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Implement Alley Discussion Forum

Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy!

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somesortafarmer

06-27-2014 20:12:02
69.179.74.247



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2nd year of haymaking with this machine. Free from father-in-law, sat in his field for 10 years. He parked it because feeder teeth chain broke, and wrapped around main shaft, and feeder teeth got sheared off in bale case. I got it going, made 400 bales. On last 40-50 bales it missed every 4th bale or so. 3rd crop put it in shed. 1st crop this year 3 bales good, 3-4 bales missed on outside needle, doesn't seem to be catching in twine disk. Using cheap farm and fleet sissal. Any help is appreciated.

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jleus

06-29-2014 18:20:19
107.219.33.43



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
Got the same results last year with my 24t. The spring on the shaft that drives the tucker fingers, the spring that returns the shaft to home, in turn returning the tucker fingers to home, had lost its anchor point on the balers body. Its just a big hair pin with the ends folded out and the end of the spring in the "eye". Probably lucky I didnt break anything before figuring it out. Study your manual, and get someone to turn the flywheel while you watch it cycle. While the bill hooks job of creating a knot may seem mysterious (its actually beautifully simple), the needles and tucker fingers job of getting the ends of the twine to the twine disks is pretty straight forward. Hay dogs and restrictor plates in good shape? Im running 9000 ft sisal from TSC with good luck.

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RodgeinIL

06-29-2014 07:32:11
198.100.52.93



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
I use 9000 poly in my 24T, a lot of my tying problems were in junk sisal twine. After a new bIllhooks and a little tuning, tying problems went to zero. Make sure everything is clean and lubed up. Had trouble first cutting last year, tucker fingers were binding.



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showcrop

06-29-2014 03:42:13
75.67.231.80



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
I had exactly the same problem as JR Sutton when I had a JD 336. It was due to rust under the knotters combined with a heavy slug of hay just before tying. The short term fix is keep your hay intake light, long term weld in some angle stock under and beside the needle slots. This is what I did and it cured the problem for good.



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tomstractorsandtoys

06-28-2014 16:02:15
64.136.27.163



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
Go get a bale of 7200 twine,the best I have found is New Holland.I have used others but 7200 always works the best in our two 24T's.



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showcrop

06-28-2014 15:34:00
75.67.231.80



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
failure of the disc to catch the twine is almost always the tucker finger.



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Dave H (MI)

06-28-2014 13:51:07
50.108.87.18



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
You need a manual. I use 2 224T balers and they are bomb proof. Had one in the field for the first time this year yesterday. Missed several bales in a row but you take out one bolt and lift up the knotter and (usually), if you are experienced, you will see the problem. I don't even open my book anymore. Make sure everything is CLEAN and greased. Get a manual at the Deere dealership, there is a troubleshooting section. You will find it if you look because they work very well.

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Hay maker2

06-28-2014 13:47:49
67.240.200.139



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
It sounds to me that the needle is not placing the twine into the twine holder correctly. If the needle is out of adjusment, this would deffinatly cause your problem. It is difficult to adjust the needle if you do not know what you are doing. If you do adjust it, MAKE SURE that the tuck finger clears the needle or you will bend the control shaft. If needed, you can move the tuck finger fowwards or backwards to clear the needle. The tuck finger is adjusted by loosening the 2 bolts and sliding the assembly. You will also have to adjust the tuck finger control arm if you move the assembly. I have seen the frame that the needle mount on get bent, if this is the case you will never get the needle adjusted properly.

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Dick2

06-28-2014 11:09:57
174.19.251.215



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
When that happens to a baler, it is good to have someone who knows about knotters watch the cycle while someone else turns the baler by hand as the needles and knotters cycle. There are several places where something can be broken, worn, wrong clearance or even a pin sheared (or partially sheared which is even harder to locate).

The baler is made to work, but it doesn't work when something is out of whack. Your job will be to find that problem - it's in there somewhere.

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Roger in Iowa

06-28-2014 11:02:53
166.181.81.43



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
Is the knot in one end of the string and not the other? Which end does have a knot, if any. Is the failed string shorter than the good tied string. Need some details other than not tying.



