Ford 4500 right rear brake dragging

yolner

New User
I have a 1970 Ford 4500 and it feels like the right rear brake is dragging. These are the wet brakes not regular drum brakes so just getting into them to fix the issue is a huge job. So far I have tried loosening the adjusters and changed the fluid to 134D UTF.

Does anyone have any guesses on what could cause the wet brakes to stick and is there anything I can try to break them loose without ripping the rear axle apart?
 
Yeah, that's what I was afraid of. I guess I'll baby it for now and plan on doing brakes next year. Thank you for the advice.
 
I suppose it could be a problem with the actuator... but my money would be on warped plates... particularly if the pedal is spongy. Getting
them apart is not that big of a deal if you have something to lift the axle housing.

Rod
 
You can't really see it but a engine hoist works well to remove the axle housing. Then you can suspend it from the engine hoist to work on the brakes. I had to just replace the axle seals on my 1971 4500 so you might as well replace them also while you are fixing the brakes.
2259.jpg
 
I guess I should have mentioned this before but my 4500 is actually a little different. It was modified into a forklift by KD Manitou and controls are reversed to face the back. It also has a ridiculously heavy homemade rollcage that some previous owner welded together. So I'll have to take that off then take off the forklift frame and only then will I be able to get at the rear axle.

Basically a massive job. Since I only use this machine once a month or so I'm thinking this is going towards the back of my todo list.

Will running it with the one wheel dragging cause any damage to the transmission? I have the 4x4 power reversing trans with the torque converter.
 

Quick question.
Are the pedal return springs under the foot board in place pulling the pedal back up, if the spring is broke and gone the weight of the pedal will cause the brakes to drag.
Also check the pedal pivot bushing before tearing into the rear axle, I've seen a few that where never greased and where binding up not letting the pedal fully return.

Just a couple of quick things to check.
 
(quoted from post at 08:54:46 08/20/17)
Quick question.
Are the pedal return springs under the foot board in place pulling the pedal back up, if the spring is broke and gone the weight of the pedal will cause the brakes to drag.
Also check the pedal pivot bushing before tearing into the rear axle, I've seen a few that where never greased and where binding up not letting the pedal fully return.

Just a couple of quick things to check.

Yes, I noticed that the springs don't always return the right brake pedal all the way up. Seems to get stuck about 1" low sometimes, but I doubt that would be enough to make the brake drag that much. Still I'll try replacing the springs and see what happens.

Any thoughts on possible transmission issues if I do run it this way? I usually only use it for about 30 minutes every month or so.
 

Hook your toe under the pedal and pull it up, then see if they are still dragging.
Dragging brakes won't hurt the trans, the extra brake particles in the rear end oil won't do the bearings any good plus any hydraulics using oil from the rear diff will also be subject to the particles, other wise it'll just wear out the brakes a lot faster and rob engine power when moving around.
 
(quoted from post at 12:23:38 08/20/17)
Dragging brakes won't hurt the trans, the extra brake particles in the rear end oil won't do the bearings any good plus any hydraulics using oil from the rear diff will also be subject to the particles, other wise it'll just wear out the brakes a lot faster and rob engine power when moving around.

Does that apply even if I have the 4x4 power reversing trans? It's not a regular manual trans and has a torque converter.
 

Your 4 spd power reversing trans has a separate sump and does not share oil with the rear diff.
A dragging brake won't hurt the transmission, it'll just made the converter hard a little harder.
 
A dragging brake will make the torque converter/transmission run a little hotter which isn't good for it. Since you only run it for about 30 minutes a month I wouldn't worry about that. If you ran it 8 - 10 hours a day, every day that would be a different story.
 
(quoted from post at 08:47:45 08/20/17) I guess I should have mentioned this before but my 4500 is actually a little different. It was modified into a forklift by KD Manitou and controls are reversed to face the back. It also has a ridiculously heavy homemade rollcage that some previous owner welded together. So I'll have to take that off then take off the forklift frame and only then will I be able to get at the rear axle.

Basically a massive job. Since I only use this machine once a month or so I'm thinking this is going towards the back of my todo list.

My 4500, all the way from this.
2282.jpg


Down to this.
2284.jpg
 
My 4500, all the way from this.
2282.jpg


Down to this.
2284.jpg

Yeah that's what I'm scared of. Feel like if I start pulling pieces off it'll turn into a full resto and I just don't have time for another project.
 
(quoted from post at 15:29:01 08/20/17)
Your 4 spd power reversing trans has a separate sump and does not share oil with the rear diff.
A dragging brake won't hurt the transmission, it'll just made the converter hard a little harder.
(quoted from post at 15:55:55 08/20/17) A dragging brake will make the torque converter/transmission run a little hotter which isn't good for it. Since you only run it for about 30 minutes a month I wouldn't worry about that. If you ran it 8 - 10 hours a day, every day that would be a different story.

Understood. Thanks for all the great advice guys! I'm sure I'll be back here once I work up the courage to get into this job.
 

I didn't get the hoe with mine but it ended up looking a lot like yours before going back together.
Only thing I didn't do was a triple split, after getting it running we found a bearing making noise in the trans, so guess what I get to do now.
The brakes where bad so I swapped on some outer axle assemblies off of a 3930 I'd parted out only to find they where in worst condition so I get to take all that back apart as well.
 
(quoted from post at 16:18:39 08/20/17)
My 4500, all the way from this.
2282.jpg


Down to this.
2284.jpg

Yeah that's what I'm scared of. Feel like if I start pulling pieces off it'll turn into a full resto and I just don't have time for another project.



Paid $1400 for it, had a rod knock, spun the # 1 rod bearing, trashed the crankshaft, and connecting rod. Replaced the 4 x 4 torque convertor setup with a standard 6 x 2 transmission (going to spend the rest of its days on the farm). Got a good used Ford crankshaft, had it turned, got a good used Ford connecting rod to replace the bad one, and had the block bored .020" over. Hoping to have the engine except for the cylinder head back in it this week, so I'm past all the removing parts stage (thankfully).
 
Replaced the 4 x 4 torque convertor setup with a standard 6 x 2 transmission (going to spend the rest of its days on the farm).

How much did you pay for the transmission? I'm considering getting rid of the torque converter trans in the future.
 
I paid $450 for the transmission, another $150 replacing the bearings (didn't like the way a couple of them felt, trans had some water in it) + new seals. Paid $150 for the flywheel, and clutch. I had the luxury of time to look for good deals, so if you plan on changing the transmission get the transmission with the clutch, and flywheel together, its a lot easier than piecing it together like I did. I'd suggest start looking for one now if you keep your budget on the swap low.
 
I beg to differ on that statement. When those brakes start going to hell, the particles they shed plug every intake screen, filter, valve and
orifice they get into. They accelerate wear on everything. If the oil is getting dirty with iron filings, the best thing to do is just park
it.

Rod
 

In a normal tractor I'd agree but all of the 4500's I've seen don't have any type of hydraulics operating off of the rear diff fluid.
No hyd pump, 3 point lift or remotes, loader and hoe operate off of the hydraulic system in the front of the tractor.
If it's had hydraulics added like mine (3 point lift) then that is subject to contamination and future problems.

If the brake is only lightly dragging and he only uses it 30 minutes a month, draining the old fluid and filling it with fresh 134 could get him by for a while.
If the brake is dragging pretty heavy it needs tore into and repaired.

Ether way it's wearing the brakes and the longer it goes the more it will cost to repair.

As I said before, the first thing I'd do is make sure the pedals are fully raised and see if the brake is still dragging.
 

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