John T 2940 starter issue- clicks no start. All help welcome

Randy G · Feb 13, 2012

I have a 1981 JD 2940. Many times when I turn the key to start it just "clicks". Has done this since I bought it 2 yrs ago and was told it has been to the local JD shop and starter has been replaced and the problem continued.
Since I aquired it, I have removed and cleaned all battery connections, grounding connections to the battery boxes, replaced the solonoid on the starter, obviously removed the starter and cleaned all grounding connections to the block, cleaned all battery post connections, charged it many times. Still most the time it just "clicks". Mostly during cold weather. Yet when this problem persists I will short across the solonoid it will crank right up. With key off of course.
Seems when after a charge it will crank. What is my next issue to correct this PITA?

Thanks

Randy G

Anonymous-0 · Feb 13, 2012

i have a 1981 2040 deere and i have the same problem. three weeks ago i replaced the batteries and it has not clicked once i did that

TractormanNC · Feb 13, 2012

Does it have the small (Ford style) solenoid to power the solenoid on the starter? Had to do this on a 2750 about a year ago. Deere used to (maybe still does) offer a kit to do this. Also if your batteries are grounded to sheet metal, move the ground cable so it attaches to a starter bolt or CAST IRON.

Anonymous-0 · Feb 13, 2012

Hook a voltmeter up between the solenoid and ground and see what the voltage is when it clicks. If you have more than 10 volts move the voltmeter to the connection between the solenois and the starter. If less than 10 at the starter when you try to start backtrack on cables and connections.

Randy G · Feb 13, 2012

Thanks for your replies guys!

The batteries are wired as follows. There are 2- 12 volt batteries. Battery 1 positive post goes to battery 2 positive post then to the starter. Each batteries negative post is grounded to the battery box. All connections have been cleaned.

Hilltopper · Feb 13, 2012

My son has a 2940. Some times it would start and some times not. It would start cold fine than if you happened to kill it it would crank slow and some times smoke from the selenoid. He had a new battery positive cable made up. It is a one peace wire that clamps to the batteries and goes to the selonoid. Still had same problem. I told him it was the key switch at fault. If it failed with the key switch it would start right up by jumping the contacts on the selonoid. It has since gotten O.K . on its own. I have heard of other having this switch problem.

finn1wil · Feb 13, 2012

If it is true that you jump starter solenoid connections and it cranks, the problem would have to be in the ignition side of the starter solenoid. Use a voltmeter and measure the voltage at the starter solenoid switch wire while cranking. If you lack 12volts while cranking there, check for it at the neutral safety switch and key switch. If it is not there follow the cab feed off of the starter solenoid stud to the dash

good luck

Randy G · Feb 13, 2012

Hilltop,

I have a new key switch ready to install. Think that may be a fix? Replacing it was my next step.

LarrySTN · Feb 13, 2012

John Deere had many models that had this problem including my 2750. I have repaired many in our shop. Changing starter, solenoid and key switches will NOT fix the problem long term. The simplest and most reliable fix is to install a relay near the starter which is trigggered by the starter circuit, and switches current from the battery wire on the starter solenoid to the trigger wire on the starter solenoid. John Deere already has done this very thing to all the larger tractors many years back.

buickanddeere · Feb 13, 2012

You can blindly clean, re-clean, re-re-clean, re-re-re-clean and replace parts and not find the problem.
Or you can take a volt meter and trace out the fault.

Tx Jim · Feb 14, 2012

(quoted from post at 21:41:10 02/13/12) Thanks for your replies guys!
Each batteries negative post is grounded to the battery box. All connections have been cleaned.

First thing to do is remove ground cable from "battery box" that if your tractor is open station the BB has a history of getting rusty(from battery acid overflows) and loosing good continuity and attach cable to frame or better yet engine block. Next thing as has already been suggested is to check voltage at starter with a voltmeter!!!!!!!!!!!!

