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Square Baler Capacity vs Stackers on the Rack

B

Bill VA

Well-known Member
So I've got an old hay wagon I'm rebuilding the deck on this winter and probably going to find a few more as we go forward.

As you can see from my pic, there are a fair number of bales to pick-up in that field and walking and trailering is a chore as we knew going into it. Another thing that crosses my mind when I look at that pic is - I should think there are enough bales spitting out of my NH68 to keep one man busy on the hay rack if one is pulled behind the baler.

Assuming 12 strokes/flakes per bale - my NH68 is a 63-65 stroke per minute baler if at 540 PTO, but I run around 430 PTO - about 80% (else it sounds like it's going to fly apart). This get me to about 50 strokes per minute and just less than 4 bales per minute with a constant feed. If I allow for 25% of my time in turns and other time out of the windrow or off the tractor, I'm just under 3 bales per minute or 180ish bales per hour.

Though my strokes/flakes per bale was all over the place when baling last summer, my point is - for the poor guy on the hay rack, a low capacity baler like my NH68 probably makes for a reasonable pace. The bottle neck is probably the baler capacity/output - not the guy stacking.

If I'm dropping the bales on the ground, sending them into an accumulator or kicking into a wagon, I'm thinking I want the highest capacity/output I can get/afford.

You folks with higher capacity balers - pulling a hay rack behind, what is your limit on sending bales out the back of the baler when pulling a hay wagon? Do you find yourself putting to many bales on the wagon for the guy back there and find it necessary to slow down or can they keep up all day long no matter the output?

Just curious.

BTW - more daylight every day going forward now - can Spring be far away?

Thanks & Merry Christmas!

Bill
a177353.jpg
 
I grew up behind a Case 133 baler running 60 strokes/min. 2 different bale wagons (1 80 bale cap. and other 100). No trouble keeping up loading. A the end of the day all bales were home at the stack which sure helped maintaining quality. I think our record was a little over a 1000 in one day. I really hated picking any up off the ground.
 
Dad bought a new 133 Case baler. Us kids hated that thing! It never would miss a bale. Use to see how many bales would fit on the rack. Seems 103 straw bales was the record!!
 
From observations and notes, all on a 20 ft rack we have with sides that holds 300 bales, bales coming via chute with short breaks every 300 bales:
2 good stackers - 300+ bales per hour
1 good stacker - 200-225 bales per hour
2 medium teens on a 20 ft rack - 200-300 bales per hour
2 poor teens on a 20 ft rack - 120-200 bales per hour
1 poor teen on a 20 ft rack - 100-120 bales an hour if lucky

Running hay baskets that hold 100 bales behind a JD 348
300-400 bales an hour if hay well raked for big turns. All day long if you can get rid of it where its going.
 
Years back I purchased a new 336JD with #30 ejector. It was a baling machine. 4 loads of 125 an hour. We mowed very little hay, just dropped them in the barn, but took at least 2 men to unload and keep the baler moving. Seemed like a lot of hay then but compared to the 45 ton an hour with our round or big square baler it was rather slow. For perspective I have a John Deere hay press with a 6hp Fairbanks engine that is rated for 1-2 ton an hour with a crew of 5-6 men.
 
It was far easier and enjoyable stacking 80-120 bales of hay on a 16 foot hay rack behind the nh 270 than unloading them in the barn. I rarely fell behind in the field, and when rack was half full had time to enjoy the scenery. A longer hay rack one has to walk longer, so takes more effort to get the back filled.

My 270 is likely about like your baler. Perhaps I was younger then, now in use a Quality basket self loader.

Paul
 
Well I know my dad always preferred to be on the wagon by himself stacking back in his youth. I believe he usually worked behind a JD 14T baler which would be very similar in capacity to your NH 68.

Although I was not around back then, I do believe that Dad must have been quite the farmhand even in his early teenage years. Several neighbors always preferred having him for help from what I have heard. When for any reason, they could not hire him due to his obligations on the family farm then they always alternatively used 2 people on the wagon where the stackers only had to handle every other bale.

Dad himself hated being part of a 2 man crew on the wagon as he always claimed in was hard to get in a good flow of operation. Too much standing and waiting.
 
I stacked bales behind a nh super 68. As a teenager doing it single handed was not too bad. With my brother it was easy. A lot better than picking off the ground. 110 bale per rack. Fill two racks go back to the farm. Stack them in the farm have lunch and do it again.
 
