Hydraulic or 90 wt. oil in Ford 601 Workmaster???

This message is a reply to an archived post by MarkB_MI on June 26, 2008 at 19:37:42.
The original subject was "Re: Hydraulic or 90 wt. oil in Ford 601 Workmaster???".

Just found this thread from a long time ago. Hope you are still active. Based on your comment, can I use the same UTF for the SOS transmission, the differential, and the area in between that I assume is the hydraulics? I have 3 drain plugs on the bottom of my 1964 4000 SOS Row Crop. UTF came out of the front (transmission), gear lube came out of the rear (differential) and some gray colored sludge came out of the plug in the middle that is under the output shaft disengage sleeve.
 

Make sure it "meets or exceeds" your spec.

The answer to your question is yes, you may. However, I personally prefer the 80W-90 in the rear end and in gear drive transmissions of that era. Many on this forum have differing opinions on the matter though.
 
Make sure the S-O-S transmission gets the correct/specified fluid, if you don't, this transmission will fail in short order. Middle compartment is tractor hydraulics.

Using the same fluid and making it common for all 3 compartments is due to the seals between them allowing the fluids to mingle. Since the hydraulics don't like 90 wt., the recommendation was to use the same in all 3 compartments.

Sounds like your hydraulic compartment has water from condensation, good that you changed it, but make sure to use only the correct fluid in the S-O-S.
 
Remember that if the S-O-S transmission fails it will either be NOT repairable, or repairable at an extremely high price. Is now the time to try and save money on fluids? Go down to the New Holland dealer and pay for the current version of 134.
 
Thanks for the input. You convinced me not to use the cheap stuff even though I am pretty sure the last owner had Farm and Fleet UTF (a regional farm store chain) in it and it worked fine.
I just found that "Mobilfluid 424" meets/exceeds Ford F134D specs. I called the local NH Dealer, the parts department told me that "most of this stuff is all the same". I found that amusing. The NH brand he has for the application would cost me twice a much. I will go with the Mobilfluid 424 since they actually go to the trouble of publishing an application list.
https://www.mobil.com/english-us/commercial-vehicle-lube/pds/glxxmobilfluid-424.
 
I had a mid 60's 4000 SOS and don't remember the fluid. I have a 2000 (blue 600 series) and the hyd pipes between the hyd pump and the hyd sump developed pin holes (Soundguy identified that for me...thank you sir). As a result I was draining the tranny sump and adding fluid to the hyd sump off and on over time.

Since I was using 303 (aka JD 303 trans hyd fluid spec for older tractors) which is 134B/C spec'd oil, aka trans-hydraulic fluid for older tractors, I just drained the tranny and refilled with 303 when did it to the hyd sump. The rear sump still has gear oil however. Butttt my '65 3000 has a common hyd/diff sump so if it's good enough for the 3000 it's surely good enough for the 2000. Only problem I'd expect would be an increase in gear noise and improved leaking....Wink. So, per Ford's choice, I'd say why not use it?
 
Make sure it meets the current Ford 134 spec or avoid it, it's just not worth any kind of savings.
I'd 2nd what Ian said, New Holland offers the current type, Ambra. I use it in a much newer tractor and sure it's like $70 a 5 gallon bucket if I recall. Still inexpensive compared to the alternative.

I have seen in the past, equivalents that stated it was for Select-O-Speed transmission right on the bucket. As long as it meets the ford /NH spec, should be good to go.
 
(quoted from post at 12:26:50 06/08/18) Master 303 Tractor Hydraulic Fluid -- The label says it is for many "older" tractors including Ford.

No!!! 303 is outlawed in some states. You sure don't want it in your Ford.

Furthermore, if the label doesn't specifically state "meets or exceeds" Ford M2C-41 or NH M2C-134D run . . . don't walk away from the stuff!
 

The ambiguous use of "303" as a name is banned and declared illegal. Did JD have something to do with this? Illegal use/infringement of trademark?

