New Holland 278 baler timing question

Sheep-farmer

New User
When I time my NH 278 baler the way the manual says plunger arm between the 2 notches and the timing marks on the knotter drive mechanism line up, the needles enter the bale chute around 4 inches behind the tips of the plunger. When I adjust the timing so the needle enter at correct time ?? behind the tips, the timing marks on the knotter drive mechanism are off. Does that matter or am I not doing something correctly? I am new to the forum but have found some very good info here. Thanks in advance to anyone who can help.
 
When you start tinkering with the timing, you want to make sure the needles are in the home position before the knotters are tripped.

I had a similar problem with my New Holland 68. You want the needles to come in to the bale chamber per the manual just after plunger passes by them 1/4-3/4 inches. My plunger crank and knotter timing were dead on and the needles were coming into the bale chamber as the plunger went by - by at least 3 inches. To remedy this, I had to advance/retard (can't remember which direction) the knotter drive sproket by one, maybe two chain links and it worked beautifully.

Here is a couple of threads from when we were troubleshooting/adjusting this:

http://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=implment&th=251378

http://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=implment&th=252376

and a great video by New Holland showing how the knotters work:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoB_1meRa9A

Good luck,
Bill
 
Thanks for the info. I wasn?t sure if I was adjusting the needles at the right place, (the knotter drive chain)? If I adjust the knotter drive chain to where the needles are correct, the timing marks on the knotter drive mechanism don?t line up line up. Is that important?
 
Hopefully someone will jump in here and set me straight if I'm wrong.....

But if I recall correctly, I made sure the knotter cycle was complete. Next, I made sure the needle carriage was fast in the home position. Then I tripped the knotter. As it traveled through its cycle, when the needles were brought up flush with the bottom of the bale chamber, I stopped everything. I then took the knotter drive chain loose via idler, backed off the plunger to where it's travel was just past the needles, like 3/4 inches per the manual. I then reattached the knotter drive chain, continued the cycle to competition and all was good. My timing marks are off now on the knotter by one or two chain links - but the needles are entering the chamber correctly timed to the plunger. The needles deliver twine to the knotters correctly and the knot ties every-time.

So to answer your question, yes the timing marks on the knotter matter - but not always, as in my case, close, but not exact.

Where timing marks are REALLY important is if you have the chain driven feeder forks. You MUST set the plunger crank at vertical between the timing marks and the large feeder drive chain in its proper timing marks. Anything other than that might get you an expensive crash into the plunger.

Also it is critically important to make sure the plunger stop is free/working/moving and not rusted immovable - unless you just like replacing needles or need an excuse to get out of baling on a hot day..... ;-)

Do you have a manual?

Good luck,
Bill
 

Thanks Bill for the info. It sounds like I did the exact same thing you did. Trip the knotter and turn the flywheel by hand till the needles came up flush with the bottom of the bale chamber, unhook the knotter chain and time the needles with the plunger. I was just concerned about the knotter timing marks being off and wanted to make sure I was making the adjustment to the needles in the right place. Yes the plunger stop is working and yes I have a manual.
 
Another thing you want to check is the gap between the plunger knife and the bale case stationary knife. Sharp and close within 1/32 clearance. If you haven't, make sure the twine knifes on your knotters are sharp too. The aluminum feeder tines on my 68 are about 13-3/4 inches long. They have a way over the years of wearing down several inches, so slowly, it's unnoticed. Next thing the banana bale can't be adjusted out as the feeder tines are unable to deliver enough hay to the bale chamber.

Look at the parts diagrams on the New Holland website, make sure all of your hay dogs are there and the springs are not broken. Check to see if the wedges are there too.

If you are getting a banana bale, it can be a combo of not enough hay to the left side of the baler (as you stand behind it), broken hay dog springs, to much knife clearance, wore or unadjusted feeder tines and how you feed the baler - and probably a few other things.

Adjusting the feeder tines to move more hay to one side or the other into the bale chamber is opposite of what you'd think. More hay to the left, move the feeder tines to the right - as per the manual.

FWIW - my New Holland 68 is at it's best (even though it's now 58 years old) at full 540 PTO RPMS. I gear down to get about 12-15 flakes per bale. Opposite my John Deere baler, the 68 likes to be fed from the windrow close to the bale chamber. It likes a full throat of hay too. Ours went from a banana factory to a brick factory with these settings, adjustments and operation.

Below is a video I've posted several times of our 68 after a refresh/refurb.

The JD 348 we bought over the winter and have been working, adjusting and getting ready had better be at least an equal to this old New Holland 68..... :)

Good luck,
Bill
New Holland 68
 
The timing marks on the knotter drive clutch are a rough guide for getting everything sort of close. The needle tips flush with the chamber bottom back 1/2 to 1 inch from the plunger face/extensions is the really only correct way to time properly. If the needles are too far back[retarded], the needles won't complete their cycle soon enough and the plunger will hit the safety block. Make sure the safety latch is working freely and have someone rotate the flywheel by hand in the correct direction with the needles in the home position and watch the needle-plunger relationship and then the plunger-safety stop relationship. Then do it a couple more times. Tighten everything up and have at her. Make sure the drive chains are OK. If in question, replace with US made ones......Ron
 

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