't mind if this never worked because I can't see needing to use draft control.

Is the 1/8" of slack in the yoke or in the spring? When you reassembled the new spring etc., you should do up the adjustment on the threaded bar that runs through the spring until you can only just turn the spring by hand, then lock everything off, and put everything back together.

Draft control is [i:aa542843fe]very[/i:aa542843fe] sensitive - there is a tale over here that an old boy used to bet someone he could lift a three furrow plough with one finger - having got a load of bets in, he would then walk to the back of his (running) tractor, and gently lift with one finger on the rearmost plough share - and the plough would lift.

A mate of mine over here has uploaded something similar to YouTube click here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvtFPwNPgAE

To answer your question though, if the top link is 'pushed' against the tractor, linkage internally will operate the lift on the three point, and if the top link is 'pulled' the internal linkage will lower the three point to maintain a constant draft on the plough (for example).

The advantage is that if your subsoil implement hits an obstruction, like a stump or rock, then the plough is lifted and safety for the driver is returned - this was why the Ferguson system was a revolution in farming.

Before this, dragged implements were responsible for killing a number of people every year when stumps/rocks/whatever were struck by the plough, and the tractor overturned backwards, squashing the driver.

Is the 1/8" of slack in the yoke or in the spring? When you reassembled the new spring etc., you should do up the adjustment on the threaded bar that runs through the spring until you can only just turn the spring by hand, then lock everything off, and put everything back together.

Draft control is [i:f8b139ce5c]very[/i:f8b139ce5c] sensitive - there is a tale over here that an old boy used to bet someone he could lift a three furrow plough with one finger - having got a load of bets in, he would then walk to the back of his (running) tractor, and gently lift with one finger on the rearmost plough share - and the plough would lift.

A mate of mine over here has uploaded something similar to YouTube click here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvtFPwNPgAE

To answer your question though, if the top link is 'pushed' against the tractor, linkage internally will operate the lift on the three point, and if the top link is 'pulled' the internal linkage will lower the three point to maintain a constant draft on the plough (for example).

The advantage is that if your subsoil implement hits an obstruction, like a stump or rock, then the plough is lifted and safety for the driver is returned - this was why the Ferguson system was a revolution in farming.

Before this, dragged implements were responsible for killing a number of people every year when stumps/rocks/whatever were struck by the plough, and the tractor overturned backwards, squashing the driver.

Maybe third time lucky . . . . .?

Is the 1/8" of slack in the yoke or in the spring? When you reassembled the new spring etc., you should do up the adjustment on the threaded bar that runs through the spring until you can only just turn the spring by hand, then lock everything off, and put everything back together.

Draft control is [i:ce2ab019ce]very[/i:ce2ab019ce] sensitive - there is a tale over here that an old boy used to bet someone he could lift a three furrow plough with one finger - having got a load of bets in, he would then walk to the back of his (running) tractor, and gently lift with one finger on the rearmost plough share - and the plough would lift.

A mate of mine over here has uploaded something similar to YouTube click here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvtFPwNPgAE

To answer your question though, if the top link is 'pushed' against the tractor, linkage internally will operate the lift on the three point, and if the top link is 'pulled' the internal linkage will lower the three point to maintain a constant draft on the plough (for example).

The advantage is that if your subsoil implement hits an obstruction, like a stump or rock, then the plough is lifted and safety for the driver is returned - this was why the Ferguson system was a revolution in farming.

Before this, dragged implements were responsible for killing a number of people every year when stumps/rocks/whatever were struck by the plough, and the tractor overturned backwards, squashing the driver.

The draft control is used for ground engaging 3 point equipment like a plow. The top link senses the load on the plow, and depending on how you set the draft. If you are plowing in soft ground it will plow at the depth you set it at, but if the plow hits a spot that harder it will raise the plow so the tractor wont start spinning the tires. Then when the load gets easy it lets the plow go back down. These days with the bigger tractors, and implements the draw bar type implements that use remote hydraulics are more popular. The 3 point these days aren't used as much as they used to be. I pull a 84" 3 point mower behind my 135, but I don't use the top link because I don't have the need to lift the mower way up in the air.

I guess the big question was why the master control spring affects the hydraulics when using position control. I understand the draft control uses and functions. It seems like it should have no bearing on position control. The spring on mine is loose and out of adjustment and that will not allow the implement to lift up all the way.

I am pretty sure once I put master control spring back together and adjusted correct the lift will work fine. I already kind of isolated the top link using a chain and the lift works all the way up.

When you raise the lift arms all the up with nothing hooked to them with the engine off, how fast do the lift arms drop on their own?

