Hay Wagon Length Adjustment

Bill VA

Well-known Member
I pulled the old hay wagon out of the weeds, pulled the rotten deck off of it and am giving it a look-see at what I've got to work with/refurb.

This wagon was only used to feed cattle, never used behind a baler.

As I look at it, the wagon length is adjusted as short as possible. I'd like to adjust it as long as possible.

Question is - how far out does one typically extend the frame's center connecting tube? I'm guessing out until I have two bolts holding it together - which are about 12 inches apart. However I've been told that the wood frame is the structure of a hay wagon and to extend the wagon out until one bolt is holding it together - gaining another foot. Not sure one bolt holding the wagon together is enough to make me sleep easy at night.

From the pics of this wagon frame, how would you proceed?

Couple more questions:

How far past the front and rear wheels do you typically extend the deck? Anyone using a 9 vs 8 ft wide deck?

I'll be putting an all new deck and wooden beams on this wagon gear, so I want to design it to hold as much hay as reasonably possible. The trailer won't see highways, so that's why I'm thinking 9 ft. I think I can put a 16 ft deck on this gear, but would like to hear your advice/comments.

Thanks!
Bill
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I have done more then one with just one bolt. The key is using wood beams that are heavy enough to work with the extension tube to make it strong enough to hold on. I remember one a guy built but he left out the tube and just used the wood to hold it together and we had a load of straw bales on it and the rear axle dropped in a rut and I pulled it in half with a JD A
 

How long do you want to make it? That center tube can be replaced with whatever length you need. We had one that we stretched out far enough to accept a 20 foot deck.
 
Stretch it till at least one bolt each end, more bolts the more it takes to pull apart obviously. On the front its so you can turn as tight as possible and not hit the deck with the tractor wheel or implement. I think ours average 2-3 feet ahead of the front bolster. I'm not going to check with current weather. On the back you can go up to 4 after that it gets tippy and hard on the frames(gear & deck). Be sure to chain or bolt deck down to the running gear. It don't take much of a hill with one pile on back to tip the deck off, more deck hanging over wheels the easier to tip. I believe most of the racks here are 8ft wide by 16ft or 18ft long. You can always pile over edge if needed.
 
Why in the world would you want to extend the reach to it's limits? Typically you would want the front of the wagon box to be in front of the tires when turned. If you are building with the typical 16foot beams with cross bars every 3-4 feet, you would locate the front tires centered between the first 2 cross pieces and the back tires would be between the second and third crossmembers from the back. If you extend the reach to it's limits, you make the wagon harder to manuver and put undue stress on the reach. It is also typical to only bolt on end of the wagon running gear to the stringers and sometimes loop a chain over the stringer and around the wagon frame on that end.
 
4 thrower wagons, 3 silage wagons, 6 gravity boxes and a rock trailer.....each have only one bolt in each wishbone. Never lost one in 4 decades.
 
I am just about to build my second hayrack to match the first one I made that works perfect for me. It is a 16 foot bed, I have the running gear set so there is 11 feet between the front and rear axles. Then I allowed 2 feet of overhang from the front of the rack to the center of the front axle. That left me with 3 feet of overhang from the rear axle to the end of the rack. This seems to work real well. I bolted my rack to the running gear with just 1 bolt on each corner, it seems to allow plenty of flex. I've used this rack and running gear setup for 2 years now and couldn't be happier.

The rack is 8 feet wide, I hang the bales over the edge so that I can stack them 3 wide the long way. This wagon fully loaded will hold about 120-130 bales.
 
Back in the day with the barn hayforks, you stacked the wagon with 64 bales--each layer 16 bales (8 bales from the back} 4 bales high. A common size rack was 7'x 14'. As farmers got away from barn hayforks the racks got bigger. a common size now is 8' wide by 16',18',or 20' lengths.
 
I have built several racks over the years. using rough home sawed lumber I usually get them about 16' 8" by 8' 3" more or less . I position the rack so there is about 48 to 50" from the front of the rack to the hitch pin hole . generally adjust the wagon gear so the axels are 10 to 11' apart . Like others have said one bolt is plenty in each end of the reach. Type my handle into search box and find my post of 4-15-2011. Pictures of what I build. that style has worked well for us. We bale with a NH 273.
 
We have had 2 pull apart while baling, after 40 years of use or so the bolt wears through. Maybe with a little maintenance and checking once a year a person catches that beforehand. ;)

No big deal on one bolt. Not too hard to drill a new hole and put in 2 if you want and things are short.

Get a new pipe and make as long as you want.

16 foot should work great.

I find 9 foot is harder to fit through gates, shed doors, etc but otherwise will be fine if you want. Eight foot holds the bales, 3 across, good if you stack half way good.

16x8 is 100+ bales if you stack well.

