Ford 600 series

I have a 600 Series Ford, Namely a 631, with the Ford Red Tiger Engine. I've replaced all the electrical components on the tractor. New 3 post 12v regulator, new resistor, new 12v coil, new dist, cap, new points, new condenser, new rotor, new plug wires, new plugs. All top brands. I replaced any wires spliced together, with wire crimp style connectors. I still have no power coming to the coil. I also replaced all connectors between the points and coil, and installed new wiring and connectors. Still no fire to coil. Before I did all this, at times you could grab 3 wires that apparently came down from the dash, pull on them, and the tractor would fire up, instantly. Could a loose wire on a gauge cause this problem? The gauges were all new when I bought the tractor several years ago, plus it's always been stored indoors, since I became the owner. Any ideas??? One last thing, when I turn the engine over now, the rotor, strikes the cap and pops it a loose. I can't find the old rotor to compare. I ordered most of the parts through this site. Thanks in advance! :?: :(
 
Loose wire or a poor ground or you installing to many new parts with out making sure each one did its job before moving on the the next new part. One should always trouble shoot then parts. never the other way around.
 

Four things:

1. A 631 was not a 12V system from the factory. It was a 6V positive ground. Has it been converted? If not any 12V component you installed is incorrect.

2. A 631 is not a 600 series. It is a 601 series.

3. Power to your coil comes from the B- (OEM configuration) terminal on the starter solenoid to the non switched side of your terminal block under the dash, then through your ignition switch to the switched side of the terminal block then to the coil. Gauges have no effect on this circuit.

4. Your rotor or your distributor cap, or both is incorrect - unless you left the little clip off the shaft under the rotor.
 
(quoted from post at 16:36:47 08/01/17)
Four things:

1. A 631 was not a 12V system from the factory. It was a 6V positive ground. Has it been converted? If not any 12V component you installed is incorrect.

2. A 631 is not a 600 series. It is a 601 series.

3. Power to your coil comes from the B- (OEM configuration) terminal on the starter solenoid to the non switched side of your terminal block under the dash, then through your ignition switch to the switched side of the terminal block then to the coil. Gauges have no effect on this circuit.

4. Your rotor or your distributor cap, or both is incorrect - unless you left the little clip off the shaft under the rotor.
1339.jpg


This is a pic of the tractor at current.

1-The total system has been converted to 12v.

2-I had no idea it was a 601 series, thanks for the info.

3-I will need to check this. The tractor has a lot of half done, conversions. I will attempt to track back your info.

4- If the rotor and cap are incorrect, I may have ordered the wrong ones. The ones I ordered also showed to be the same on the Jubilee. So, I'll check that too.

Thanks for the info.
 
(quoted from post at 15:49:08 08/01/17) Loose wire or a poor ground or you installing to many new parts with out making sure each one did its job before moving on the the next new part. One should always trouble shoot then parts. never the other way around.

For what it's worth. All the replaced components, were checked before they were replaced. Fire from the coil was weak, and created an orange spark, rather than blue, distributor was cracked and covered in paint, as were the plug wires, points were burned, battery lug on the voltage regulator was broken. 90% of the items were tested, prior to replacement. I will double check for loose wires, or faulty grounds. Thanks! Have a great day!
 
New 3 post 12v regulator

From your picture I think that you meant to say "New 3 post 12v alternator".

4- If the rotor and cap are incorrect, I may have ordered the wrong ones. The ones I ordered also showed to be the same on the Jubilee. So, I'll check that too.

The engine in the Jubilee is the same as the engine in the 600/700 and 601/701 series, as well as the later 4 cylinder 2000 series. I think that the reason that the rotor is hitting the cap is probably due to you not knowing about the clip under the rotor and losing said clip when you swapped rotors.
 
(quoted from post at 20:36:55 08/01/17)
New 3 post 12v regulator

From your picture I think that you meant to say "New 3 post 12v alternator".