Is there a way to set the draft control so that the moldboard plow stays at an even
depth in the ground as the front and rear wheels come out of the furrow at the ends
of the field? What happens for me is when the front wheel comes out of the furrow the
plow sinks deeper, then as the rear wheel rises out the plow lifts out of the ground.
I would like it to stay at a constant depth until I am ready to raise the plow to
make the turn at the end of the field.

i really hope this posts this time - been having trouble with this thread for some reason . . .

Is the 1/8" of slack in the yoke or in the spring? When you reassembled the new spring etc., you should do up the adjustment on the threaded bar that runs through the spring until you can only just turn the spring by hand, then lock everything off, and put everything back together.

Draft control is [i:3085acc03e]very[/i:3085acc03e] sensitive - there is a tale over here that an old boy used to bet someone he could lift a three furrow plough with one finger - having got a load of bets in, he would then walk to the back of his (running) tractor, and gently lift with one finger on the rearmost plough share - and the plough would lift.

A mate of mine over here has uploaded something similar to YouTube click here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvtFPwNPgAE

To answer your question though, if the top link is 'pushed' against the tractor, linkage internally will operate the lift on the three point, and if the top link is 'pulled' the internal linkage will lower the three point to maintain a constant draft on the plough (for example).

The advantage is that if your subsoil implement hits an obstruction, like a stump or rock, then the plough is lifted and safety for the driver is returned - this was why the Ferguson system was a revolution in farming.

Before this, dragged implements were responsible for killing a number of people every year when stumps/rocks/whatever were struck by the plough, and the tractor overturned backwards, squashing the driver.

(quoted from post at 01:11:42 04/11/16) When you raise the lift arms all the up with nothing hooked to them with the engine off, how fast do the lift arms drop on their own?

Click to expand...

I will have to wait until I put it back together to see, but if my memory is correct the arms drop about half the speed of raising, or maybe a little slower. I'm going over a few other things so the tractor will be apart for a few weeks and then I can test and verify everything. Thanks for the reply

(quoted from post at 00:46:41 04/15/16) I will have to wait until I put it back together to see, but if my memory is correct the arms drop about half the speed of raising, or maybe a little slower. I'm going over a few other things so the tractor will be apart for a few weeks and then I can test and verify everything. Thanks for the reply

Click to expand...

If you have the lift cover off now, I would highly recommend replacing the seals in the lift cylinder. As long the piston, and cylinder is in good shape, or if they look rough now's the time to fix that. That cylinder is leaking down pretty bad, it shouldn't leak down that fast.

If you have the lift cover off now, I would highly recommend replacing the seals in the lift cylinder. As long the piston, and cylinder is in good shape, or if they look rough now's the time to fix that. That cylinder is leaking down pretty bad, it shouldn't leak down that fast.

Click to expand...

I'm sorry I didn't understand what you were asking. I thought you meant to lower the lift with the position handle ( don't ask why I thought that, it's just how I read it the first time)

Anyway, the lift arms will keep themselves up for a long time, takes a couple days. Last time I did that it took all weekend for them to drop. It will hold up a 6ft mower for several hours even when hot. I don't have the lift cover off, just took off the top clevis and spring assy.

Your lift cylinder is good then if it takes a weekend for the lift arms to drop with nothing hooked to them (plus being able to hold a 6' mower up for several hours).

Im bringing this one back up, had some other things to worry about and put this project to the side. Anyway I have the spring assy adjusted, spring still turns but need a firm grip, I think that's good or the way it is suppose to be?

Now when I install everything and tighten the spanner nut, it doesn't seem like the spanner nut goes into the top cover very far before the slack in the clevis goes away. Basically half of the spanner nut is still sticking out of the top cover, or not threaded in. Is this normal, or do I need to keep tightening it down?

I forgot to mention, when I took it apart the old spanner nut was close to flush inside the top cover, with the lip for the seal being about the only part of the nut sticking out. I also noticed I did not have the spacer/washer with the offset hole that goes down inside the spring cavity, its the first piece that goes in, or last piece out. I don't know what this spacer is for but it was missing when I took it apart, the small offset hole is for a rod that comes out of the top cover. It seems with this spacer installed that the spanner nut would not need to tighten as far for proper adjustment so maybe I'm ok now?

I forgot to mention, when I took it apart the old spanner nut was close to flush inside the top cover, with the lip for the seal being about the only part of the nut sticking out. I also noticed I did not have the spacer/washer with the offset hole that goes down inside the spring cavity, its the first piece that goes in, or last piece out. I don't know what this spacer is for but it was missing when I took it apart, the small offset hole is for a rod that comes out of the top cover. It seems with this spacer installed that the spanner nut would not need to tighten as far for proper adjustment so maybe I'm ok now? The spacer I'm talking about is labeled as an overload stop in the manual.