You do not want too much overhang past the rear; stack up 2 high rows of heavy hay and it wants to flip over backwards if you hand it out too far.

The front overhang also, too much and its harder to catch and stack the bales coming up the bale chute, things move a lot more with a big overhang.

In general a longer wheelbase is more stable, less bouncy.

Paul
 
Dad was more ambitious on my stacking, we ran the one bale lengthwise down the middle on the bottom two to three rows so pick up 10 bales per grab, and 5 high. ;)

In straw, a single row on top yet to really pack a load.

Paul
 
I've extended the reach on a couple of wagons I built by sleeving it with a piece of pipe and welding it up. I pull mine on the road with a pick up quite a bit, so I try and keep the rear wheels as far back as possible, to reduce sway. It doesn't sound like that's an issue for you though.
Pete
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Bill, if you using a person to stack, one thing to consider is the time and effort to walk from the back to the front of the wagon then to the back with the bale. Not as big a deal with two people on the wagon, but I would not make it longer than 16 feet if you are catching off the baler.
 
If you have good workers and run at a fair speed 1 person can keep up on a 18ft and still have time to "catch" a few second break to watch baler for problems missed by driver. Normal around here is 150 bales in around a hour, using IH 47 baler and Farmall 706or JD 2440 tractor.
 
Thanks everyone for your replies!

Good to know that one bolt holding the center tube is OK.

Length - I'd like a 20 ft wagon, but have reservations. One is that I'm mindful of the hike to the back of the wagon for one person working the wagon. The other is the strength of the baler to handle the load without ripping something apart. Not sure if the NH engineers were thinking of a long/heavy wagon when they designed my old NH68, but will make a separate post on that a bit later.

What is appealing about a 20 ft wagon is getting as much hay off the field as soon as possible. We have frequent/unpredictable thunderstorms and less down time changing wagons, the better. Also have in mind converting these wagons to thrower wagons for a day when it's just me and my boys are out on their own.

Somehow I think I'll settle on a 16 ft wagon - we'll see.

Thanks again,
Bill
 
Check the weight capacity of the running gear and the tires before you order materials. A fully loaded long rack could be too much weight for a light running gear.
 
Stacked right 150(more if go higher than standard 5 layers) bales to a 16 ft. With an odd 18ft, a half pile is needed to fill with 165 for a "full". Full goes right near 5 inches from edge nearly straight up. Till the help gets use to piling tight don't fill the load fully with out stopping and finishing off of next wagon.I had 200 on an 18 rolling down field,while catching off baler, but I'm use to stacking on the minimum ledge.
 
Stacking right up to the lip is high on my radar. We'll probably leave a couple feet for a "platform" for my boys so they have a good footing. It would not be good if I came home and told Momma - by the way we got 200 bales in the wagon, but smashed one of the boys in the process...

Back in the day when I stacked behind a 24T, there were 3 of us. The owner's 30 something year old son driving the tractor and pulling the baler/trailer and myself and the owner of the place. He was at least 65 years old and he put a vertical 4x4 on the left front corner of the wagon as you look towards the baler. He had a leather strap tied to that 4x4, steadied himself holding the strap - looped around his wrist and had a hay hook in the other. He would hook the bales and sling them back to me to stack. Worked great and when a snake was baled-up and was trying to slither out - his hands were out of the way - LOL.

I will likely do the same with my wagon, but have a 4x4 on each corner - something in addition to a couple feet of clear deck space where whoever is loading can reach a solid object and steady themselves if needed. We'll finish off the front wagon load parked and from the ground.

Thanks,
Bill
 
I had a few close calls working on the front edge. Got dumped in the chute a few times or off to the "safe side"(outside of wagon), when hit heavy bump or tractor stops suddenly. Any extra support is always nice when ever you can get it.

If you do put posts on it, make them removable so they don't get in the way if needing a flat, flat rack, or unloading.

When we(me, dad, and my brother) bale its usually one drive one on wagon. If another person shows up and wants to help they get thrown up or off(out of the way altogether) on the last stack or two.
 
From the pictures your wagon looks quite light so I think a 16' rack is plenty for it. As for the 68 baler handling the wagon I don't think there will be a problem. We have very wet ground, so had a dual wheel on the heavy side of our 68. If the fields got real soft we would put our 1900 oliver with MFWD on it. baler would be sliding sideways a lot of the time but never broke anything. And no matter what the conditions, Big Ollie never really noticed he was pulling anything.
 
I have stretched the tube in them with more or longer pipe. We usually use truck frames for wagons. Never break spindles and tires are better/cheaper. We have one that is 24x8 I have loaded it alone and was 5wide by 5high plus the top tie in. Had around 200or soon it. It was pulled by the baler with no problems to the baler.
 

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