Turning up a 4650?

Craig C

Member
We are trying to get our planter tractor finished up and ready to put the duals back on. We rebuilt the engine, (inframe). Had the head worked, and new injectors. Other than just being time according to the clock to do this work, the planter was really kicking its rear end last year pulling hills. I'm not for sure what the whole rig weighs, but probably 45-50,000 lbs loaded. The tractor still didn't seem as quick as any of our fleet of 4440/55s. So we turned the pump up one turn of the screw. It helped, but would like a little more. Does anyone have a close estimate as to where I'm at now. I really want this 46 to feel like a 48 or 49. I talked to the local Deere dealer and they wouldn't run it on a dyno. Evidently the old tractors tend to turn it over. They said to call the Caseih dealer, but no one was willing to bring the dyno to a service call. Looks like it would be easier to haul a dyno than a 20,000 lb tractor. Also I have a question about pump timing. Were these engines know to wear enough in the timing gears to need to check pump timing. We did not remove the pump. Once upon a time we had a couple good fuel shops local. Now it's a 100 miles to a repair shop.
 
with out a dyno you really have no idea what your doing. i just did a ford new holland today and when i "turned it up" a 1/4 turn it went backwards and dropped 30 horse never tried going any more, turned it back out 1/4 turn from original position and got same reading as 1/4 turn in. got it back where it was originally and left it alone. they are all different and there are to many variables.

my guess is your between 3 and 300
 
Hi
As was said before the dyno is the only way you will know whats happening, under and over fuel will hurt power. The I gave it 3 turns guys could over fuel and not gain anything other than more smoke. Smoke don't always equal power. Something else to consider is turbo wear and maybe the boost is low, I've seen that on a few farm and pulling tractors over the years and unless a gauge is fitted you won't really know what the boost actually is. Air filter elements are a consumable item to, not just blow out and put back for a few years L.O.L.

I worked for a custom guy part time that had a German IH 1255. the pump was opened years ago to 1455 spec. After silage additive somehow ended up in the fuel it destroyed the pumps on a few machines. the dealer guy fitted a new pump and dyno'd it, he opened the screw and came up 25 hp short of 1455 power,It simply would not go what ever he did. He asked the boss when it last had new air filters, answer don't know we blow them out every day in season. The guy dropped in new filters it opened up around 40 hp just doing that and no adjustment, the guy turned the screw back in and hit the power mark we wanted . I hope your maintenance is better than that but a guys got to ask sometimes.
regards Robert
 
We bought a 4055 out of Ohio that the dealer said he thought we would like. Not sure what the previous owner did, but we sure like the 215hp we are getting out of it on our dyno. We wouldn't want 1hp less. It is like a sports car (light, agile, and powerful)
 
I think we are pretty good on air and boost. I've just always tried to compare it to a 4440 that we have that was juiced up when it was relatively new. We pulled implements with it that were way too big for it. It is loaded with weighs, fluid, and 20.8 duals. It would spin out with a load, but not give up. All I am getting at is that, if a 4440 with no intercooler, can take it for 6800hrs( and still doing it). This 46, with bigger radiator and intercooler should be able to develope more and still live long.
 
(quoted from post at 07:58:38 02/09/16) We bought a 4055 out of Ohio that the dealer said he thought we would like. Not sure what the previous owner did, but we sure like the 215hp we are getting out of it on our dyno. We wouldn't want 1hp less. It is like a sports car (light, agile, and powerful)

Let's see here. A natural aspirated 7.6L rated at 114 pto HP in a chassis rated for 148HP and your 4055 is "making" 215HP .on whose dyno and for how long before something breaks ?
If a turbo was added , I doubt anybody had the foresight to also install an intercooler.
What is the EGT at 215HP ?
 
Not been around many 4055s but they had a turbo.
Checking in parts catalog, the 4050 was the one
that could have had a 359, 466NA, or a 466 w
turbo. I'm I doubt that frame tractor has enough
cooling capacity for 215, but I believe it's possible to
see it for short periods. They can get over a 100
out of a 4.5L engine with a turbo, so I wouldn't sell
anything with a 466 short.
 
