4020 Turbo Questions

Glen D Anderson · Jul 20, 2017

Hello,

Several questions for those who have installed &/or who are running turbo chargers on their 4020 diesels:

1/ Comp. ratio - Anyone running a turbo with aftermarket "high compression" pistons? (ex. Reliance's 17.65:1 pistons)

2/ Boost - What numbers are you seeing? What turbo are you running? Any other mods. done to the unit like the inj. pump turned up, exhaust, etc.?

3/ Fuel consumption - What are your numbers? Please provide details if possible such as load conditions, etc.

FYI, the first 2 questions are simply pointed towards the compatibility of boost & elevated compression on the 4020.

Regarding question #3, I was looking at the threads with Tim S's impressive turbo upgrade & it has me wondering if there would be enough of an increase in economy to pay for the parts / machining & eventually save money. Of course this all assuming that you could perform the mod. yourself(no labor charges), you are not asking more out the tractor than what it's capable of, & that you are using the tractor often / burning enough fuel in the first place.

Thanks in advance,

Glen

buickanddeere · Jul 20, 2017

(quoted from post at 15:28:36 07/20/17) Hello,

Several questions for those who have installed &/or who are running turbo chargers on their 4020 diesels:

1/ Comp. ratio - Anyone running a turbo with aftermarket "high compression" pistons? (ex. Reliance's 17.65:1 pistons)

2/ Boost - What numbers are you seeing? What turbo are you running? Any other mods. done to the unit like the inj. pump turned up, exhaust, etc.?

3/ Fuel consumption - What are your numbers? Please provide details if possible such as load conditions, etc.

FYI, the first 2 questions are simply pointed towards the compatibility of boost & elevated compression on the 4020.

Regarding question #3, I was looking at the threads with Tim S's impressive turbo upgrade & it has me wondering if there would be enough of an increase in economy to pay for the parts / machining & eventually save money. Of course this all assuming that you could perform the mod. yourself(no labor charges), you are not asking more out the tractor than what it's capable of, & that you are using the tractor often / burning enough fuel in the first place.

Thanks in advance,

Glen

The increase in thermal efficiency or Horse Power per gallon of fuel per hour will be a few percent at most.
Turbo kits were made to increase HP.

Glen D Anderson · Jul 20, 2017

Thanks for the reply....

I have fair understanding of the theory as it applies on paper as well. An increase in efficiency of 2-3% wouldn't be worth the expense & effort which is why I'm curious to hear from those who have been there & done that.

The increase in thermal efficiency or Horse Power per gallon of fuel per hour will be a few percent at most.
Turbo kits were made to increase HP.

tim s · Jul 20, 2017

Glen, I have not matched a turbo up with the higher compression pistons yet, we have been running kits like the one I pictured for 40 years or so,as for the pumps about all they got was the leaf spring tightened up, they have been running at about 130 HP, not wicked but nice and strong,,fuel use was maybe up a bit if it worked hard,but we have never done a good study on that.It is worth the effort and the rest of the tractor deals with it all well. The clearance on the hood is close,but the one we run at the home farm has not had the paint burnt off of it yet, and it spins a big feed grinder all winter.

Glen D Anderson · Jul 20, 2017

Thanks Tim, I appreciate the info.!

130 HP is pretty impressive! It'd sure be interesting to know the fuel consumption numbers with factory max. fuel settings.

Regarding the high comp. pistons, I just read your post on the 4240 with piston to head clearance issues & found it very interesting. Amazing that the line boring could change the piston height relative to the deck without completely messing up the camshaft / crankshaft gear backlash. Certainly one to "try" to keep in the memory bank.... LOL

Not sure if the info. is accurate but I read on the 'net that the compression ratio for the 4240 is 17:1? Thinking out loud here but since you had issues with too much compression after the line bore I might have trouble too if I boosted our 4020 with 17.65:1 pistons? FWIW, cranking compression on that engine was 380 - 400 PSI after installing the new high compression pistons(cylinder packs). I can only assume those numbers have gone up as the engine breaks in......

(quoted from post at 14:57:40 07/20/17) Glen, I have not matched a turbo up with the higher compression pistons yet, we have been running kits like the one I pictured for 40 years or so,as for the pumps about all they got was the leaf spring tightened up, they have been running at about 130 HP, not wicked but nice and strong,,fuel use was maybe up a bit if it worked hard,but we have never done a good study on that.It is worth the effort and the rest of the tractor deals with it all well. The clearance on the hood is close,but the one we run at the home farm has not had the paint burnt off of it yet, and it spins a big feed grinder all winter.

tim s · Jul 20, 2017

You need to keep in mind that the cam gear is off set from center..I am not completely sure of why that all happened the way it did,,but all is well with it now. I put the increased pistons in a 3020 a couple months ago and it ran way better than most of them..

Glen D Anderson · Jul 20, 2017

Yeah, I hear ya. It's nice to know the cause of a problem but sometimes a guy is just grateful that a problem is fixed.

What brand of high comp. kits have you been running in your rebuilds?

(quoted from post at 16:23:45 07/20/17) You need to keep in mind that the cam gear is off set from center..I am not completely sure of why that all happened the way it did,,but all is well with it now. I put the increased pistons in a 3020 a couple months ago and it ran way better than most of them..

tim s · Jul 20, 2017

Reliance kits, but I have only used the higher sets in 4020/3020's,,they are not available for some models,,probably because they would be too much..

Glen D Anderson · Jul 21, 2017

Have you had any issues with the Reliance kits?

Reason I ask is the std. rod bearings that came in the "high comp" kit that I installed in our '72 4020 were too thick to install in the engine. The Reliance inserts measured between .0005" & .0007" thicker than either an OEM or FP(Federal Mogul) insert. Oil clearance on some journals measured less than .0015" with the Reliance inserts so I returned them to the store & installed FP bearings instead.

Not sure if that was just an isolated Q.C. issue or if it's common place? You could very likely get away with the thicker shells on cranks that are at the smaller end of their specs. but definitely not on the bigger side.......

tim s · Jul 21, 2017

No issues at all with their kits,,and rod size should always be corrected to "Standard size",,the inner diameter is what changes. I always identify my crank size before making an order,,and I always re-size the rods with new pin bushings,,out of 12 major O/H"s the past 6 months the only issue I have had was that darn 4050 and the pistons running too high,,a Wild Card tossed into the mix..Darn it,,but that all worked out good..

Glen D Anderson · Jul 21, 2017

That's good to hear. I guess the rod bearings I got in my kit must've been the exception. The original bearings that were in the engine were std. & the replacements I got in the kit were std. as well. I also check the big ends on my rods & replace & resize the small end bushings during an O/H but that wasn't the issue here. The problem was that the new bearings were physically too thick.

During any O/H I religiously measure the thickness of all new bearing shells with a micrometer that has a spherical anvil. Just a habit I learned from the shop I apprenticed at. Every once in a blue moon they said they had run accross an improperly packaged or even improperly manufactured bearing. This was the first time I'd actually found anything wrong with a new bearing out of the box.

Thinking back to the job, I wonder if the bearings were actually manufactured as .001" undersize units but had been somehow stamped wrong?

4020 Turbo Questions

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