Is your tractor open station or SGB(cab) equipped?? SGB has a printed circuit(L37846) board under dash panel with a history of giving problems. IIRC there's a relay under dash for the starting circuit on all styles.

LJD · Feb 14, 2012

If you short it between the big post and the "S" post on the solenoid -and it works - then you know it's a start-circuit problem. There isn't much there and ought to be an easy fix. That "S" termincal must get at least 8 volts or it will just click instead of engage. Standard starter circuit has battery power running through a neutral-safety-switch and starter-switch. Some models that had or have cabs also have a start relay. Just trace, find out which item is bad, and replace. Other then wire connections - it's likely you've got a bad starter switch or neutral safety switch. To test the neutral-safety-switch - just unplug it and stick a jumper wire into the plug.

Resting Relics 1 · Feb 14, 2012

Randy,
Need to know the actual battery voltage after it cranks for a few seconds. Could just be lousy batteries or a bad ground. I don't think it would be the safety neutral switch beacuse if it clicks that would tell me that switch is ok. It wouldn't even click if that switch were bad.
Good Luck,
John

LJD · Feb 14, 2012

I've fixed many that "clicked" with a bad neutral safety switch. They can develop high resistance over time when in neutral "on" position. This causes a voltage drop that stops the solenoid from working properly. We had to replace many with that problem.

The poster did not note exactly WHAT is clicking - or how loud the click is.

A relay will also click if he has one. So will a few other items in the dashboard on certain model tractors.

The Bosch or Delco starter solenoid if fed with less then 8 volts will often make a dull click and do nothing. A starter switch or neutral safety switch cause that sort of problem when they get worn, oxidized, etc. If making a loud click -that is often a issue of the contact-wheel inside the solenoid being pitted.

And yeah - it's not easy to explain what a dull versus loud click is - with a keyboard.

John T · Feb 14, 2012

Randy, Im not certifed over two cylinders lol but here are my thoughts:

1) When you say you "short across the solenoid" do you mean youre jumping hot battery voltage from the big solenoid input post (where big battery cable attaches) over to the solenoids small S acitvation terminal??????? (thats my guess as I doubt youre jumping direct)

2) Ifffffffff thats what youre doing and ifffffffffff she always cranks fine then,,,,THAT TELLS ME THE STARTER AND BATTERIES AND CABLES AND SOLENOID ARE ALL OKAY

3) Ifffffffff one and two above are true, that leaves me with EITHER a bad start switch,,,,,,,or a bad or resistive safety switch,,,,,,,,,or theres a loose or resistive small wire connection somewhere in the start and safety switch to the solenoids small S activation terminal,,,,,,,,,or theres a loose or corroded to frame ground connection or grounding terminal in the solenoid (it may be simply to frame case grounded, i.e. no litle to frame grounl terminal on the solenoid)

Its just sounds like since you have already checked serviced or replaced the starter and solenoid and cables n connections if they are indeed okay and if indeed when you jump the solenoids small S activation terminal she always cranks fine (that right???) THE PROBLEMS IN THE CIRCUIT FROM START SWITCH TO AND THROUGH SAFETY SWITCH TO THE SOLENOIDS SMALL S ACTIVATION TERMINAL. That would include theres good hot voltage present on the start switches BAT input terminaL i.e. theres good voltage TO THE INPUT SIDE OF ALL THAT CIRCUIT ABOVE

CHECK THE SAFETY SWITCH (resisitve causing a voltage drop) AND WIRES AND CONNECTIONS FROM SWITCH TO SAFETY TO SOLENOID

John T Listen to the gents who are more familiar with later tractros then I am!!!!! Im knee deep in theory and decent on two cylinders but NOT later model experienced

Randy G · Feb 14, 2012

Checked the battery voltage today before cranking and it was 12.67 volts. Cranked it and it went down to 10.2 volts. Of course this time it cranked first time. While running it was charging at nearly 17 volts. Cranked a second time and engaged again lowering voltage to 11.7 volts. Its not driven everyday, maybe once a week or less this time of year but more frequently during the summer. Still just clicks occasionally.