4- If the rotor and cap are incorrect, I may have ordered the wrong ones. The ones I ordered also showed to be the same on the Jubilee. So, I'll check that too.

The engine in the Jubilee is the same as the engine in the 600/700 and 601/701 series, as well as the later 4 cylinder 2000 series. I think that the reason that the rotor is hitting the cap is probably due to you not knowing about the clip under the rotor and losing said clip when you swapped rotors.

No, respectively, this was a 3 post voltage regulator (12v)

This new dust cap, had a star of sort washer, in the top of the dust cover, with a felt washer below. I took the "clip" you mention out, which was majority broken. I trashed it, and installed the new dust cover. I should still have fire at the coil, regardless, right?

And thanks, everything I had read said, the side distributor engines were the same for many years of tractor production. I've owned tractors since my teens, and have never encountered an issue such as this one. Thanks!
 
I feel that I don't have enough information to be of help. Things I always check on a no-spark issue:
1...is there power to the coil
2...is power coming out of coil to dist. with the engine turning over?
3...is it a 12 volt coil, is there a resister involved, I always use internally resisted coils
4...take the cap, rotor, dust cap off, and check for power at the points. The connection through the distributor body could be shorted out.
5...are the points opening? are they opening enough? Check gap. Is there spark at the points?
if you have good spark at points and they are set properly, this problem is upstream.
6...check rotor, dist. cap, rotor clip (you need this on these engines), replace the condenser...I've had these bad before. Replaced the condenser and she fired right up.
7...finally, check resistance in plug wires and coil wire with an ohm gauge.
8...check plugs
Get yourself an in-line spark tester for around $5.00. It tells you at a glance if you have fire at the plugs

An old boy once told me that if you have an electrical issue, check your ground. If you still have an electrical issue...check your ground. Then if you still have an electrical issue...check your ground. In this simple ignition system, the points are that ground
 
(quoted from post at 17:11:45 08/01/17)

I took the"clip" you mention out, which was majority broken. I trashed it, and installed the new dust cover.

Gotta get a new clip in there! While the lack of it shouldn't affect fire to the points, it very likely accounts for your rotor hitting your cap.
 
need more info for us to help.
With the nose tin not matching the fenders...what is it?
600's and 601's are wired differently.
Look for the numbers on the trans behind the starter.

Looks like a 1 wire alternator, I think I can see the plug.
When you say "3 post regulator", do you mean the solenoid?
If it is a 3 post solenoid that points to it being a 600.
(the floorboard and sediment bowl also point to a 600)

The rotor clip we are asking you about is not part of the dust cover, it is directly under the rotor on the shaft..tiny little thing....and it is missing an amazing mount of times on non-runners I buy.

Regardless of model..if jiggling wires does 'anything', do some studying and re-wire it completely. It will save you a LOT of headaches.
 

I see no mention of replacing the ignition switch or even checking the continuity. They are known to be intermittent the going bad.
 
No, respectively, this was a 3 post voltage regulator (12v)

Why does it have a 12 volt voltage regulator when OI can see from your pictures that it has an alternator? Doesn't that alternator have an internal voltage regulator?

This new dust cap, had a star of sort washer, in the top of the dust cover, with a felt washer below. I took the "clip" you mention out, which was majority broken. I trashed it, and installed the new dust cover. I should still have fire at the coil, regardless, right?

The clip has nothing to do with the dust cover. It has to do with the rotor. It holds the rotor on the shaft in the proper position. If the clip is not there the rotor will wobble around on the shaft and hit the cap which can damage both the cap and the rotor.

Yes, whether the clip is there or not should not affect anything at the coil.

I am not sure what you mean by "fire at the coil" though. Is the primary of the coil getting voltage but there's no spark at the secondary when the points open? Have you tried manually closing and opening the points to take the rest of the distributor out of the picture? Have you checked the wire from the coil to the points where it passes through the side of the distributor housing to make sure that it's not shorting to ground there?
 