In my late teens and early 20's I could load 250 bales a hour for 5 to 6 hours if the heat wasn't to bad. After 5 hours I would have to slow down.

Dad was a good operator and knew to go a bit slower till the load was half full. Always loaded 145 bales on a 8x16 rack.

Dad got 20 cents a bale to bale and I got a 3 cents a bale to load in the late 60's and early 70's. In 1971 we did 30,000 bales with NH275. My 9 year old brother helped me load some that year.

Gary
 
When I was in my teens when we were done at home I could work for a couple of brothers that put up a lot of hay, they had a JD and NH and would bale with both in the same field. They had a couple dozen wagons, we would unload all morning and bale all afternoon, fill a small barn in a day, one day I loaded 14 loads behind the NH, but one of the hired men helped me with the last load, it was late and the hay was getting tough, I had knots in my elbows, made 90 cents an hour back then. I bale with older balers, a MF and NH, I have a neighbor and son in law that have newer high cap. NH balers with kickers, in good hay they will keep a bale in the air at all times, I don't think a man on a wagon stacking could keep up with one.
 
40 years ago Dad had a bale thrower. I can't believe that anyone still stacks on the rack in 2014. I would just go right to a thrower. Why stack only to unstack an hour later. Always can get labor when you don't need it. 50 hp enough power to run a baler with thrower. Used to run NH273 with thrower with a 42hp IH484 back in the day.
 
We use a 273 with a thrower . Kick on 80 - 100 no stacking on the wagon . My youngest keeps up with me most of the time . Have a mow conveyor that lets us drop 400 or 500 in before we need to stack. Seems to work pretty efficient . Two guys , fairly low cost set up and from a labor standpoint not too difficult . the bale baskets look neat I just wasn't able to find any near here that worked with my budget. I guess if you have all kinds of help your way works . We both work full time so at times its a 3 or 4 hour window during the week . I feel this makes the best use of what we have . As long as there's an empty wagon capacity doesn't matter . Happy holidays to all .
 
Long time since I stacked cubes, was in mid 50's. Going rate for baler was a dime to drop, 11 cents to drag a rack. Other help got buck /hour.
Worked behind JD 14t, NH 66, McCormick 45, & Case xx. Liked working rack by myself, helper always got in the way. Most I stacked in a day was 1100 bales oat straw.
Most people in our neighborhood used rope slings, 12 or 15 per sling depending on size of barn door, 4 slings per rack. One crew got a fork grabber that would lift 10 bales, eliminated the rope slings. Hardest work at the barn was pulling the carrier back out for the next lift. Barns were big enuff that nobody stacked in barn.
Good crew was 2 men, & 3 boys. Baler owner/operator, stacker, 2 haulers, barn man. Baler never had to wait for empty rack. Haulers also drove tractor on pull rope.
Times have changed. Last time I stacked bales was in '57. Next time I got close to hay was in 2012, raked for a neighbor who ran into a tight schedule.
Willie
 
Around here we all either dropped on ground and picked up or stacked on wagon behind baler . We went to one place to buy hay and they had an old thrower laying around. No one had a self loading nh bale wagon . Then some guys got round balers and 0one neighbor had a stack hand.I never got to check out the quality of the stackhand hay but figured it would lose most of the leaves from being blown in there when dry.I learned to stack about 4-6 bales on the front of the wagon to hold it down and smooth out the ride so it didnt bounce the bales off the back when we first started. once the wagon had some weight on it then the load held together pretty good. I was taught to stack the cut side toward the back on the back tier then towards the front on the other three so they leaned against each other and you didnt even need a ladder on the back of the wagon. Everybody always stacked in the barnOf course in an area with bigger dairy barns there might have been enough room to just drop willy nilly. If so i would have dreamed of one of those barns. lol :D
 
I'd say looking at the spacing between your bales you could keep someone pretty busy on a wagon stacking. I use an IH46 which I think is a smaller baler but I can keep 2 people on a wagon from getting bored in heavy hay.I think it comes down to what you can afford for equipment and what you have for help. Around here its hard to find help for doing hay so automating it with a bale thrower makes sense.
 
(quoted from post at 20:09:42 12/23/14) So I've got an old hay wagon I'm rebuilding the deck on this winter and probably going to find a few more as we go forward.