There is an Annaroid (that Rhyme's with Hemorrhoid and abt. the same pain ), on top of that pump, take out the big Allen screw ,you will see a brake type adjusting wheel . Turn it in so it goes down in the bottom of the hole . Then hang onto your hat cause you wont know you have the same tractor . Just an after thought , I worked on these tractors and not very often would it take more than 1/4 turn . They will live a long time at 220 but don't gut it .
 
Don's got it right,, and don't waste your time on an inter cooler,,,and B&D is sounding like a school teacher that won't let you go out side with out your hat ;^)
 
(quoted from post at 11:18:23 02/09/16) Don's got it right,, and don't waste your time on an inter cooler,,,and B&D is sounding like a school teacher that won't let you go out side with out your hat ;^)

It's that caution from the nuclear industry. People get grumpy if we keep dialling the power up until she fails .
I never cared for the repair bills after pushing something too hard and breaking it.
 
Yep somebody acts like the taxpayers are having to buy the parts. So will the android valve help it come up quicker?
 
buckanddeere seems to be a doubter on what a 4055 can be asked to do. No one suggested that it would be required to use all of the HP all of the time. It is most heavily
used to pull 5 x 20" plows at 7-8mph. Just like a car with a little grunt, it isn't pushed all of the time, but it sure is nice to have when needed. The tractor has been
100 % reliable for our use. We have a few other Deeres and each has it's purpose. The dyno was our own and it is accurate and used to check the health of all of our
tractors from time to time. 4055's came factory stock with a turboed 466 engine.
 
I think I heard that promised in the debates ! LOL. Free parts for your tractors ! Yipee !
 

Accessing a parts book at work is not practical practical. I took a stab and eroded with what Father's 4050 has in it, a NA 7.6 . It does happen to have the same ring and pinion as the 4450 and the same rear axle dia as the 4450 iirc. There did vary several times with serial number breaks.
 
Tim S would know for sure on this engine, but advancing the pump on the 4020 really lit it up.
 
It's that caution from the nuclear industry. People get grumpy if we keep dialling the power up until she fails.

I hear ya, but if your place is anything like ours, the "engine" is capable of about 300% of "transmission" efficiency, so ya gotta be careful.

Still amazed by "run to failure" equipment categories...
 
we purchased our first 4630PS about 5 years ago. It was a bit of a dog. First and best thing we did was back the aneroid off at least one turn. I tried removing the rod, and it might have been a little better, but really smoked. The pump shop that gave me that advice said it'd never be enough smoke to hurt anything, but I went back to putting the rod back in, and leaving the aneroid backed off. Also turned the pump one turn in, and ran it that way for 3 years in front of a PTO tub grinder running the guts out of it. also used it to break up hay fields with a disc in the spring. We bought the tractor with an estimated 12,000 hours on it and no overhaul.

Last winter I decided to go into it and overhaul it for fear of having a cylinder score. Got into it, and the cylinders really weren't that bad. It easily had a few thousand hours left in it. Bearings weren't too bad either.

I threw it back together, and backed the fuel back off to stock settings. Took it to the local vermeer dealer where I'd been doing alot of business, put it on their dyno and it broke it before they could get a reading.

Took it to the deere dealer, and it dyno'd at 168hp with stock fuel. Told them to turn it in one turn, and it put down 186hp (this is on a 404) I had them leave it alone. It pulls great there.

Have another 4630 Quad Range, it'll outpull the powershift, but I've never had it dyno'd. Should the paint be burned off the hood by the turbo? lol

These engines are capable of much more than rated HP, and will handle it well. Just don't get stupid crazy.
 
We had new 4020s and very few would put out much over 100H.P.We turbo charged some of them and it increased horsepower 25%.Then that wasn't enough so we got 4520,4320,6030,&4840 before we went to 4WD and only the 4840 and 6030 had what I would call enough power to cause traction issues where it took more weight.The newer trucks and tractors are the same way as it takes fuel to make power.The biggest problem with too much power is the person sitting in the seat.
 

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