JD 300 industrial Hydraulic Issues

dboling

New User
Tractor JD 300 Industrial with 300B Loader. I added a woods 3pt mount backhoe.

Model: T4W3D
Serial: 080041T

Over all the hydraulics seem to be somewhat ok, however I have slowly developed a noise that seems to be coming from the hydraulic pump area. It took a while to find a reference to explain the noise, however it sounds like spinning a ratchet in you hand with an extension and hearing the teeth click to each tooth, it slowly winds down when turning ignition off. The sound also could be explained at a card in a bike spoke and slows down when key is turned off.
I replaced both hydraulic filters at the trans and pulled the trans screen and the pump screen and both where very clean. While the pump screen was out I removed the plug above it (suction valve ?) and pushed the valve up from the screen side and fluid flowed through the screen side just fine and the valve moved very easy. I also replaced the o-rings on the manual destroke valve. Since I don't own a manual or hydraulic pressure gauge (Not in budget right now :( ) I took out my stethoscope and tried to track the noise down. the only noise I could find was coming from the reservoir line from the tank to the pump. Now this is weird, the noise was coming from the pump side of the hose, not the pump hose fitting, not the upper section of the hose or the tank.

I think the pump is a 2000 series, but not sure, haven't found serial numbers yet.

I also have some questions on the rear remote, but we'll get to that.
 
I have a 300 and a 300B. Both have the big USA/Dubuque pumps but as I recall, some 300s have the little German pump. If the
driveshaft is splined, it is the USA/Dubuque pump. I would check the pump drive before anything else. The four plastic
bushings and the iron coupler at the pump shaft. Splines on my coupler on the 300 went completely this summer after making
noise for awhile. Luckily, no damage to the pump shaft. Put in a new coupler and all was fine.
 

The pumps front cover has the following numbers "R42663"

Here are some pictures. Remember is was only a $2500. tractor without the backhoe.

Not sure if pictures will make it.
 
I would thoroughly check out the drive coupling. The rubber bushings can go bad, and on those, it seemed like the splined coupler that slides on the pump shaft can wear out and cause noise. Eventually, the
splines wear out, and you are stuck somewhere with no hydraulics. I know that feeling well...

Does the noise stop with engine rotation? Or does it continue a bit after the engine has stopped???
 

noise stops with engine, but hard to tell since I'm in the drivers seat.

I bought the tractor about 3 - 4 years ago and the hydraulics where a lot better than they are now. The reverser has always been sluggish going into gear. The guy I bought it from had just done an engine change over.

I recently noticed another noise that sounded like valve a opening and closing real fast, but would go away when operating operating anything hydraulic and would come right back after I stopped.
 


Let see if images get up here.

49659.jpg
49660.jpg
49661.jpg
49662.jpg
 

I finally managed to get some pictures up here, but forgot to comment them.

The second picture shows the left side of the pump. I used my stethoscope all over the pump and the only noise that sounds abnormal is at the the hose to the rear with the hose clamp, the hose is about 1 and a half feet long, when placing the stethoscope on the hose fitting at the pump there was no noise, but placing the stethoscope on the hose just above the fitting there was an awful sounding noise, but placing the stethoscope on the hose a few inches above the filling to the reservoir where is connects there was no noise at all.

I don't think that to coupler is an issue as it should make a more solid sounding noise, not playing cards in bicycle spoke sounding noise and I don't really notice the noise until I shut off the engine.

There is also an image of the remote selector that I suspect is an issue with the hydraulic system as is seems somehow out of adjustment. The lever will not lock back to the rear and where is locks in the center there doesn't seem to be any hydraulic flow unless I move the lever an inch or so, then I can see the line to the backhoe jump. The lever does lock forward and I'm guessing that shuts flow off ?

I can't seem to find a break down on the selector or I would have tried to repair it.
 


After thinking about it, this kinda make sense.
The pump seems nice and quite until I open the destroke valve.