As you can see from my pic, there are a fair number of bales to pick-up in that field and walking and trailering is a chore as we knew going into it. Another thing that crosses my mind when I look at that pic is - I should think there are enough bales spitting out of my NH68 to keep one man busy on the hay rack if one is pulled behind the baler.

Assuming 12 strokes/flakes per bale - my NH68 is a 63-65 stroke per minute baler if at 540 PTO, but I run around 430 PTO - about 80% (else it sounds like it's going to fly apart). This get me to about 50 strokes per minute and just less than 4 bales per minute with a constant feed. If I allow for 25% of my time in turns and other time out of the windrow or off the tractor, I'm just under 3 bales per minute or 180ish bales per hour.

Though my strokes/flakes per bale was all over the place when baling last summer, my point is - for the poor guy on the hay rack, a low capacity baler like my NH68 probably makes for a reasonable pace. The bottle neck is probably the baler capacity/output - not the guy stacking.

If I'm dropping the bales on the ground, sending them into an accumulator or kicking into a wagon, I'm thinking I want the highest capacity/output I can get/afford.

You folks with higher capacity balers - pulling a hay rack behind, what is your limit on sending bales out the back of the baler when pulling a hay wagon? Do you find yourself putting to many bales on the wagon for the guy back there and find it necessary to slow down or can they keep up all day long no matter the output?

Just curious.

BTW - more daylight every day going forward now - can Spring be far away?

Thanks & Merry Christmas!

Bill
Click to expand...

I don't know that a 68 is going to be able to get you the 10 or 12 flakes per bale that people now say is whats right for a square bale, or whatever the number is. The pickup on a 68 is tiny compared to a newer baler. I would also want to know why the baler sounds like it's going to come apart at 540. It should smooth out while baling running at the 62-64 strokes per minute. The side sway will be accentuated though. I used to run mine slower too but I found I busted a lot more shear bolts and made more banana bales going at a slower speed and "taking it easy" on the baler. I don't think there's a part I haven't rebuilt on my 68 and she runs pretty quiet and makes a good square bale now. I think you have to find the ground speed for the windrows you have and work from there, and the number of flakes per able be hanged!

You can put a thrower on a 68. IIRC it's the same rig that fits the alter 271 types, runs off belts on the flywheel. How good they work I don't know. I do know a bale basket will work.
 
28 horse plenty for a thrower. Pulled a IHC 46 baler with thrower with a 49 B John Deere of 28 HP and plenty of power, no need either for live PTO. And big thing with thrower over hand staking is no body is going to get heat stroke by loading on wagon. Down side is you cannot get as many bale on a wagon. But used lighter weight gears (6 ton and down are fairly cheap)(3 tom are strong enough for a decent size hay wagon)(auto axles are plenty heavy for a good hay wagon, Had several on 32-48 Ford Car front axles.) and you can make good thrower beds yourself reasonable. With the beds over the bale baskets you can allways get to the elevator for unloading and not have to dump the loads all over the barnyard and carry 50' to elevator and have all the chaf spread over to pick up. WE ran all our chaff thru a hammermill and fed it to hogs. And if you do not have barn room to get all loads inside tarps are cheap to cover the loads you have to leave setting outside till you can unload them, even if it is 2-3 weeks. Then you can possibly pick a cooler day to mow them so nobody get heat stroke in mow. When we switched to thrower that was the reason as 3 of us got overcome with heat in one year. And as for loading a N H 66 that is smaller than the 68 would be more than one person could keep up with on a 16" bed, had one 18" and it was last to get used because of the over length. If was still farming would want at least 8 wagons with kicker sides and would only make them 7' wide and 14' long as the kicker at times could not reach the rear of the 18' bed. And 7' wide you could put 2 wagons side to side in a normal 18' wide barn drive way and 2 16' long are just to long to get 2 in one in front of the other in a normal 36" long drive in barn so normak barn drive would hold 4 of the 7 x 14' wagons. Wider would have a hard time backing in the wagons if you could get the 2 side by side. Also wider than the 7' hard to see on road if anybody is trying to pass you as you are wanting to make that left hand turn. All reasons most dont understand, think bigger is better but not always.
 
