4000 ford identify

Pspurg

New User
I have what i believe to be a 4000 ford. There are no serial numbers. I have checked in the proper place and it is bare. It has a louvered hood. The grill is one piece. It has 18.4 28" rears and 16 inch fronts. What stumps me is that it has drum brakes. The power steering is independent of the steering box. It is a three cylinder diesel. Can anyone help identify this tractor?
 
A 2000, or 3000 or 4000 su all could have drum brakes and aftermarket steering.. louvered hood should make it a '65 to aug of 68 model.. There are no numbers on left or right side of transmission in the proper spot? Does it have one steering arm, or two, what is the full casting number on the side of the engine.. and you might have a tractor where the dealer replace the tranny and did not remark it. so no serial numbers, model numbers or date codes.
 
No... the SU has the same rear end with the double reduction final drive and wet disk brakes as a regular 4000.
It sounds to me like a mutt. Or maybe a 3000 with aftermarket p/s. Some of those kits do away with the right drag link.
 
The 'SU' is a variant of the 4000 with the 28" rear tires, front axle and steering of a 3000, but the drive train and h.p. of a 4000.
 
Likely to be a 3500. The only 4000 variant with drum brakes would be a 4110, and that would have a double drop steering box.
 
On the right side of the engine block just above the oil pan is a flat rail. The engine serial number should be stamped into that rail near the front of the engine. The letter at the beginning of the engine serial number tells you what series the engine was made for. Check that and you'll at least know which engine it has.

Pre 4/1/68
L - 2000
N - 3000
P - 4000

4/1/1968 & up
B - 2000
C - 3000
D - 4000

You say that it only has one steering arm and the front axle is straight. Is it a solid piece front axle, or are the ends with the spindles slid inside the center section and bolted in place so that it can be adjusted for various widths? If it is a solid non-adjustable front axle then it is most likely a 3500 as Fordfarmer says. If it is adjustable then it sounds like it has been cobbled together with parts from different tractors. The transmissions were the same in terms of the front and rear mating to the engine and rear axle on all of the 3 cylinder models of that time period, so it could be the front end and steering from one model and a rear axle from a different model. The fact that there are no numbers stamped in the flat spot on the transmission indicates that at least the transmission was swapped out at some point.
 



no.....Early 4000 lcg's or su's had the 3000 rear end and drum brakes. Later ones have the 4000 reduction rear end... I have had several of both models of the lcg or su model 4000s. My neighbor still has the early 3 cyl 4000 lcg or su with the drum brakes today.


If he has the straight heavy front axle, its sounding like a 3500 model.. but still normally would have been stamped with numbers in the correct places. A 3500 would have different steering than the 3000 all purpose.
 

SU means Special Utility
It appears the 4110 LGC was available in a ag model that could have been designated as a SU model. This is basically a 3000 with the larger 4000 engine. I've never seen one.
The earliest SU model I remember was a 69 model and like my 72 model SU it had a 3000 style axle, steering, tin, and fuel tank with 14.9-28 rear tires, but had the standard 4000 planetary drive wet brake rear axle

I don't know of any tractor that Ford built using a standard 4000 front axle and steering that had 3000 style drum brakes.
My money is on the tractor being a mutt.

Check the production dates on the engine, trans, rear axle to see if they are the same year and within a couple months of each other.

Engine date is on a small flat pad on the right front of the block between the inj pump and oil pan, dist drive and oil pan on gas models.
Trans date is on the left side of the trans behind or under the hyd pump.
Axle date is on top of the mounting flange where the axle bolts to the trans, normally just left of center.

Let us know what you find.
 
The P on the engine serial number definitely makes it a pre-4/1/68 4000 engine.

There are no models that I can think of from that time period that would have the adjustable straight front axle with a single sided steering and a rear axle with drum brakes.

It sounds like it's the front half of a 4000 ag chassis mated with the rear axle from a 3000 series (or possibly 2000 series). Is the cross section of the rear axle round or square? Is the draft plunger spring exposed at the back of the tractor by the toplink rocker or is it enclosed? Does it have a flow control valve on the right side of the rear axle center housing? I assume that it has a piston pump on the left side of the engine back by the flywheel to power the 3 point hydraulics.

Some pictures of the tractor would be helpful.

You can also check the date codes on the individual components. If it was cobbled together from parts from two different tractors most of the components would all be dated close to each other and one or more of the remaining components would probably be months or years away from the rest. The engine should have a date code a little above and toward the front of the tractor from the engine serial number. The transmission should have one too, stamped into the flat spot on the left side, as well as the rear axle center housing, the hydraulic pump and the hydraulic top cover. The date codes should all have the format nXnn or nXnnX where the X's are letters and the n's are numerals.
 
Was rereading this... You aren't equating the 4000 lcg's with the su's, are you? I know the lcg's used drum brakes.
 

yes.. the earlys were lcgs,, the laters where su's both were famously used as hyway shredding tractors down here. Great for hillsides...
 
(quoted from post at 18:08:12 09/03/17) Was rereading this... You aren't equating the 4000 lcg's with the su's, are you? I know the lcg's used drum brakes.

The 4110 lcg was the same as the 2110 lcg with the radius rod front end, double sided steering and single reduction rear axle with drum brakes. The only difference was the the engine.
 
Looking more like a 3000 rearend and
tranny. No diff lock tho.
a170980.jpg

a170981.jpg

a170982.jpg
 

Yea it looks like a 3000 rear axle and for sure as a 4000 front axle, bolster and grill shell.

The numbers in the pics are casting number and done help much, the production dates are stamped in at locations I previously post.
 
(quoted from post at 09:26:04 09/05/17)
On a earlier post he stated a P engine number so the engine and front axle are 4000, trans?, rear axle 3000.

Initial post was that there were no numbers stamped on the trans at all, which makes me think that a replacement trans was installed at some point. Maybe it was wrecked and the original trans and rear axle housings were both cracked, so they found a donor rear axle and bought a replacement transmission?
 

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