RLA · Feb 14, 2012

It run in my mind there's a switch under the
tranny cover plate I had to replace on our 2750
so it would start..... Wouldn't always mess up
& I remember jumping the solenoid a few times
to get the starter to crank the engine...

buickanddeere · Feb 14, 2012

Each battery needs to be measured post to post, not clamp to clamp while cranking. Voltage measured between
Main post on starter motor to starter body while cranking.Also measure small post on solenoid while cranking.

LJD · Feb 14, 2012

You need to check voltage AT the "S" terminal on the starter-solenoid when the problem is happening.

Battery voltage can drop to 9-10 volts when cranking and that is normal. All devices related to starting in 12 volt systems are designed to work well as low a 9 volts.

If your solenoid "clicks" when not starting - and when you jump the big post to "S" and it DOES start - you've got high resistance in the start circuit.

The starter solenoid makes two things happen. You are only getting "one thing" and thus the click with no starter-drive engagement and cranking.

Switches often go bad slowly and get increasing resistance. It's not just and "on" or "off" thing like a few others have alluded to. Deere neutral safety switches are known for this problem. Same for the key switches when used with the bigger starters (like in 4020s). Thus why extra relays are often used - to take the amp load off the starter switch.

Tx Jim · Feb 14, 2012

(quoted from post at 11:49:41 02/14/12) Each battery needs to be measured post to post, not clamp to clamp while cranking. .

It's been my diagnostic experience that the only true way to check two 12V batteries voltage that are hooked together in parallel is if they're separated not connected with cables. This includes testing with a battery tester such as on a 6.5L GM pickup. Back when I had a 6.5L Chevy pickup I had an auto store check for a weak battery. They didn't separate the batteries and told me after initial test both batt. were good. I asked them to disconnect one battery from cables then they found the battery with the dead cell.

John T · Feb 14, 2012

Those battery voltages while cranking dont sound all that bad, which again leads me to believe the starter,,,,,,,,,and batteries,,,,,,,,and cables are NOT THE PROBLEM...

However, if resistive voltage dropping contacts in the safety switch or start switch or any of that circuits wires or connections are causing excess voltage drop when under a load THEN ONE OF THOSE IS THE PROBLEM,,,My first suspect would be safety switch then the small wirres or connections or terminals in that circuit,,then the start swtich,,,,,,then the voltage is low at the BAT INPUT on the start switch...

TROUBLESHOOTING

Instead of the battery and/or starter this time put the voltmeter at places starting with the BAT
input on the start switch,,,,,,,then the start output terminal on switch,,,,,,,THEN MOST IMPORTANT the input and output on the safety switch (or look for a voltage drop ACROSS the switch) a perfect switch would have ZERO volts drop across it when closed,,,,,,then on the solenoids S activation terminal......

IF THE VOLTAGE IS LOW ON THE SOLENOIDS S ACTIVATION TERMINAL (from bad switch or safety switch or wiring) THAT CAN BE THE PROBLEM

Again if jumping the solenoid makes her work but she dont otherwise LOOK FOR A RESISITVE SAFETY SWITCH or a resistive switch or bad wirign in that circuit or the voltaqge is too low going to the switches BAT input terminal

CHECK THOSE VOLTAGES

John T

Tx Jim · Feb 14, 2012

(quoted from post at 11:23:16 02/14/12)While running it was charging at nearly 17 volts. .

17 volts on charging is TOO HIGH. Is your tractor open station or SGB(CAB) model???????????????

Pete in MD · Feb 14, 2012

John,
Did you get the live pump working on your A ?
Pete

Randy G · Feb 14, 2012

Tx Jim · Feb 14, 2012

(quoted from post at 14:55:23 02/14/12) open

Open station won't have the pesky printed circuit board I mentioned earlier but will possibly have the rusty battery box touching the clutch housing which contributes to a "very poor" battery ground connection.