The others simply sell "universal tractor hydraulic fluid". This law will simply require them to relabel the containers. The lawmakers may even go after the uth label as well. You can say it meets 303 but not sell it as "JD 303 " unless you are john deere. In most cases they are not even saying that, just that it meets older tractor specs. This may require them to put on specs, but that will require them to test and certify. SO they will simply go to "meets or exceeds" based of tests by others and not pay for the "star" like some other big oil sellers. (api seal or star)
 
There sure are a lot of users of 303 that think this is just another "money boondoggle" for those who market their products for
2 to 3 times the price. (based on comments related to these provided links) From what I read, it has been banned simply
because it is a "old" product? As I replied to another here, I decided to give my 4000 a taste of the "good stuff". Unless
most of the fluids I drained out of it were installed by Ford in 1964 (a possibility?) I suspect it was more likely a store
brand UTF version of 303 (Farm and Fleet UTF) I drained out and now need to replace. I am using the Mobil brand that actually
says on the label it is equal to or better than what Ford specified for it in 1964, "just to be safe". (at twice the price?)
$25 extra to replace it seems "cheap" if there is a possibility of extending the service life of the S-O-S transmission but I
can't help but think I am a victim of "big oil marketing" once again. A drop in the bucked compared to what they steal from me
every day at the pump. The tractor operated fine before I decided to change out all the liquids, lets hope I don't introduce a
new "virus". Thanks for your input and the same thanks to any and all others who take their time to respond to my issues. I
have 3 Fords. This 1964 - 4000 Row-Crop, S-O-S, a 1956 - 641, and the 1948 - 8N I started with.
 
I am pretty sure the last owner had Farm and Fleet UTF (a regional farm store chain) in it and it worked fine.

I just looked at the Fleet & Farm UTF on line and it at least claims to exceed the JD J20C specification which is a much newer spec that the JD 303, and I do believe that the J20C spec exceeds the original M2C41A that was the original spec from Ford for the S-O-S trans.
 
The store chain in our area is based out of Janesville Wisconsin and is "Blain's Farm and Fleet". My 4000 took all 5
gallons of the Mobil 424 for the SOS and the Hydraulic's so now I guess I will use gearlube in the the differential after all. Should I use the
80W-90 or go with the 85W-140?
 

If you're in a Farm and Fleet area I'd think 80W-90 would be plenty heavy that far north. It likely is anyway.
 
They did. I think the brand I am referencing is SuperS 303. I have old containers from that company and some I just bought at TSC. The
new ones still call it 303, but it's labeled as hydraulic fluid, not trans-hyd, and on the rear no specs appear. What does appear is verbiage
to the effect that: "Field tested for use with bla bla"...hyd. systems, transmissions, wet brakes, several of the items listed that I remember.

Really glad you posted this as I just bought some of their Memorial day sale fluid for 16 bucks a 5 gallon pail vs 26 I had paid a few months
earlier apparently for the same fluid.....just different verbiage on the container. Wondering why the difference in labeling.

Again, 303 is the old spec like 134 B/C and not 134D, like J20C, for new hydrostatic systems. The OEM Owner's manual for my newly
acquired 1988 3910 specifies 134 B/C, not 134D and that's in the year 1988, not 1960, even though the tractor has wet brakes and IND.
PTO.......no SOS consideration here, straight geared, non-sync. tranny.

I have a Branson 2400 that specs J20C equivalent due to hydrostatic steering (my guess)...manual, non-sync tranny, tranny PTO. I'd like to
use 303 in it if it weren't for the steering being hydro since my Fords (non sync. geared) use 303 and they shift a lot smoother due to the
higher viscosity. My guess is that hydrostatic systems require a different type pump requiring a thinner oil with different/more additives.
Since I'm in Texas it might not make a difference. I know when I bought my 2009 Dodge Hemi, 0w-20 was specified and the owner's
manual stated that the oil pump in that engine was designed for that weight oil......boy was that a blow for a guy that used 15w-40 in
everything and swore by it. The Hemi used the 4-8-4 system for fuel economy and said that a thicker viscosity oil would/may hinder it's
operation.....so yes fluid ratings are the pump's requirements.

Reference: Without regard for any published spec., I have both types of oil and just a couple of days ago tested both oils and the newer
spec'd oil is a lower viscosity. How much I don't know but enough to be considerably noticeable.
 

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