(quoted from post at 10:49:50 08/02/17) need more info for us to help.
With the nose tin not matching the fenders...what is it?
600's and 601's are wired differently.
Look for the numbers on the trans behind the starter.

Looks like a 1 wire alternator, I think I can see the plug.
When you say "3 post regulator", do you mean the solenoid?
If it is a 3 post solenoid that points to it being a 600.
(the floorboard and sediment bowl also point to a 600)

The rotor clip we are asking you about is not part of the dust cover, it is directly under the rotor on the shaft..tiny little thing....and it is missing an amazing mount of times on non-runners I buy.

Regardless of model..if jiggling wires does 'anything', do some studying and re-wire it completely. It will save you a LOT of headaches.

Yes, forgive me, it is a 3 post solenoid. It is also a one wire alternator.
I'm aware of the clip folks are mentioning. The clip was on top of the distributor shaft, through the dust cover, and into the rotor. I will obtain a new clip for it, and add it to the distributor shaft. After seeing this new dust cover, I felt (wrong) but sure, the star looking ring, would replace the clip.
If I add the clip, and according to other people that posted, double check all the grounds, I should find the problem. I will take pictures today, of the other side of the engine, so all can see what is there. Thanks! for your help.
 
(quoted from post at 10:54:09 08/02/17)
I see no mention of replacing the ignition switch or even checking the continuity. They are known to be intermittent the going bad.

Yes Sir, new ignition switch (key), also. Thanks
 
(quoted from post at 16:36:47 08/01/17)
Four things:

1. A 631 was not a 12V system from the factory. It was a 6V positive ground. Has it been converted? If not any 12V component you installed is incorrect.

2. A 631 is not a 600 series. It is a 601 series.

3. Power to your coil comes from the B- (OEM configuration) terminal on the starter solenoid to the non switched side of your terminal block under the dash, then through your ignition switch to the switched side of the terminal block then to the coil. Gauges have no effect on this circuit.

Thanks Larry, and others, I'm checking the ground, and routing of the terminals for the coil. I worked several hours yesterday, and still have no fire at the coil. I included pictures of the new items that I installed. I do not have the distributor rotor clip, but have one on order. Thanks again, to all. Below are the photos.




4. Your rotor or your distributor cap, or both is incorrect - unless you left the little clip off the shaft under the rotor.
img]
[img:231c35b32d]http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/photos/mvphoto1419.jpg[/img]
 
(quoted from post at 14:46:01 08/02/17)
(quoted from post at 10:54:09 08/02/17)
I see no mention of replacing the ignition switch or even checking the continuity. They are known to be intermittent the going bad.

Yes Sir, new ignition switch (key), also. Thanks
 
(quoted from post at 21:11:45 08/01/17)
(quoted from post at 20:36:55 08/01/17)
New 3 post 12v regulator

From your picture I think that you meant to say "New 3 post 12v alternator".

4- If the rotor and cap are incorrect, I may have ordered the wrong ones. The ones I ordered also showed to be the same on the Jubilee. So, I'll check that too.

The engine in the Jubilee is the same as the engine in the 600/700 and 601/701 series, as well as the later 4 cylinder 2000 series. I think that the reason that the rotor is hitting the cap is probably due to you not knowing about the clip under the rotor and losing said clip when you swapped rotors.

No, respectively, this was a 3 post voltage regulator (12v)

This new dust cap, had a star of sort washer, in the top of the dust cover, with a felt washer below. I took the "clip" you mention out, which was majority broken. I trashed it, and installed the new dust cover. I should still have fire at the coil, regardless, right?

And thanks, everything I had read said, the side distributor engines were the same for many years of tractor production. I've owned tractors since my teens, and have never encountered an issue such as this one. Thanks!
mvphoto1439.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 16:36:47 08/01/17)
Four things:

1. A 631 was not a 12V system from the factory. It was a 6V positive ground. Has it been converted? If not any 12V component you installed is incorrect.