It doesn't actually make the card in spike noise until I shut off the engine, I guess it could be cracked and grabbing the pump shaft while in use and skipping splines when engine is turned off.

did you experience a gradual loss in hydraulic usage before it went out and did it make noise ?
 

I bought the backhoe used. it was on a Bobcat with an equalizer valve attached and open center system.

I contacted Woods and John Deere before I installed the backhoe.
It took Wood sometime to come up with a plug to convert the backhoe into closed center, I also purchased a 3 point adapter so it would fit on the tractor.

The backhoe hydraulics are connected to the remote pictured. Since the remote won't lock into position, I use a bungee to hold the lever back.
 

I took a quick look at the pump connector last night and I'm going to check to see if the bolts are tight. Maybe I'll get lucky.
 

The reference manual I found online shows that the machine came with one of the following pumps.

1000 series
11 cm3
23 cm3

2000 series
40 cm3
50 cm3

I found a front destroke plate in the manual that closely matched what I was working on and is was located in the series 2000 section.

Not sure of the exact pump model.
 
The two little German pumps are key-way drive, not splined and are .67 or 1.4 cubic-inches per rev. Sorry, I do not like nor
use the revised metric cm designators.

You have the USA pump, non-metric, original, and either 2.4 or 3 cubic-inch-per-rev. Does not matter, most parts are the same
for either. The old stroke-control valve housing with the charge-pressure port blocked off tells me it is an original pump.
 

Ok, I crawled under the beast to see if the pump connector bolts were tight.

The pump side bolts took 1 - 1/2 turns each

The engine side which clamps around the pins also took 1 - 1 1/2 turns each.

The noise has now changed, but to me still doesn't sound good. I'll try and create a quick mp4 so your not guessing at the noise.

As always when I run the hydraulics it drags the engine idle way down.
 

Wasn't easy to get 12 meg mp4 size down to 1.5 meg

The tractor sounds as it should until I open the destroke valve.
If I bring the idle up it doesn't try and stall the tractor quite so much.

I don't know if mp4 is going to make it to post, I can't see it in preview.
 
(quoted from post at 14:11:55 06/13/17)
Wasn't easy to get 12 meg mp4 size down to 1.5 meg

The tractor sounds as it should until I open the destroke valve.
If I bring the idle up it doesn't try and stall the tractor quite so much.

I don't know if mp4 is going to make it to post, I can't see it in preview.


[video play=false:95f42fb659]http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/photos/49679.jpg[/video:95f42fb659]

What a pain to get video up, had to send it as .jpg image then change the tags to video.
 

Not sure what SCV is ?

To be honest, I'm not sure where the positions the the rear selector are, I'm guessing lever full forward is off, middle is flow one way and all the way to the rear is flow the other way.
Under the valve box is another knob and I don't know what that does.

The tractor does move with flow to the backhoe.
 
(quoted from post at 13:19:51 06/14/17)
Not sure what SCV is ?

To be honest, I'm not sure where the positions the the rear selector are, I'm guessing lever full forward is off, middle is flow one way and all the way to the rear is flow the other way.
Under the valve box is another knob and I don't know what that does.

The tractor does move with flow to the backhoe.

Middle should be no flow on the selective control valve SCV. Shuting flow off to backhoe would verify the problem was there or elsewhere .
 

Since the SCV lever does not line up correctly when operating and the rear and middle position are controlling flow, it sounds like the SCV has issues. Do you know what the knob on the bottom
rear of the SCV valve is for ?

Does anybody have a schematic of the valve ?
 
(quoted from post at 21:44:36 06/23/17)
Do you know what the knob on the bottom
rear of the SCV valve is for ?

Does anybody have a schematic of the valve ?

You can view parts catalog schematics at JDparts .com. Short handle(turtle-rabbit) is for hyd flow control.
 

I was able to find the schematic by searching for 300 industrial.
Thanks for the info...

