Hesston / CaseIH / IH Mower Conditioners Questions

Saw a CaseIH 8320 mower conditioner up close today and both rollers were made of a stack of round belting. In addition, the rollers were cut such that they intermeshed kind of like a New Holland haybine. I remember seeing the belting type material for the top roller on a IH 990. Can't remember if the bottom roller was plain steel or belting like the top. When I say belting, what I'm trying to describe is - if you laid a piece of baler belt flat and cookie cut a circle and then stacked them on a shaft - that's what the IH 990 and this CaseIH roller was made.

I gather the 7 ft CaseIH 8320 and Hesston 1110 are clones and the 9 ft CaseIH and Hesston 1120 are clones. Are these basically an IH design - from the 990 or did Hesston design and make the 990?

It seems like most of what I've read indicates the bottom roll is steel. Which is correct? Is there a Massey Ferguson, New Idea, Agco (Agco Allis), Challenger version of the above models and what would their model numbers be?

The 8320 I looked at was VERY simple in design and the rollers by design IMHO could never delaminate. I could see one of these haybines on my short list one of these days.

Thanks!
Bill

Those are actually called Ticor rolls. I have a Hesston 3309 disc mower conditioner (same as New Idea 5209 and CaseIH 3309) with those rolls in it and they do not delaminate and they tolerate rock ingestion better than the rubber covered rollers on my old New Holland and John Deere sickle machines did. I know that CaseIH rebranded Hesston sickle machines from about 1988 to the New Holland merger, but not sure if it actually was a Hesston design or it was a New Idea. After AGCO acquired all their brands they did some mixing and matching. I'd have to do some research on who made what back then.

Internationl/CaseIH 1190, Hesston 1130, and the New Idea 5109 are the same machine, which appears to be a New Idea design. I have to dig further for the older machines.

Hesston 1120 and CaseIH 8330 appear to be the same machine.

I don't know the full origin of the rolls, but the New Idea 290 haybine -a first generation haybine- that I had was made with the compressed rolls like that. They were also rebadged ad sold as a Ford and Massey Ferguson machine in different paint. And you're right, they're the toughest rolls around. I may be wrong, but they look like they're made from old sidewalls that have been punched out, compressed onto a shaft and locked in place and cut for the grooves in them. And, like an old tire, they never decompose.

From 1987 up to the 2001 merger of CaseIH and New Holland the Hesston and CaseIH hay products were made by Hay & Forage Industries (HFI) in Hesston, KS. This was a joint venture company between Fiat and CaseIH until 1991 when AGCO purchased the Fiat half of the business. The products produced by HFI were technically just as much CaseIH as they were Hesston but most all of the machines were descendants of what Hesston was building before the joint venture was formed. New Idea was also then purchased by AGCO and after the Hesston facility was owned entirely by AGCO in 2001 the Coldwater, OH plant was closed and New Idea equipment began to be built in Hesston. At this point the designs started to intertwine. However, the CaseIH 8320 that the original poster referenced has no New Idea heritage except for the Ticor conditioner rolls. These rolls were exclusive to the CaseIH-branded mower/conditioners that were built by HFI; they were never offered in the Hesston line. They were a CaseIH carry-over from the days when New Idea built IH hay tools.

Were these tricor rollers standard on the CaseIH machines, both top and bottom?

Great info - thanks!
Bill

If I remember correctly the CaseIH machines had steel-on-rubber rolls as standard and the Ticor style was an option.

Your comment re who made that reminds me of the desk top of a former area Oliver dealer that had transistioned into MF/Agco. He had the plastic desk cover with an underlying pad showing mergers, acquisitions, splits, line drops, etc. of farm equipment companies over the years. Talk about a labyrinth to follow!

I just sold an 1120 that I bought new on 94. That one had one rubber and one steel. The rubber roll was molded rubber. The steel roll had triangular bars that meshed in to the grooves in the rubber roll.
There was an 8330 on a sale three weeks ago that looked identical except for the rolls. That one had a smooth steel roll running against a mostly smooth rubber roll with just a few grooves cut in it.

Bill,
I have a 990, and the bottom roll is steel, with approximately 1" square stock welded to it, to crush the hay. I'm not sure how effective it is, compared to other styles, but it is simple and rugged.
Pete

I also own a Hesston 1120 (very early serial # on mine so it is like a 1988 or 1989 model. Had a rough life prior to my ownership is an understatement).

As rrlund stated the Heston 1120 (9' 3") has one steel roller that is not smooth and 1 rubber roller that is not smooth either. These 2 rollers intermesh. The 1110 will be identical but will be 7' 3" cut instead.

My opinion is anyone looking for an old yet durable sickle based mower conditioner should look for a Hesston 1120 or 1110.

The Roller design is robust, I would be surprised if that rubber roller ever lets go like the NH laminate rubber rollers do when they get age and miles on them.

Also the cycle drive mechanism is also simple and very robust.

When running old well seasoned junk like I do well, I like stuff that I can keep running for cheap as otherwise my hobby patch becomes an expense drain on my household wallet. I do not necessarily expect to make much money on my hay hobby but I do expect the hobby to at least break even or pay its way along (not counting my donated time of course).

Frankly I would not own a John Deere 1207, 1209, 1217,1219 series as those are out. Read some of the Tractorvets posts sometime for lots of laughter.

I love NH Holland stuff when it comes to hay equipment, but the haybines in my price range always have roller or wobble box issues and that makes them impractical to repair from a cost perspective for small time hobbyist like me.

I plan to run my Hesston 1120 for many years (actually hoping for 2 decades or more) yet and it had a tremendously rough life before I bought it. Somewhere along the line I am guessing someone hit a tree with it and totally broke the reel in half. It is scabbed back together the best some hillybilly could do with an AC buzzbox. While their repair is not pretty I have not had any issues with it either and frankly not bad all that bad with the crude tools used considering they stickwelded lots of rather thin metal.

I am real impressed with my machine. I have cut damp fields and have even cut in the rain with this machine last year out of necessity. It gets powered with antiques: Farmall M primary and my preferred power choice for running it, Farmall h backup tractor, John Deere A 2nd back-up tractor. I do not even bother with a hydraulic cylinder on it with any of the 3 tractors. Fine machine for what it is.

Great info - thanks everyone!

Bill