2. A 631 is not a 600 series. It is a 601 series.

3. Power to your coil comes from the B- (OEM configuration) terminal on the starter solenoid to the non switched side of your terminal block under the dash, then through your ignition switch to the switched side of the terminal block then to the coil. Gauges have no effect on this circuit.

4. Your rotor or your distributor cap, or both is incorrect - unless you left the little clip off the shaft under the rotor.
mvphoto1449.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 15:49:08 08/01/17) Loose wire or a poor ground or you installing to many new parts with out making sure each one did its job before moving on the the next new part. One should always trouble shoot then parts. never the other way around.
mvphoto1457.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 11:21:10 08/03/17)
mvphoto1439.jpg

You never mentioned that heavy cable with the tape on it. What's under the tape? If there's corrosion under there then it should be replaced. Also, the nut holding the connector on the end of that taped cable doesn't look like it's tightened down. All connections need to be clean, bright and tight, and all wires and cables need to be in good condition with no corrosion.
 
(quoted from post at 17:10:06 08/03/17)
(quoted from post at 11:21:10 08/03/17)
mvphoto1439.jpg

You never mentioned that heavy cable with the tape on it. What's under the tape? If there's corrosion under there then it should be replaced. Also, the nut holding the connector on the end of that taped cable doesn't look like it's tightened down. All connections need to be clean, bright and tight, and all wires and cables need to be in good condition with no corrosion.

Good eye Sean! I had the positive side of the cable on the regulator loose, checking back, each wire. The connection is good under the black tape. I am a "clean & lube all wires" nut. Grease works good, on all electrical connections, including batteries. Still can't define the lack of a ground to the coil. Thanks for your info and input.
 
(quoted from post at 14:35:30 08/02/17)
(quoted from post at 10:49:50 08/02/17) need more info for us to help.
With the nose tin not matching the fenders...what is it?
600's and 601's are wired differently.
Look for the numbers on the trans behind the starter.

Looks like a 1 wire alternator, I think I can see the plug.
When you say "3 post regulator", do you mean the solenoid?
If it is a 3 post solenoid that points to it being a 600.
(the floorboard and sediment bowl also point to a 600)

The rotor clip we are asking you about is not part of the dust cover, it is directly under the rotor on the shaft..tiny little thing....and it is missing an amazing mount of times on non-runners I buy.

Regardless of model..if jiggling wires does 'anything', do some studying and re-wire it completely. It will save you a LOT of headaches.

Yes, forgive me, it is a 3 post solenoid. It is also a one wire alternator.
I'm aware of the clip folks are mentioning. The clip was on top of the distributor shaft, through the dust cover, and into the rotor. I will obtain a new clip for it, and add it to the distributor shaft. After seeing this new dust cover, I felt (wrong) but sure, the star looking ring, would replace the clip.
If I add the clip, and according to other people that posted, double check all the grounds, I should find the problem. I will take pictures today, of the other side of the engine, so all can see what is there. Thanks! for your help.
mvphoto1469.jpg

This is a pic of the star washer in top of the dust cover, I spoke of. I thought it would replace the clip on top of the distributor.
 
back to basics on this one....
Put your test light on the ignition switch side of the coil.
Turn key on..light..lights. If it doesn't, back trace until you find out why.

Once you have power there, ....points closed, key on....open points with a screwdriver. Do they spark? If not, look for something grounded out in there, or clean the points. Your continuity test meter will be your friend here.

When you put new plug wires on, did you replace one at a time, exactly where they were?...if it ran before.
Old tractors and previous owners...ya never know how they got it set up.
(I ask, because your firing order looks like it might be right, but the wires are not in the usual positions....don't guess...static time it, then you will know it's right)
ps....Number 1 cylinder is at the radiator end/front of the engine.

mvphoto1419.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 07:59:58 08/03/17)
(quoted from post at 16:36:47 08/01/17)
Four things:

1. A 631 was not a 12V system from the factory. It was a 6V positive ground. Has it been converted? If not any 12V component you installed is incorrect.