I decided disassemble the SCV for inspection. The valves looked like they were seating pretty well, they had a nice clean ring around the seats. The seals didn't look to bad, but should be replaced. The only real problem I could see is with the detent.
Although I wasn't able to remove the dents snap ring to remove the assembly, the dent had no spring tension and was sticking when pushed to the top. Also the O-ring at the that lower section of the port has swelled due to the guide cup not being pushed to the lower end of the dent port. I know a broken dent spring will keep the lever from locking in place, but do you think the dent alignment cup not being seated into it's O-ring would cause enough excessive fluid bleed by to affect the hydraulic system ?

I also hope it doesn't matter which holes the valve go into and my dog got excited and knocked them off the picnic table ?
 
Here's an update on my hydraulic issue...

I found multiple problems that contributed the hydraulic issues and pump noise.

The return line that goes into the bottom of the oil cooler had a small hole from rubbing the pressure line that provides pressure to the steering, scv and accumulator. Neither line was leaking fluid so it wasn't easy to spot.

One of the hydraulic drive bushings was worn out and wearing into one of the half clamps causing a clicking noise when shutting off the engine. I'm re-leaved the clicking noise wasn't the pistons in the pump.

The SCV valve was way out of adjustment and had a broken valve that manually slows the SVC fluid flow for use on different implements. The dent that was in the SCV is hydraulically operated and doesn't use a spring so I installed the newest updated version that does use a spring. Of course the SCV got a complete seal kit.

I replaced both shifter boots since the service guy at John Deere said bad boots will fill the hydraulic system with water when it rains and I couldn't figure out why after 2 hydraulic fluid changes in a year, my fluid was still a bit creamy.

At the JD service guys suggestion, I will be looking for a ported filter housing so I can bypass the tranny when operating the SCV.

Anybody know if supertrac 303 fluid I've been using it ok for my JD300 ?
 
(quoted from post at 19:32:19 08/07/17) Here's an update on my hydraulic issue...

I found multiple problems that contributed the hydraulic issues and pump noise.

The return line that goes into the bottom of the oil cooler had a small hole from rubbing the pressure line that provides pressure to the steering, scv and accumulator. Neither line was leaking fluid so it wasn't easy to spot.

One of the hydraulic drive bushings was worn out and wearing into one of the half clamps causing a clicking noise when shutting off the engine. I'm re-leaved the clicking noise wasn't the pistons in the pump.

The SCV valve was way out of adjustment and had a broken valve that manually slows the SVC fluid flow for use on different implements. The dent that was in the SCV is hydraulically operated and doesn't use a spring so I installed the newest updated version that does use a spring. Of course the SCV got a complete seal kit.

I replaced both shifter boots since the service guy at John Deere said bad boots will fill the hydraulic system with water when it rains and I couldn't figure out why after 2 hydraulic fluid changes in a year, my fluid was still a bit creamy.

At the JD service guys suggestion, I will be looking for a ported filter housing so I can bypass the tranny when operating the SCV.

Anybody know if supertrac 303 fluid I've been using it ok for my JD300 ?

Thank you for the update, we like hearing progress and success. While we purchase Hy-Gard here for the little bit of oil we go through. Last July we listened to a JD wizard at the NY Expo that swears by a Shell Transmission hydraulic oil. If it came down to believing myself or that particular wizard , I would probably believe the wizard.
Don't know if the link will work but went to the Shell site and did a search for a 2040 which close enough to your tractor.

Transmission Premium Spirax S4 TXM or
Standard Rotella HD Tractor Fluid


http://www.shell.ca/en_ca/motorists/oils-lubricants/lubematch.html#iframe=L2NhL2VuX1VTL2VxdWlwbWVudC9hZ3JpY3VsdHVyYWwvd2hlZWxlZF90cmFjdG9ycy9qb2huX2RlZXJlLzIwNDBfRUZ0OFBsR0xG
 

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