I run kicker racks behind a New Holland 316. I'll stack them sometimes when the field is far from home. My 19 year old son can keep up with it fairly well.
Horsepower isn't a big deal with kicker racks on flat ground, but a 40 hp tractor will run out of wind pretty quick if you have hills
Pete
 
I have a JD 346 baler If I remember right it's 90 strokes per minute. Iv never counted how many bales a minute go in the wagon, but I can get 90 to 105 give or take on the wagon, I just kick them in no stacking, depending how heavy the hay is I can fill a wagon in less than an hour. I know that dosent answer your question, but I did snap this pic I thought I'd share with u.
a177448.jpg
 
One man operation here...Baling with 730 Case on JD 327 thrower baler. I have 4 thrower racks...3 9by 18...one 9 by 16. I can get 500+ on the wagons. Try toget wagons unloaded early inthe day. Like to sell off the wagons but do have a barn too store in also.

John
 

I stacked behind a Deere 24T pulling the rack behind the baler starting in the mid-sixties and ended in the early 80's. Two of us could last all afternoon if we kept it to four bales a minute. The crew in the haymow couldn't keep up if we baled faster. Our neighborhood crew consisted of men of all ages from 16 years old (me) to a couple of guys who were in their mid-40's to a couple of guys in their late 70's. We kept a steady pace and could get a lot done. The other guy on the rack with me was 35 years older than me but could out work me. I couldnt admit it then but I can now. LOL
 
(quoted from post at 16:09:42 12/23/14) So I've got an old hay wagon I'm rebuilding the deck on this winter and probably going to find a few more as we go forward.

As you can see from my pic, there are a fair number of bales to pick-up in that field and walking and trailering is a chore as we knew going into it. Another thing that crosses my mind when I look at that pic is - I should think there are enough bales spitting out of my NH68 to keep one man busy on the hay rack if one is pulled behind the baler.

Assuming 12 strokes/flakes per bale - my NH68 is a 63-65 stroke per minute baler if at 540 PTO, but I run around 430 PTO - about 80% (else it sounds like it's going to fly apart). This get me to about 50 strokes per minute and just less than 4 bales per minute with a constant feed. If I allow for 25% of my time in turns and other time out of the windrow or off the tractor, I'm just under 3 bales per minute or 180ish bales per hour.

Though my strokes/flakes per bale was all over the place when baling last summer, my point is - for the poor guy on the hay rack, a low capacity baler like my NH68 probably makes for a reasonable pace. The bottle neck is probably the baler capacity/output - not the guy stacking.

If I'm dropping the bales on the ground, sending them into an accumulator or kicking into a wagon, I'm thinking I want the highest capacity/output I can get/afford.

You folks with higher capacity balers - pulling a hay rack behind, what is your limit on sending bales out the back of the baler when pulling a hay wagon? Do you find yourself putting to many bales on the wagon for the guy back there and find it necessary to slow down or can they keep up all day long no matter the output?

Just curious.

BTW - more daylight every day going forward now - can Spring be far away?

Thanks & Merry Christmas!

Bill
a177353.jpg
Click to expand...
hen I was a kid my dad, myself, and my younger brother used to put up about 500-600 on most days with a New Holland 68, a Farmall M, and an assortment of 18' wagons if not more. There were days we definitely got more, but my brother and I played on travelling baseball teams as kids, and dad always would make sure there was some hay down, but only put enough down so that we could be done by game/practice time if we worked hard and got it done.
 
570 new holland with kicker racks 10 a minute but small fields so a lot of turning around. 4 people can almost haul and keep up. 6 wagons and three will be full at the end of the day with 14 unloaded or so.
 
The first "bigger" noise that gave us concern at higher rpms
was the feeder fork bar that rides on the chain - bringing hay
into the bale chamber. There is a pipe (for lack of a better
word) that runs between the forks, parallel with their travel. I
believe it's purpose is to strip out any hay that might get
packed between the feder forks. Don't have the baler near me
for a look-see, but as I recall, the lower screw/bolt head was
hitting the mounting bracket at the bale chamber side of the
baler as it passed by. Just barely touching, but enough to
make a racket. I tightened the chain a tad and solved that
problem. There was a fellow on this board years ago, Steve
from New Holland, who I gather was a NH service guy? He
recommended getting rid of that bar as they can cause much
damage if the feeder forks jump over it to one side, which I
believe could happen if the chain was loose enough. My baler
will be rid of it this spring.

