JD 3020 w/ JD 146 front loader hyd hookup ?

lightfoot500 · Jun 29, 2014

hi, we have had our 3020 hooked to this bucket for quite a while and it does a couple things. when raising the bucket, it acts like it doesnt get a constant strong hydraulic oil supply to the lines. it will chatter and jump on the way up, sort of like it is low on fluid, which i dont believe it is. secondly, when the clutch is pushed in for almost a minute or so, it will act like it is completely out of oil, and wont raise at all, until foot is off the clutch for several seconds. again acting like it is low on hyd oil. possibly the reservoir on the tractor isnt big enough for this bucket ? four photos showing where the oil lines are plumbed in at. my finger is pointing at the same line from the controls and into the tractor. one with out the finger is also the same line, which you will see is plumbed into the back of the tractor next to the auxiliary hydraulic ports on the back of the tractor.
does anyone know if there is better ports on the 3020 to hook up to that these shown in the pics ?

D- · Jun 29, 2014

Return oil to filter housing. You can drill and tap or obtain ported cover.

jeremy in NE · Jun 29, 2014

If it is a synchro the pump in the tranny is weak. This causes the problems when you have the clutch pushed in

lightfoot500 · Jun 29, 2014

ok, i am gonna add a video of what it does.
the pump in the tranny, to replace it does the axle need split or is it easily accessible ?
what would be the point of returning the oil to the filter housing ? could this be caused by the return being restricted some how ?

i put a video on you tube but cant get the link to paste here. my username is 7digitalsunday and i only have one video on the tractor, the name of the video is 0629141234 so search under that number and it should pop up.

Tx Jim · Jun 29, 2014

(quoted from post at 12:17:42 06/29/14) Return oil to filter housing. You can drill and tap or obtain ported cover.

Or you can return hyd oil to rockshaft return oil circuit and not have to contend with hyd hose when trying to get hyd oil filter cap to seal..

buickanddeere · Jun 29, 2014

(quoted from post at 11:36:02 06/29/14)

Has the "running out of oil" and vibration problem with the clutch engaged always existed or is getting worse?
These 10 and 20 series Waterloo tractors run out of oil when the clutch is depressed which shuts down the transmission hydraulic pump.
iirc the Dubuques and Mannheims always spin the hydraulic pump even with the clutch depressed.
Who even made the hydraulic connections to the tractor did it half correct and half wrong. The direct "T" into the high pressure line to supply the loader valves is correct.
The hydraulic return line directly back into the transmission case is a jackleg affair. txjim has kindly included the instructions and an image of how to properly return oil from high demand hydraulic loads. This will vastly reduce problems due to a worn transmission pump. And maintain some oil flow to the front pump when the clutch is depressed.
This would also be a good time to check for oil flow from the loader control valve's return line that is currently connected into the transmission case.
If there is any oil flow when neither of the loader valves are being operated. There is either an open center valve being used. The closed center valve has failed a seal. Or there is a relief valve in there set for less than 2300psi.

lightfoot500 · Jun 29, 2014

buickanddeere, i would say the problem is getting worse but it has always been there to a certain degree. very interesting about the different models not working with depressed clutch. i would guess this is a waterloo.
I'll work on replumbing the return line.
how hard is it to get the pump out ?

Tx Jim · Jun 29, 2014

(quoted from post at 14:01:44 06/29/14) [
iirc the Dubuques and Mannheims always spin the hydraulic pump even with the clutch depressed.

b&d
Not exactly on JD utility(Dubuque and Mannheim) tractors with dual stage clutch the trans pump stops turning if foot clutch is totally depressed to the stop

D- · Jun 29, 2014

Don't worry about the pump. New tractors would do the same. Doesn't mean pump is not worn but change the plumbing first.

tim s · Jun 29, 2014

Yes change the fittings ,,but before you plumb the return line in see if any oil is by passing while the loader valve is in nutrel..if the valve is bypassing it will still cause a problem..

D- · Jun 30, 2014

You are dumping return oil into tran so the tran pump has to keep pumping oil. When you depress the clutch the pump stops. A few loader cycles dumps the oil and not being picked up til you re-engage clurch.
When you return the oil back to the filter or other place suggested it stays in the circuit.
Does the same as when new. Plumb correctly first. Worry about tran pump later.

JDGnut · Jun 30, 2014

What Jim is looking for is oil flow when the valves are not activated... The tractor has a closed center hydraulic system.. so when no functions are being activated, there should be no flow to return.

Two or three issues he is looking for with the loader valve.
1, that its set up as a closed center valve. (mostly like its not an open center valve because other SCV and hitch functions would not work correctly.) (Usually there is a plug or fitting to change them from Open to closed center.)
2. Many of the loader valves have an internal relief valve, if this relief is set lower than the system pressure, then there will be a constant flow of oil through this relief valve. It will need to be set higher.. (adjusted, shimmed or removed.)
3. Just leaking spool valves, causing oil flowing to return.

I think the others have drilled you on what needs to be corrected.. The T fitting or a ported oil filter cover.
This should increase the time that the loader will function with the pedal pushed in.. but you were right, you were loosing oil flow.
Good Luck

lightfoot500 · Jun 30, 2014

thanks to all of you.
i will investigate further when i get the time,
which may be a little while.
i will repost when i check for oil bypassing and
replumb.
thanks.

JD 3020 w/ JD 146 front loader hyd hookup ?

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