2. A 631 is not a 600 series. It is a 601 series.

3. Power to your coil comes from the B- (OEM configuration) terminal on the starter solenoid to the non switched side of your terminal block under the dash, then through your ignition switch to the switched side of the terminal block then to the coil. Gauges have no effect on this circuit.

Thanks Larry, and others, I'm checking the ground, and routing of the terminals for the coil. I worked several hours yesterday, and still have no fire at the coil. I included pictures of the new items that I installed. I do not have the distributor rotor clip, but have one on order. Thanks again, to all. Below are the photos.




4. Your rotor or your distributor cap, or both is incorrect - unless you left the little clip off the shaft under the rotor.
img]
[img:b7e41a51b8]http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/photos/mvphoto1419.jpg[/img]




Per the image with this post :your distributor orientation is incorrect and your firing order is wrong also.
 
(quoted from post at 15:45:31 08/01/17) I have a 600 Series Ford, Namely a 631, with the Ford Red Tiger Engine. I've replaced all the electrical components on the tractor. New 3 post 12v regulator, new resistor, new 12v coil, new dist, cap, new points, new condenser, new rotor, new plug wires, new plugs. All top brands. I replaced any wires spliced together, with wire crimp style connectors. I still have no power coming to the coil. I also replaced all connectors between the points and coil, and installed new wiring and connectors. Still no fire to coil. Before I did all this, at times you could grab 3 wires that apparently came down from the dash, pull on them, and the tractor would fire up, instantly. Could a loose wire on a gauge cause this problem? The gauges were all new when I bought the tractor several years ago, plus it's always been stored indoors, since I became the owner. Any ideas??? One last thing, when I turn the engine over now, the rotor, strikes the cap and pops it a loose. I can't find the old rotor to compare. I ordered most of the parts through this site. Thanks in advance! :?: :(

Well Gents, this one has got me! I did a re-wire on the 631, added a new ground wire between the engine and transmission, and still have no fire / spark, at the coil. Everything electrical is new, and the ole thing still won't fire. Any more suggestions? Thanks
 
(quoted from post at 13:36:01 08/06/17)
(quoted from post at 15:45:31 08/01/17) I have a 600 Series Ford, Namely a 631, with the Ford Red Tiger Engine. I've replaced all the electrical components on the tractor. New 3 post 12v regulator, new resistor, new 12v coil, new dist, cap, new points, new condenser, new rotor, new plug wires, new plugs. All top brands. I replaced any wires spliced together, with wire crimp style connectors. I still have no power coming to the coil. I also replaced all connectors between the points and coil, and installed new wiring and connectors. Still no fire to coil. Before I did all this, at times you could grab 3 wires that apparently came down from the dash, pull on them, and the tractor would fire up, instantly. Could a loose wire on a gauge cause this problem? The gauges were all new when I bought the tractor several years ago, plus it's always been stored indoors, since I became the owner. Any ideas??? One last thing, when I turn the engine over now, the rotor, strikes the cap and pops it a loose. I can't find the old rotor to compare. I ordered most of the parts through this site. Thanks in advance! :?: :(

Well Gents, this one has got me! I did a re-wire on the 631, added a new ground wire between the engine and transmission, and still have no fire / spark, at the coil. Everything electrical is new, and the ole thing still won't fire. Any more suggestions? Thanks

You don't need any more suggestions than you already have. Just follow them and you will have it started and running like a top.
 

With the key on use you meter and check to see if you have power to the coil.
You keep saying no spark but you haven't answered other's question if there's any power going to the ignition side of the coil.
 
(quoted from post at 00:26:07 08/07/17)
With the key on use you meter and check to see if you have power to the coil.
You keep saying no spark but you haven't answered other's question if there's any power going to the ignition side of the coil.

