Ford 3500 Rear Hydraulics Needed

easygoin4

Member
Posting for a friend- he has a 3500 loader with 3 point.
Just picked up a 3pt backhoe for small jobs - now needs rear remote hydraulics to run it.
Has a plate below seat but nothing else.
My Massey 65 has rear remotes and it comes from under seat - I think they are similar to the fords?

Anyone have any pictures or parts of what he needs, valves, or new plate with hoses.

thanks for the help..
 
Yes sir a valve bolts on, he should just need a single remote which can be had new or used, about 250 bucks give or take, a double as pictured here will run about twice that.
a177555.jpg
 
easygoin4,
The rear Hydraulics will work, but I would guess that there is a front pump and hydraulic valve already for the loader. It should have a power beyond feature (2 ports).
You should be able to hook 2 short hoses up with quick disconnects and then use hoses from the backhoe adding quick disconnects to them.

The advantage would be that the front pump is more than likely a high output pump, thus it would run the backhoe faster.
HTH
Keith
 
If the current front pump and loader do not offer power beyond capability, a less expensive alternative to the remote valve is a hydraulic adapter plate that fits under the existing blocking plate on the top cover. Just Google "HV4902 Kit" and you'll find plenty of places on line selling them for less than $75.00. If you go with the plate, use quick disconnects of opposite gender on the lines where they connect to the backhoe. A male connector on one line going to the back of the tractor and a female connector on the other line, and the opposite gender connector on the corresponding line from the backhoe. That serves two purposes: 1.) It keeps you from confusing which line goes where, and 2.) It allows you to loop the two lines from the plate together when the backhoe is not on the tractor, which is required to let the 3 point lift work.
 
And I missed the part about the loader, yes if it has a loader tapping into that hydraulic system would be preferable to using the internal hydraulics, and if the model is an industrial without 3pt it may not even have internal hydraulics
 

Thanks all for the information I will show my friend, I too was wondering if the front valve would work, just not sure what you do with the loader lines- did not know you could run both at same time.

Regarding the rear connections - I noticed on my Massey they have what looks to be 2 original female quick disconnects- however both the same size. Does it matter which goes to your Implements, I thought one should be feed and one return.
Thanks Again
 
(quoted from post at 08:18:56 11/09/17)
Thanks all for the information I will show my friend, I too was wondering if the front valve would work, just not sure what you do with the loader lines- did not know you could run both at same time.

You can only run two control valves in series properly on an open center system if one of the control valves has power beyond capabilities. If your loader currently has one line going from the sump (probably in the frame of the loader) to the pump, another single line from the pump to the control valve and another single line from the control valve back to the sump, then it is currently configured for open center without power beyond. Some valves can be easily reconfigured between plain open center and open center with power beyond by replacing a plug that can be gotten from the valve manufacturer, but others cannot. If yours cannot be reconfigured, the only way to get both the loader and backhoe to work off of the front pump would be to replace the loader control valve with one that can be configured with power beyond.

Regarding the rear connections - I noticed on my Massey they have what looks to be 2 original female quick disconnects- however both the same size. Does it matter which goes to your Implements, I thought one should be feed and one return.
Thanks Again

If it is a single remote valve and it has two connections, then it is designed for a dual acting cylinder, so one line provides power to one side of the cylinder when you move the control handle in one direction, and the other provides power to the other side of the cylinder when you move the handle in the opposite direction. Whenever one side of the cylinder is getting fluid to push the ram in one direction the other line provides the path for the fluid from the other side of the cylinder to return through the control valve to the sump.

To power a 3 point backhoe that has its own control valve from a remote, you would connect the lines form the remote valve to the "power" and "return" ports of the backhoe valve and use a bungee cord to hold the handle of the remote valve open in one direction or the other, whichever position allows the backhoe control valve to operate in the manner that you would like, in terms of which directions the individual handles are moved on the backhoe valve result in which direction the backhoe cylinders actually move.
 
(quoted from post at 12:44:59 11/09/17)
(quoted from post at 08:18:56 11/09/17)
Thanks all for the information I will show my friend, I too was wondering if the front valve would work, just not sure what you do with the loader lines- did not know you could run both at same time.

You can only run two control valves in series properly on an open center system if one of the control valves has power beyond capabilities. If your loader currently has one line going from the sump (probably in the frame of the loader) to the pump, another single line from the pump to the control valve and another single line from the control valve back to the sump, then it is currently configured for open center without power beyond. Some valves can be easily reconfigured between plain open center and open center with power beyond by replacing a plug that can be gotten from the valve manufacturer, but others cannot. If yours cannot be reconfigured, the only way to get both the loader and backhoe to work off of the front pump would be to replace the loader control valve with one that can be configured with power beyond.

Regarding the rear connections - I noticed on my Massey they have what looks to be 2 original female quick disconnects- however both the same size. Does it matter which goes to your Implements, I thought one should be feed and one return.
Thanks Again

If it is a single remote valve and it has two connections, then it is designed for a dual acting cylinder, so one line provides power to one side of the cylinder when you move the control handle in one direction, and the other provides power to the other side of the cylinder when you move the handle in the opposite direction. Whenever one side of the cylinder is getting fluid to push the ram in one direction the other line provides the path for the fluid from the other side of the cylinder to return through the control valve to the sump.

To power a 3 point backhoe that has its own control valve from a remote, you would connect the lines form the remote valve to the "power" and "return" ports of the backhoe valve and use a bungee cord to hold the handle of the remote valve open in one direction or the other, whichever position allows the backhoe control valve to operate in the manner that you would like, in terms of which directions the individual handles are moved on the backhoe valve result in which direction the backhoe cylinders actually move.


Thanks for all the help.
I will try to put pictures on.

3 pictures of his Ford, front control, lines, and rear plate.
2 pictures of my Massey, rear remotes, and control under seat.
5832.jpg
5833.jpg
5834.jpg
5835.jpg
 


here is last picture of My Massey rear remote quick disconnects- same size.

I was telling my friend about my Massey setup and hoping it was what he needed, since Ford and Massey are similar..
Thanks Again
5838.jpg
 
Ford (and I assume Massey as well) had different remote valves available depending on what you needed to control, single and double valves, and the individual spools could be single or double acting, and some could be switched between single and double acting.

That valve on the Massey in your picture has 2 handles, and there are only two lines going out the back of the tractor, but I see plugs on the top of the valve body on the second spool where the lines are connected on the first spool, so my guess would be that it is a dual control valve, with both spools setup for double acting cylinders, but only one of the spools has lines connected to it.
 
Oh yeah, the loader control valve on that 3500 does not look like it can easily be setup for power beyond, and it is pretty much hard lined right into the frame of the loader, so it would be a tough changeover to remove it and replace it with a valve with power beyond capabilities. On most Ford tractors of that age that had both a loader and a backhoe, the power beyond capability was in the backhoe control valve.
 
(quoted from post at 21:13:05 11/09/17) Ford (and I assume Massey as well) had different remote valves available depending on what you needed to control, single and double valves, and the individual spools could be single or double acting, and some could be switched between single and double acting.

That valve on the Massey in your picture has 2 handles, and there are only two lines going out the back of the tractor, but I see plugs on the top of the valve body on the second spool where the lines are connected on the first spool, so my guess would be that it is a dual control valve, with both spools setup for double acting cylinders, but only one of the spools has lines connected to it.

Thanks Now looking at it that makes sense..
 

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