Another noise coming from the baler was the driveshaft -
during a mild turn. Lots of clacking! That problem was solved
when I adjusted the hitch clevis such that the driveshaft was
near level between the baler and the tractor's pto shaft. Baler
turns nice and tight now. Btw, all new u-joints and a new
carrier bearing this spring. I can't point at it, but I have to
believe the plunger was making a but of noise as it was not
tight top to bottom or side to side. When I took it out this fall,
the bottom wooden slide was half gone and the other half of it
was rotted. Probably a good thing I wasn't running to fast. I
have a new set of wood slides that will get installed this spring.
The gear boxes, plunger and pick-up are quiet. No problems
noticed from any bearings, but I'll put one of those laser like
thermometers to them this spring to see if any are heating-up.
The rest of the noise is just the pick-up tines and strippers
rattling.

BTW - I've got a new crank bearing and plunger bushings I'll
put in this spring. I'll probably replace all of the chains, except
for the feeder forks and pick-up.

BTW - are you running your NH68 at 540 rpms?

Thanks!
Bill
 
Where I grew up in WI, the only ones that left bales on the ground were the ones that didnt own flat racks. Except those with a Allis Rotobaler. We could get 120 bales on a our thrower wagons. I myself, hated just dumping the bales in the barn, it was a b*tch in the winter with -20 degrees and your trying to dig bales out of a pile too throw down the chute. beside it was extremly hard on the barn walls with the pressure.
 
Spent a lot of time behind a NH68. Good hay would pump bales at 8-8-9 strokes at 60 strokes a minute. Used 16 ft wagons and 105 bales per load. The first rack at the back of the wagon kept you busy, a longer wagon might be a stretch. If in doubt, time yourself walking the wagon in pantomime for a few cycles. Carry a bale if you want.
 
I used to load on anything from 14ft to 28 ft alone and kept up with the baler. We would usually only bale straw and maybe some hay. Most hay was done for haylage and then the rest was blown in the big hiproof barn. The barn is 90 ft long with the drive floor at about 60 ft from the one end. Baled with a MF12 NH273 and others as they traded. The 273 was the newest one. One guy used to come over after work, and we would load the 2 wagons in the late afternoon. I would unload them the next morning since he was working a day job. We would get a 60x60 mow full for the winter and sell a lot of it.
 
(quoted from post at 20:21:54 12/25/14) The first "bigger" noise that gave us concern at higher rpms
was the feeder fork bar that rides on the chain - bringing hay
into the bale chamber. There is a pipe (for lack of a better
word) that runs between the forks, parallel with their travel. I
believe it's purpose is to strip out any hay that might get
packed between the feder forks. Don't have the baler near me
for a look-see, but as I recall, the lower screw/bolt head was
hitting the mounting bracket at the bale chamber side of the
baler as it passed by. Just barely touching, but enough to
make a racket. I tightened the chain a tad and solved that
problem. There was a fellow on this board years ago, Steve
from New Holland, who I gather was a NH service guy? He
recommended getting rid of that bar as they can cause much
damage if the feeder forks jump over it to one side, which I
believe could happen if the chain was loose enough. My baler
will be rid of it this spring.

Another noise coming from the baler was the driveshaft -
during a mild turn. Lots of clacking! That problem was solved
when I adjusted the hitch clevis such that the driveshaft was
near level between the baler and the tractor's pto shaft. Baler
turns nice and tight now. Btw, all new u-joints and a new
carrier bearing this spring. I can't point at it, but I have to
believe the plunger was making a but of noise as it was not
tight top to bottom or side to side. When I took it out this fall,
the bottom wooden slide was half gone and the other half of it
was rotted. Probably a good thing I wasn't running to fast. I
have a new set of wood slides that will get installed this spring.
The gear boxes, plunger and pick-up are quiet. No problems
noticed from any bearings, but I'll put one of those laser like
thermometers to them this spring to see if any are heating-up.
The rest of the noise is just the pick-up tines and strippers
rattling.

BTW - I've got a new crank bearing and plunger bushings I'll
put in this spring. I'll probably replace all of the chains, except
for the feeder forks and pick-up.

BTW - are you running your NH68 at 540 rpms?

Thanks!
Bill
Click to expand...

Right about 540, maybe a bit slower, but lots faster than I used to. The feeder "pipe" I think has to be there, at least on mine. I looked at it when you were talking about it in an earlier post and I don't see how it can be done away with, but we might not be talking about the same thing.