No, I do not have power to the coil. I have re-wired everything, and still don't have power there. I will attack it again tomorrow. I will figure it out. Thanks for the info from each of you.
 
(quoted from post at 21:00:10 08/06/17)
No, I do not have power to the coil. I have re-wired everything, and still don't have power there. I will attack it again tomorrow. I will figure it out. Thanks for the info from each of you.

I think you've already been told this, but if you want to trace it backwards (I'm assuming original configuration electrical system here):

1. Do you have 12V power at the switched side of terminal block? If yes, wire from there to coil is open or connections are bad.

2. If no on #1, do you have 12v power to hot side of terminal block? If yes, bad ignition switch or connections..

3. If no on #2, do you have power at the hot terminal on the starter relay? If yes, bad wire or connections from solenoid hot post to hot post on terminal block.

4. If no on # 3, bad battery cable or connections.

5. If no on #4, check battery and/or ground cable and connections.

[b:e700f5b287][color=red:e700f5b287]BTW, have you corrected the firing order and made sure timing is correct?[/color:e700f5b287][/b:e700f5b287] This won't prevent power from flowing to coil, but it could prevent your engine from starting even if you get power to coil!
 

I will use a voltmeter for a quick test BUT to confirm with out a doubt BAR NONE remove the coil and wire a automotive headlight in place of the coil. A headlight will load the ignition system with points closed and with out a doubt confirm the electrical health of the complete system other than the coil and condenser.

You then can use your voltmeter readings are just go by the brightness of the headlight. You get the light blinking bright you can narrow it down rite fast...

I use a spark checker if no spark do a few simple checks if every thing checks wire the light in the light will confirm wiring, points, points plate ground. It will not confirm the coil, condenser, cap, rotor are plug wires I have narrowed it down took the confusing electrical system out of play...

Get a good healthy spark with a spark checker and go from there...
 
(quoted from post at 02:46:47 08/07/17)
(quoted from post at 21:00:10 08/06/17)
No, I do not have power to the coil. I have re-wired everything, and still don't have power there. I will attack it again tomorrow. I will figure it out. Thanks for the info from each of you.

I think you've already been told this, but if you want to trace it backwards (I'm assuming original configuration electrical system here):

1. Do you have 12V power at the switched side of terminal block? If yes, wire from there to coil is open or connections are bad.

2. If no on #1, do you have 12v power to hot side of terminal block? If yes, bad ignition switch or connections..

3. If no on #2, do you have power at the hot terminal on the starter relay? If yes, bad wire or connections from solenoid hot post to hot post on terminal block.

4. If no on # 3, bad battery cable or connections.

5. If no on #4, check battery and/or ground cable and connections.

[b:014dc61add][color=red:014dc61add]BTW, have you corrected the firing order and made sure timing is correct?[/color:014dc61add][/b:014dc61add] This won't prevent power from flowing to coil, but it could prevent your engine from starting even if you get power to coil!

Thanks Larry. Yes, the plug wire order has been corrected. I've been grabbing a straws, to get the 631 going. I'm sure it's something simple. All electrical components are new, now. Everything showed wear, broken, or improper fire. I am a stickler about things being correct. Thanks again, I will try all these suggestions.
 
(quoted from post at 11:30:04 08/07/17)
I will use a voltmeter for a quick test BUT to confirm with out a doubt BAR NONE remove the coil and wire a automotive headlight in place of the coil. A headlight will load the ignition system with points closed and with out a doubt confirm the electrical health of the complete system other than the coil and condenser.

You then can use your voltmeter readings are just go by the brightness of the headlight. You get the light blinking bright you can narrow it down rite fast...

I use a spark checker if no spark do a few simple checks if every thing checks wire the light in the light will confirm wiring, points, points plate ground. It will not confirm the coil, condenser, cap, rotor are plug wires I have narrowed it down took the confusing electrical system out of play...

Get a good healthy spark with a spark checker and go from there...

Thanks!
 