David S. · Feb 14, 2012

Randy G.
I have a 1980 2940 and had the same problems that you describe. I did everything you have done with no luck. New key switch, batteries, new gear reduction starter(best thing i did) cleaned everything electrical, always started after i shorted selinoid posts(10 years of this). Finally asked here and LJD recommended adding a relay to the start curcuit. YES this fixxed it. Been starting by the key for four years straight with out having to jump selinoid. Take 12vdc to selinoid to coil of relay other coil post to negative battery. Take 12vdc positive to armature of relay, on otherside of armature connect to selinoid. This way the key closes the relay to apply full 12v to starter. Tractor has started from key everytime.

David S. · Feb 14, 2012

Randy G.
I have a 1980 2940 and had the same problems that you describe. I did everything you have done with no luck. New key switch, batteries, new gear reduction starter(best thing i did) cleaned everything electrical, always started after i shorted selinoid posts(10 years of this). Finally asked here and LJD recommended adding a relay to the start curcuit. YES this fixxed it. Been starting by the key for four years straight with out having to jump selinoid. Take 12vdc to selinoid(key switch) remove and move to coil of relay other coil post to negative battery. Take 12vdc positive(from battery) to armature of relay, on otherside of armature connect to selinoid. This way the key closes the relay to apply full 12v to starter. Tractor has started from key everytime.

Randy G · Feb 14, 2012

David, if your solution worked for you it may well for me too. Could you explain the procedure in a little more detail so I may attempt the fix? I don"t want to start a fire by placing a wire in the wrong place. On my starter solinoid the top post is connected to the positive cable from the batteries, the bottom large connection goes from the solinoid to the starter case.(negative?) then there is a small screw connection that connects to a small wire. Thanks for your help!! You can Email me if you wish.

Tx Jim · Feb 15, 2012

(quoted from post at 21:48:40 02/14/12) David, if your solution worked for you it may well for me too. Could you explain the procedure in a little more detail so I may attempt the fix?

JD mounted the extra solenoid on a bracket above starter on some models. Basically remove the small wire off of existing solenoid and attach that wire to new (2ND) solenoid small post(marked S) then on one of the large posts on the new solenoid connect a large supply wire from battery(source could be the large top post on original solenoid) and the other large post attach wire at least a 12ga. to the "S" terminal on original solenoid. This method eliminates the large amperage draw through the key switch & neutral start switch and delivers more amps/volts to engage original solenoid.

Resting Relics 1 · Feb 16, 2012

Pete,
I was sicker than a dog last weekend. Hoping to work on it this weekend if mother nature cooperates. Could be a storm here in CT
Thanks for asking, John

Dharmabumster · Dec 22, 2013

Larry STN:
found your post from 2/13/12 regarding your 2750 not starting.
I have the same problem. When you say "install a relay near the starter" is this relay a part that I can buy at my JD dealer in Beeville, TX, and just what should I ask for. Any hints on installation?
thanks for the reply
Greg

Tx Jim · Dec 22, 2013

Here's the relay or the wiring kit with the realy from JD
RE170320 Starter Relay ADD 29.51 USD

RE42993 Starter Motor Kit ADD 98.67 USD

Dharmabumster · Dec 22, 2013

(quoted from post at 16:10:00 12/22/13)
Here's the relay or the wiring kit with the realy from JD
RE170320 Starter Relay ADD 29.51 USD

RE42993 Starter Motor Kit ADD 98.67 USD

Jim
thanks, you have been a great help
Merry Christmas to you and yours
Greg B

John T 2940 starter issue- clicks no start. All help welcome

Member

Well-known Member

Member

Well-known Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Well-known Member

Well-known Member

Well-known Member

Member

Well-known Member

Well-known Member

Member

Well-known Member

Well-known Member

Well-known Member

Well-known Member

Well-known Member

Well-known Member

Well-known Member

Member

Well-known Member

Member

Member

Member

Well-known Member

Member

New User

Well-known Member

New User

Similar threads