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charlie M

06-28-2014 10:04:26
173.85.161.47



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  

Are you using the correct twine. I understand there are only a couple of manufacturers of sisal baler twine left so it probably doesn't matter where you buy it. I use 9000 in my baler and once had someone give me 16000 by mistake - couldn't tie anything. I'm not familiar with JD balers but one thing I do know - if you're going to use the older balers the best thing you can do is get a manual. There are lots of things that have to be right with a knotter for it to work right.

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Bret4207

06-28-2014 05:14:47
64.19.90.196



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
With sisal, the very first thing you check is for rotted twine. What you describe sounds exactly like rotted twine. Works great for 3-4 bales, breaks 1 or 2 and so on. Try to see if the twine feels greasy at all. If it does, it's probably been wet or damp and deteriorated. If it was left in the baler over winter it's surely rotted.

FWIW- I went to plastic. No changes other than that and my missed bales dropped from 20-25% to 0. No more broken twine, no more missed knots, not more knotter problems. And I can leave it in the baler without worrying about moisture...mice, yes, moisture- no.
This post was edited by Bret4207 at 05:15:33 06/28/14.

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RodInNS

06-27-2014 21:09:01
216.118.158.123



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
Is the needle not placing the bottom string into the disc or is the top string pulling from the disc/holder? You really need to read the manual closely and ID what exact problem is present. I would say if the needle is not placing the string then you may have either a needle adjustment issue or twine finger problem. On the other hand... if the top string is pulled from the holder you may simply need to tighten the holder against the disc...

Rod

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Roger in Iowa

06-27-2014 20:27:15
166.181.82.95



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:12:02  
What is the designation of the sisal, it might be binder twine and not baler twine.

Your OM has lots of explanation of knotter problems with pictures!



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somesortafarmer

06-27-2014 20:44:32
69.179.74.247



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to Roger in Iowa, 06-27-2014 20:27:15  
Hi Roger, I have the 24t OM, but couldn't figure out what to look for when the twine just seems to not be in the the twine disc at all. The twine is Lincoln brand 350 lb baler twine. The intermittent nature of the problem is confusing. I cleaned out the all the dust and chaffe, wiped down everything I could on the knotter in case I had been to "liberal" when greasing. Not sure what might be worn, or where to start adjusting.

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Bob

06-27-2014 21:11:02
64.255.159.192



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-27-2014 20:44:32  
1. Have you set the needles fore and aft, left and right according to the book? (When correct they darned near whack the knotter frame as they pass through.)

2. Have you checked the tension it takes to pull the twine out of the twine disks vs. the manual, which would include checking that the twine holders/retainers and the leaf springs that tension them are intact and properly adjusted?



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somesortafarmer

06-28-2014 15:49:22
69.179.74.247



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to Bob, 06-27-2014 21:11:02  
Ok lots of stuff today.
Checked twine, twine is good quality, put in new balls. Checked tension on twine holders, both 75-100lbs roughly. Both needles exert a slight pressure (touch) the knotter frame as they pass through. Tensioners on twine case seems ok. need some pull, but no slop either. Missing knots on both sides at this point. 3-5 bales good, 5-8 bales only 1 side, and it swiches now. Most often there is a knot on top but not connected. sometimes 2 strings but no not. OM had me thinking twine disk tension but no dice. ??

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JRSutton

06-28-2014 17:55:00
98.110.209.42



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to somesortafarmer, 06-28-2014 15:49:22  
so much can go wrong - and I'm far from an expert with the 24t but I'll try to describe the annoying problem I just had with one since I don't think I saw it explained here - it'll at least give you something else to check.

The "tucker fingers" - if I'm calling them the right thing - two of them, one for each knotter - big cam-shaped flat metal disks that lie flat under the knotters...

Those are controlled by rods that are attached to a bracket that swings forward every time the knotters cycle.

On this 24t - the sheet metal of the bale chamber itself occassionally gets forced upwards by the pressure of the hay in the chamber. So much so that it eventually interferes with the metal arms that swing and push the rods for the tucker fingers.

It usually results in half-knots that just fall apart.

It's fixed by slamming the whole area down repeatedly with a heavy hammer and a large flat punch - to push the sheet metal out of the way so they don't bind.

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Doug Wi

06-28-2014 18:23:52
74.117.241.1



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 Re: Hay on the ground JD 24T missing bales like crazy! in reply to JRSutton, 06-28-2014 17:55:00  
I had the same problem with a NH 68. Turned out the cause was a build up of chaff and junk under the tucker fingers. Cleaned it and worked fine.



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