Well, Here I am on 2 weeks now, still no spark at the coil, even after a 2nd new coil (12.75v to the coil + side). Now the 631 has another wrinkle, that I can't figure out. The 12v headlights quit working. I puled everything a loose, and put the wire direct to the headlights, from the battery. There are no splices in the headlight wire, and no power at the back of the headlights (thru my meter). I'm going to try a new wire today, perhaps the old wire is broken somewhere within. Any pointers? Thanks!
 
(quoted from post at 16:47:54 08/10/17)
Well, Here I am on 2 weeks now, still no spark at the coil, even after a 2nd new coil (12.75v to the coil + side). Now the 631 has another wrinkle, that I can't figure out. The 12v headlights quit working. I puled everything a loose, and put the wire direct to the headlights, from the battery. There are no splices in the headlight wire, and no power at the back of the headlights (thru my meter). I'm going to try a new wire today, perhaps the old wire is broken somewhere within. Any pointers? Thanks!
i:b985a62107]


Evening fellow tractor friends, I figured out the problem on the 631. I started at the plugs and tracked backwards. The problem was found in the distributor. I installed new points, and they were defective. They were not grounding. I put another set of new, brand name points in it, and it runs like new. Of course, all except the engine are, brand new. Thanks for your patience and advice on this issue. That said,
Do any of you have any knowledge of a Ford Workmaster 861, with a Sherman Transmission in it? I have one found that I think, I can buy. The owner wouldn't price it... yet. It is an original paint, really nice tractor. I've never had any dealings with the 861 though. Thanks! [/i:b985a62107]
 
A real 861 could not have a Sherman Transmission. The Sherman was an auxiliary transmission that sat inside the bell housing in front of the regular transmission. They were available in a few different configurations: step-down; step-up, combo (step-up and step-down) and reverser. They were only available for the Ford tractors with a 4 speed transmission, and since the 861 has a 5 speed transmission, it could not possibly have a Sherman transmission. If it has a Sherman and is an 801 series tractor, it would have to be a 821, 831 or 841.
 
(quoted from post at 01:17:19 08/18/17) A real 861 could not have a Sherman Transmission. The Sherman was an auxiliary transmission that sat inside the bell housing in front of the regular transmission. They were available in a few different configurations: step-down; step-up, combo (step-up and step-down) and reverser. They were only available for the Ford tractors with a 4 speed transmission, and since the 861 has a 5 speed transmission, it could not possibly have a Sherman transmission. If it has a Sherman and is an 801 series tractor, it would have to be a 821, 831 or 841.

I will double check the model number. It is 100% Sherman Transmission, with a 4 speed, that much, I'm sure of. The owner said, the Sherman Trans, was rare in this tractor.? Thanks, Sean.
 

An 801 series tractor is a Powermaster, not a Workmaster. A Workmaster is a 601 series tractor.

No Ford tractors were equipped with Sherman transmissions. 3 and 4 speed tractors from the 9Ns thru the pre-65 000 series could have Sherman auxiliary transmissions added to the factory Ford transmission by the dealer or consumer. Starting with the 01 series (I think) factory installation of the Sherman auxiliary on 4 speed tractors was an option.
 
3 and 4 speed tractors from the 9Ns thru the pre-65 000 series could have Sherman auxiliary transmissions added to the factory Ford transmission by the dealer or consumer.

Larry - Although I've never seen one, according to my early 1990's copy of the parts book and the current on-line parts site, the 1965-1975 3 cylinder thousand series models that had the 4 speed transmission could also have the Sherman combo auxiliary. The title for the parts drawing is:

