1959 801 Powermaster 12V Conversion Issue

oifmedic

Member
I am restoring my dad's old 59 801 Powermaster. I am converting it over to a 12V system and I am having issues with it cranking over. I have bought a new wiring harness, points, coil, solenoid, new battery cables and alternator. I posted here several days ago and got some information from someone and worked out some of the bugs and replied back and didn't get a reply. I found a 12V wiring diagram online and wired everything up according to the diagram. Based off of the information from the gentleman that replied to my previous post, here are the things I have done so far.

1) With the Orange wire #6 on the R terminal of the junction block and I post of the solenoid and Yellow wire #4 connected to the S terminal of the solenoid and push button there is no voltage between the 2 small posts with switch turned off.

When the switch is turned on I got 12V?s between the 2 posts.

2) If I take wire #4 off of the push button and touch it to the R terminal on the junction block it will not crank over with the switch off, but it does crank over if I touch it to the L terminal.

3) If I move the Orange wire #6 from the R terminal on the junction block to the L and take the Yellow wire #4 off the push button and touch to the R or L terminal it will crank over.

But does nothing when connected to the Push Button.

I have attached the diagram that I found online as well as a diagram that I created showing an easier version of the way I have it wired. At this point I am thinking it may be the Push button start.
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*** The following is taking for granted that your tractor is negative ground ***

Sounds like your starter switch isn't grounded.

Here's a basic description of how your diagram should work:

First, your condition (1), the Junction Block is there so that the "Switch" kills the circuit. You can use a key switch, a neutral switch, or a combination of both. The Left post is connected to the battery and therefore hot all the time. The Right post is connected to the starter solenoid and the ignition system and are only hot when the "switch" is on. Either way, if the switch is not on, the starter button will not activate the starter solenoid, period.

Condition (2) - This condition works as you describe because the Left post is connected to the battery and the starter as described above. You're bypassing the junction block and sending 12V to the starter solenoid.

Condition (3) - Same as condition (2), you're bypassing the junction block.

The starter solenoid is basically a heavy duty, electrically activated switch. It has a coil inside that magnetizes when you apply 12V and a ground to the small posts that the Orange and Yellow wires are connected to. When it magnetizes, it pulls a metal slug that has a contact "bar" on the end that makes contact between the cables connected to the large posts on the solenoid, sending full battery power to the starter. This is done because the starter switch and the small wires connected to it are not heavy enough to carry full battery power to the starter.

If your starter switch is properly grounded, when you push the switch, basically what you're doing is grounding the yellow wire which completes the circuit and activates the solenoid, sending battery power directly to the starter.

Make SURE the tractor is in neutral or it will take off when it starts, then try this. Make sure your "switch" is on, take the yellow wire off the starter switch and touch it to the negative side of the battery or to a known good ground. The starter should crank it over. If it does, you need to make sure the paint is removed under the starter switch or you need to run a ground wire to one of the starter switch mounting bolts.
 
Okay, thank you! I will try this when I get home this afternoon and see what happens. I appreciate your input and replying.
 
(quoted from post at 11:54:40 07/27/18) Okay, thank you! I will try this when I get home this afternoon and see what happens. I appreciate your input and replying.
would say that you have the wrong solenoid for that application. There are two solenoid type that have I & S small terminals, one needs 12v between I & S to activate (the one you need) and the other needs 12 v on the S terminal to activate and when activated, there will be 12v on the S terminal (non-activated, S will be open). I believe you have this latter unit & it is wrong one for that tractor.
 
(reply to post at 08:15:18 07/27/18)
You need solenoid # 311006, available on this site $5.40
It has a isolated ground to work with the starter button which is a grounding contact point.

Standard grounded base solenoids like used on all Ford cars and trucks won't work with the tractors starter button.
 

Fords standard car solenoid is grounded base and has 4 post.
When you activate the start circuit "S" it energizes the "I" circuit to back feed the ignition coil.

The 12 volt conversion solenoids used on Ford tractors has a isolated ground with four post.
The key switch connects to the "I" post providing power to the solenoid, the starter button connects to the "S" post and when the button is pushed it provides a ground to activate the solenoid.

65 and later Ford tractors with gas engines used the same solenoid as the cars did.
 
Alright, oifmedic, do this.

*** Make SURE the tractor is out of gear. ***

First, disconnect the Orange and Yellow wire from the solenoid and check continuity between your "I" and "S"posts. If you do [b:b5d4026b30][i:b5d4026b30]NOT[/i:b5d4026b30][/b:b5d4026b30] have continuity, you have the wrong solenoid.

If you [b:b5d4026b30][i:b5d4026b30]DO[/i:b5d4026b30][/b:b5d4026b30] have continuity, reconnect the Yellow and Orange wires to the solenoid, turn your key on, disconnect the Yellow wire from the starter switch, and touch it to ground. The tractor should start. This tells you you have the correct solenoid and that you have either a bad starter switch or it is not grounded properly.
 
Yes, you're correct, I had forgotten the solenoid you fellows are talking about with the ignition relay. It is a ground base really with 4 posts.

I don't think this is his problem because of his statement in his condition (1) saying with the switch on he has 12v between the small posts on the solenoid.
 
The solenoid for the ford 2000 12V so I ordered the one Destroked 450 suggested and waiting for it to come in.
 
Good morning Gents,

I appreciate everyone's input on this post. The issue was that I had the wrong solenoid. Once I put it on the tractor fired up immediately. runs great!

thanks again!
 
Good morning, It was the solenoid. once I put it on the tractor fired up immediately. thanks for your input it was very helpful.
 
Good morning, you were correct Sir. it was the solenoid, tractor runs great now. thanks for your input, greatly appreciated.
 

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