The feeder fork hitting metal- check the bearings in the drive gear for the feeder forks. And check the lube level often. If a seal goes you'll never know it and that thing is a bear to get in and out to fix.
 
We have a IH 47 usually pull with Farmall 706 or John Deere 2440 running 3rd low Direct (Jump up to 4 in light material) not quite 540PTO speed (don't miss knots as often) either tractor. One guy on 16ft-18ft wagon stacking 40-50lb bales (150(16ft)-165(18ft) to "full load",can get more if go up) Fairly good pace, lets stacker "catch" a break between bales. Also lets stacker watch baler for "misses" or broken shear bolts (when the flywheel bolt don't blow) We can run faster but that is for crunch time (starting to/ looks like rain on last few rounds).
 
We have been doing small squares almost 30 years now. The biggest challenge to doing it year after year is 'help'. We use thrower wagons so all we need to do is stack it in the barn, which is still a tough job. The key to 'happy help' and long term farming is eliminating useless work. A chute & wagon eliminates picking up off the ground. A thrower eliminates stacking on the wagon. Your kids will be gone faster than you think.
 
Why are so many of these pics sideways? I look forward to the pics but sometimes have to download them so i can rotate them?I havnt had the money or time to focus on downloading my own pics yet but i want them to be rightways when i do.Got 8 disposable c ameras and a lot on a digital that i need to down load and i dont want everybody to have to stand sideways to see?Not critisizing anyone. Just want to get them 'right' when i finally get mine downloaded? Thanks in advance!=)
 
I wondered about that too! Was more worried about how the stack would go thru the 'sweat' and dry down.I learned from my boss to stack on edge cut side down. Was more work but they dried good and we didnt have the space for the dumping the bales as nice as that sounds!=) I used to dream about those one man systems. I saw them advertised but never seen anyone who had them to ask.Kind of makes me wonder about doing it liek those guys out west with the buckrake and stackers that stacked it outside.On my birth farm we had a 30x40 bank barn with gambrel rood and no hay mow. But it did have the hay trolly in the rafters. My grandfather had ventilaters put on the barn and the woman that bought the farm had it roofed in metal and took them off. Wish i had know, I'd have liked to had had them.Wonder if they still even make those big ventilators?
 
(quoted from post at 10:31:53 12/29/14) Why are so many of these pics sideways?....Not critisizing anyone. Just want to get them 'right' when i finally get mine downloaded? Thanks in advance!=)
Click to expand...

Usually it is because someone has used a smartphone to post the pics. The apps on smartphones are almost always condensed (compared to the options that you have with a real computer)and a smartphone will do things automatically sometimes that you do not want done so they not always so smart.

You will likely have zero issues if you use a real computer and it is usually a good idea to resize your pics to 640 x 480 pixels. Some websites do not permit large pics or large file sizes. 640 x 480 picture pixel size is almost always safe and helps the people on slower connections view them more easily too.
 
(quoted from post at 06:41:20 12/29/14) I wondered about that too! Was more worried about how the stack would go thru the 'sweat' and dry down.I learned from my boss to stack on edge cut side down. Was more work but they dried good...
Click to expand...

We don't put anything in the barn, or bale it for that matter, that isn't dry in the first place. "Heavy bales", those that are lots heavier than the rest are set to the side and fed out that day and are always the ones with the clump of "green" inside. Not sure what you mean by "sweat".
 
Cool i got an at+t phone with 3 g by I'm pencil and paper mentality in a puter world!! lol Appreciate the help. I want to put a lot of pics on line.
 
Thats what we called it the first three days when we put hay in the barn here and it dries down and loses more moisture and cools down.I remember my grandfather left the barn doors open for 3 days after putting hay in the barn.
 
(quoted from post at 22:18:21 12/31/14) Thats what we called it the first three days when we put hay in the barn here and it dries down and loses more moisture and cools down.I remember my grandfather left the barn doors open for 3 days after putting hay in the barn.
Click to expand...

Okay, now I know what you mean. I've heard that idea for years, but I could never figure out how the inside bales were supposed to "dry down" when they were buried under all those other bales.
 
When I grew up it would take 2 men on the wagon to keep up with a new Holland 268 baler. Then we got the 273 with thrower and about 8 bale wagons. Sometimes tough to the bales off that way.
 
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