(07T01) - AUXILIARY TRANSMISSION, OVER & UNDER (ACCESSORY)

https://partstore.agriculture.newho...&sl=EN&currency=#epc::mr67519ar397912
 
(quoted from post at 08:03:58 08/18/17)
(quoted from post at 16:47:54 08/10/17)
Well, Here I am on 2 weeks now, still no spark at the coil, even after a 2nd new coil (12.75v to the coil + side). Now the 631 has another wrinkle, that I can't figure out. The 12v headlights quit working. I puled everything a loose, and put the wire direct to the headlights, from the battery. There are no splices in the headlight wire, and no power at the back of the headlights (thru my meter). I'm going to try a new wire today, perhaps the old wire is broken somewhere within. Any pointers? Thanks!
i:86285c6357]


Evening fellow tractor friends, I figured out the problem on the 631. I started at the plugs and tracked backwards. The problem was found in the distributor. I installed new points, and they were defective. They were not grounding. I put another set of new, brand name points in it, and it runs like new. Of course, all except the engine are, brand new. Thanks for your patience and advice on this issue. That said,
Do any of you have any knowledge of a Ford Workmaster 861, with a Sherman Transmission in it? I have one found that I think, I can buy. The owner wouldn't price it... yet. It is an original paint, really nice tractor. I've never had any dealings with the 861 though. Thanks! [/i:86285c6357]




Voltage readings confuse the issue on a circuit that's not loaded... Load the circuit then Voltage readings become valid.... Devise ways to make voltage your friend not your enemy.
 
(quoted from post at 05:05:06 08/18/17)
An 801 series tractor is a Powermaster, not a Workmaster. A Workmaster is a 601 series tractor.

No Ford tractors were equipped with Sherman transmissions. 3 and 4 speed tractors from the 9Ns thru the pre-65 000 series could have Sherman auxiliary transmissions added to the factory Ford transmission by the dealer or consumer. Starting with the 01 series (I think) factory installation of the Sherman auxiliary on 4 speed tractors was an option.

Larry, This is not an excuse, but the best one I have. Forgive me, if I get confused on some things. The tractor most likely is a Powermaster. I had a Brain Stem Stroke, 4 years ago, and it did a number on my memory. Best part about it, I survived, thanks be to the Lord. I will find out more about this tractor, and write it down, as I see it. Thank you, Sir.
 
(quoted from post at 10:59:34 08/18/17)
(quoted from post at 08:03:58 08/18/17)
(quoted from post at 16:47:54 08/10/17)
Well, Here I am on 2 weeks now, still no spark at the coil, even after a 2nd new coil (12.75v to the coil + side). Now the 631 has another wrinkle, that I can't figure out. The 12v headlights quit working. I puled everything a loose, and put the wire direct to the headlights, from the battery. There are no splices in the headlight wire, and no power at the back of the headlights (thru my meter). I'm going to try a new wire today, perhaps the old wire is broken somewhere within. Any pointers? Thanks!
i:4bd7c5e73b]

Thanks Hobo. Voltage turned into my best friend. When I got it all the way across, I was one thrilled Cowboy. I had a wire incorrect in the wiring. I corrected that, went from the plugs backwards (as suggested here) and found the defective points.

I also double checked the other mans tractor today. It is a Ford 841, with a Sherman Transmission. The tractor is real clean, runs good, no smoke, or leaks. PTO & 3 point work great, straight sheet metal, 80% tires, new high back seat, new dash instruments. Any ideas out there of what it may be worth?$
Thanks again, all.


Evening fellow tractor friends, I figured out the problem on the 631. I started at the plugs and tracked backwards. The problem was found in the distributor. I installed new points, and they were defective. They were not grounding. I put another set of new, brand name points in it, and it runs like new. Of course, all except the engine are, brand new. Thanks for your patience and advice on this issue. That said,
Do any of you have any knowledge of a Ford Workmaster 861, with a Sherman Transmission in it? I have one found that I think, I can buy. The owner wouldn't price it... yet. It is an original paint, really nice tractor. I've never had any dealings with the 861 though. Thanks! [/i:4bd7c5e73b]




Voltage readings confuse the issue on a circuit that's not loaded... Load the circuit then Voltage readings become valid.... Devise ways to make voltage your friend not your enemy.
 

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