I committed a grievous sin! 52 John Deere A

MARV2015

Member
I committed a grievous sin! I got this 1952 "A" and started working on it. First step was to get it "UN-STUCK" ! That went well -then a couple of nice things got fixed or replaced -Starter -changed system to 12 volts -put on an alternator -got the hydraulics working -even put on an aftermarket 3-point hitch.
All was well until a few days ago when I fired it up and wanted to parkt it in a different spot so I could get to my 5th wheel camper and use it.
On that fateful afternoon -I moved the "A" and just as i was about to shut it down it started running funny! It then stopped completely and would not even turn over with the starter. I took the starter cover off and tried to turn the flywheel with a big crow bar. It was STUCK!
My sin was that when i changed the oil and the oil filter I guess I put in detergent oil! I have been informed that by doing so -all that sludge that has accumulated has come loose and is now plugging up the works!
Well I should say so! Today I got the top cover off and pulled the rod cap on the # 1 piston. Boy was it stuck to the crank!

Now I can see the error in my ways! Dang I did not want to go into the crankcase but now I have to!

Here is my first question for you experts out there -How do I get the old babbit off the crank and cap?? Power grinder??? Hammer and chisle?
Second -What do I put back in another layer of babbit or do I just get a real bearing and install a new set? How do I know what size the old crank journal was and just how far do I or might I need to take the crankshaft down??
Any help would be appreciated! I could not believe the sludge in the bottom of that crankcase! Felt like slippery mud! I had to retrieve a pair of end cutters when I was removing the cottor pins!!!
 
Starter changed system to 12 volts, IT WAS !@ VOLT FROM FACTORY. now the detergent oil, that did not make your problem, something else did, And being that year it should have had the insert bearings instead of babbit.
 
Most likely that sludge in the crankcase locked up the oil pump and snapped the square oil pump drive shaft coupling. Pull the rod inserts, on the back it will tell you what undersize bearings are in it, if any. If babbit is stuck to the crank, sounds like it will need to be pulled and checked at the machine shop.
 
There is no way that amount of runtime loosened and ruined pump, something else was wrong from the start.
 
(quoted from post at 14:13:41 06/27/17)

...
Here is my first question for you experts out there -How do I get the old babbit off the crank and cap?? Power grinder??? Hammer and chisle?

When I bought my 620 it had spun one of the rod inserts on #2 and locked up. I did a bunch of internet research and came up with this: Hit the edge of the babbitt patch with the flame of an acetylene torch until the edge starts to lift. Peel off the lifted edge with a knife or other sharp object. Heat the edge of the patch again until the edge starts to lift, and peel that off. Repeat (and repeat and repeat) until the babbitt patch is gone. Then polish with fine crocus or emery cloth--600 or better. Takes a while but it works with no damage to the crank. My journal still measured within spec so it went back together with standard bearings and has run great for years.
 

Your rod bearing spun because the "O-ring" JD calls a gasket swelled and blocked the oil passage at the Main bearing...
 
I have heard of 2x JD466 motor and 1x 619 locking up because detergent oil has brought all the sludge on the pump screen and restricted oil flow.
Need to rince the block with reputable product before converting to detergent oil.
 
Ron - I don't think the model A had the o-ring. Don't they have the lines directly to the main bearing housing where it protrudes through the block?
 
Don't believe oil had anything to do with it...your engine was probably trashed out before you started using....just played out on your watch....
 
Bushog Papa, If (and only if)(serial number 694828 and up) his late A had 1 piece main bearing housings, they would NOT have an O-ring to seal the oil passage between the main case and main bearing housing. That configuration didn't start until serial number 6025000 on the 60 series. The main bearing housings on an A were fed directly via an oil line.
Please check your facts before spreading mis-information
 
Well I'm sorry for the "changed to 12 v" comment! What I meant to say was I now have an alternator instead of the old generator!
I know this had nothing to do with it seizing up.
I am pretty sure that a change in oil did. When I initially had it running the oil pressure guage did show pressure -usually in the low to medium area.
When I took the inspection plate off the top of the crankcase I was trying to take the rod cap nuts off when I dropped the side cutters. I had cut the cotter pins and was in process of removing them when I dropped the side cutters.
When I retrieved them from the bottom of the crank case all the oil was very black and actually felt like it was lumpy!
I had changed the oil and installed a new filter early on in the project. I actually had it running for approximately 10 hours total from when I first fired it up back in December.
SO - I have a parts "A" and I am going to take the crank and rods off it first!
May learn how to do it on the practice tractor!
 
One thing I would recommend to you....issssssss remember this is a hobby with ooooollllllddddd equipment and no point to beat yourself up.
 
I made an error and I'm reminding myself that when I was in the Air Force -That's why we had checklists! To help us to not forget the important things!
I did change the oil in the old girl but did not flush out the extra gunk! Well - the next old tractor I touch will not happen that way!
Yes on the hobby! I really did not want to screw up this tractor because it has some extra special meaning for me. So - I will take my lumps in stride and fix it! Shows that even "Old Guys" with so much knowledge locked up inside still make mistakes!
Now when I am finished getting this "A" back in running order -it should be good for another 70 years!
 

Yes, i agree, an A or 60 is the same..

there may have been some confusion in the original post that led mt to my statement..

IF you are guiltless...CAST the 1st Stone...BUT, since you seem to have all the answers, YOU can go ahead and PASS ON your obviously Pristine personalities..

smart a$$es abound in here and it is getting profoundly worse..

Darned near never see any real answers other than."GET THE MANUAL"...

Definitely NOT what it was (as a site) just a few years ago..

SO, Excuse me all to HE$$....I am very SURE that most here have REAL IN THE FIELD 1st hand experience Operating these relics..

I guess I have passed on all I can offer....

I will be standing by, ready to give YOU the HORSE LAUGH, each and every time you make an error..(harmless as it was)..

Thanks for the reminder...we are NOT dealing with Rocket Scientists here, are we...?
 
(quoted from post at 09:18:30 06/30/17)
Yes, i agree, an A or 60 is the same..

there may have been some confusion in the original post that led mt to my statement..

IF you are guiltless...CAST the 1st Stone...BUT, since you seem to have all the answers, YOU can go ahead and PASS ON your obviously Pristine personalities..

smart a$$es abound in here and it is getting profoundly worse..

Darned near never see any real answers other than."GET THE MANUAL"...

Definitely NOT what it was (as a site) just a few years ago..

SO, Excuse me all to HE$$....I am very SURE that most here have REAL IN THE FIELD 1st hand experience Operating these relics..

I guess I have passed on all I can offer....

I will be standing by, ready to give YOU the HORSE LAUGH, each and every time you make an error..(harmless as it was)..

Thanks for the reminder...we are NOT dealing with Rocket Scientists here, are we...?

BrushogPapa, I recall last year when I was having an issue with my A and the standard answers were not doing the trick and you gave me the benefit of some "field engineered solutions" that you had tried which got me on the path to solving my problem. I appreciate all the help I have gotten here over the years but I have from time to time seen replies that could have been phrased better. Now I know that mechanics can be a gruff group of people and this does not bother me too much but, and this is a big but, I can't help but notice there has been a decline in the number of post and posters in general. I would hope that the attitudes that sometimes come through are not driving people away as that would be a shame.
 
Ron - you've helped me several times with various problems, and I want you to know that I appreciate all of the advice you have freely given.
 

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