Case 444, not charging

phil25

Member
Evening: I am tasked with getting the"old fella
down the road" Case 444 back in service, so far
I have it running, mower deck fixed and hyd
system good. What i am having trouble with is
that it will not charge, had a shop re-build
the starter/gen, did the armature/field test
shown on youtube also.
The battery reads 12.13 volts not running and
12.03 when running, disconnecting field wire
makes no change.
engine speed makes no difference, belt is tight
tried a new regulator[ 3 terminal] and no
difference, does it need an original 4 terminal
regulator? rear terminal is connected to
battery neg on the original.
Charge indicator stays on, and if ARM/BAT
terminals are shorted, it draws a spark and
current enough to blow the fuse from the
battery to the BAT terminal.
Also I found that the coil power is only there
when the key switch is in the "lights"
position, when turned to start, the 12 volts is
switched off, so I have to get it rolling in
the start position on the key and let it turn
back to lights and catch the engine as it is
rolling.
Is this how they were built, or has someone
changed the switch?, I checked the contacts as
to what was closed when and it is as described.
Sorry for length but tks if you have an idea.
Phil
 
You have the wrong regulator. The correct one has three terminals on one side and the fourth one is beneath the regulator.

The key switch should have FOUR positions. OFF, LIGHTS, RUN and START.

If you have the correct switch and everything is wired correctly, then the coil will receive power when the switch is turned to LIGHTS, RUN and START.


It would be a big help if you post the actual SERIAL NUMBER of this 444. You will find that number on the metal ID TAG located on the dash tower opposite your right knee when sitting on the tractor.
 
Tks Tom, on the original reg it has the fourth terminal on the back/underside, so i will stick with that one for now.
Sounds like the switch has been changed, i agree that the coil should have power in run/start, it works like it is, but i had to check to be sure, good chance the switch is showing its age, so i will take it out for an inspection/surgery...
I got a wiring diagram on a web site showing a owners manual, and it all appears right, but a re-check in the morning, and i will get the number then.
Phil
 
The 444 was first produced for the 1969 model year and last produced for the 1988 model year. Over that time frame, at least seven Op Manuals and Parts Manuals were issued. The serial of PIN of the tractor is the only way to determine how the tractor was wired originally.

Over the years, past owners often butcher the original wiring harnesses and they use non-OEM parts such as voltage regulators and ignition switches. When those things occur, it makes it difficult to diagnose the problems with the electrical system. Ignition switches do wear out and can drive you crazy when they act erratic.

Once again, using the PIN to determine which is the correct ignition switch is essential. A good source for the right parts can be found at the link below. Bob Meyer has been a dealer since the 60's and he knows his stuff. He is also honest, whereas some Ingersoll dealers are not when it comes to pricing of parts.

Bob usually ships the same or next day at the lowest possible rates.
CASE Parts
 
Evening..Well it is here.
Tom, I got back to the case and found a number, # 9681759, and got some info on the key switch.
the dash decal shows these positions: off/lights/ignition/start, and it appears there was an "arrow" indication between ing/start?
On the connection side of the switch, it has these terminals..B/G/L/S/M.
In the off position M&G are common, with G common to the case" Ground"?? at all times.
In the on position M&G are open while it has B & L common, and B&S common in about half way turned towards start position, also this position has L common to B.
So lights/ignition have 12volts the same time as start position powers the solenoid.
This tractor has the idiot light to indicate charging, I connected an amp meter in its place and when running the needle is slightly shaking/moving,at half throttle but gets very erratic when the engine slows down.
Its not vibration as I was holding the meter in my hand, away from the tractor itself.
And to finish the day and, I found the ARM connection inside the starter had turned when I tightened the connection/touched the brush spring end,just more to do......
Oh yes, The field connection[ on starter] has 0volts on it[ battery pos to field connection with a volt meter ] when running..shouldn't there be 12v there or a exciting value of some level?
tks
 
PIN 9681759 indicates a 444 that was made for the 1973 model year. Therefore, this tractor should be painted Desert Sunset on the tin and Power Red for the frame, axles and rims.

The correct ignition switch has just four terminals.

B- for BATTERY

S - for START

L - for LIGHTS

I - for IGNITION

In other words, the tractor you are working on has the wrong switch in it.

There is absolutely no need for GROUND terminal.



IF the correct wiring harness is still in the tractor, then the wire going to the B terminal should be RED, the wire going to the S terminal should by YELLOW, the wire going to the L terminal should be PINK and the wire going to the I terminal should be BLACK with a WHITE STRIPE. There is also a 2nd wire that goes to the I terminal that comes from the red CHARGE light and it should be PURPLE.

If you send me an e-mail, I will send you a PDF of this OP Manual that covers all 444 models beginning with PIN 9661261 and ending with PIN 9711027.

My advice is to contact Bob Meyer at the link below, give him the PIN of this tractor and the model number and tell him you need a new ignition switch. You really cannot go forward properly with the switch that is there and a new switch is likely less than 30 bucks. I see this type of thing all the time. Owners go to NAPA or some other place and THINK that any old switch will work along with any old coil and voltage regulator.

That..... is a big mistake and it can cause big headaches for people who are trying to figure out why this tractor does not charge or start..
Case Parts
 
Tom, You sure know your Case L&G Tractors. Also thanks for the link to parts ! I will take it to the Case/IH Dealership where I retired from and still help out a little part time. Every once in awhile a customer stops for info not knowing where to turn for parts for his Case lawn tractor. This link will be helpful to those folks.

Thanks again, Bill
 
Evening Tom: I sent you an e-mail through this site, Maybe it came to you as "junk mail"? and it got missed/wrongly filed? would you take a look for it?
tks
 

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