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What type of tracor do I have?

T

thisisjakewaller

Member
Hi everyone. I just picked up an old ford tracor, and I can't find any markings anywhere that would indicate what type of tractor it is. The best I can tell, it's a 1958 Ford 850? Originally white and red, I've been buying parts for the ford 850 and they are the correct parts. The only thing that seems to be wrong is the water pump.

Secondly, I cannot seem to figure out any of the controls. Mainly, the shifting pattern, where is the throttle, what is a brake (or breaks) and what is the clutch?

Thanks so much.
 
800 series was made from 1955 to 1957. In 1958 the 801 series came out. Both used the 172 engine but the later ones used a larger carb and a few other things. Left and right brake are on the right side with 2 pedals left pedal left brake right pedal right brake. Clutch pedal is on the left side.
 
Thank you. :) I do not actually know the year, it just looks like it. Is there a way I can find this? The tractor is very rusty, so I can't see any number, but if I knew where to look then I could clean it up.

I have the whole electrical system replaced, but cannot get the engine to turn. Any thoughts? I'm sure it's just rusty in the crank case. I filled the cylinders and crank case with penitrating oil, but it won't turn. Can I turn the engine my ally to free it up?
 
On the left side under the battery you should see 2 horizontal bolt holes. Above them is a flat area and there is where the model and serial number will be. should sort of look like this
841S
^*%^*%*
I use the 841S because that is one I have.
As for it not doing any thing I can walk you threw that but if you do any thing I say be 1000% sure it is out of gear or it can/will eat you alive
Simply run a heavy wire form the non-ground side of the battery to the starter stud. If it spins over then you know the starter is good. Next you can run a hot wire from the same side of the battery to the coil the side that does not have a wire going to the distributor. Then try the heavy wire to the starter again. That will hot wire it and let you see if it will start
 

So I know the starter is working, I figured out how to hot wire it, but put a new ignition in. The starter engages but won't turn the engine at all. One solid loud clank then stops. The fan twitches, so I know the engine is trying to turn but stuck. I wanted to try turning the engine manually with a wrench on the crankshaft pully but it won't fit.
 
(quoted from post at 00:41:30 01/19/17)
So I know the starter is working, I figured out how to hot wire it, but put a new ignition in. The starter engages but won't turn the engine at all. One solid loud clank then stops. The fan twitches, so I know the engine is trying to turn but stuck. I wanted to try turning the engine manually with a wrench on the crankshaft pully but it won't fit.
Click to expand...

You say you filled the cylinders with penetrating oil and are trying to turn the engine over. Do you have all the spark plugs out? Pull all the spark plugs out if they are in place. With the lugs in place the engine will be hydrolocked and will not turn over. If you have the plugs out and cannot turn it over, then the piston rings may be stuck to the cylinder walls.
 

Be gentle and patient. jack one rear wheel up. put it in a high gear and every day or two try rocking the wheel back and forth.
 
(quoted from post at 15:06:12 01/19/17)
Be gentle and patient. jack one rear wheel up. put it in a high gear and every day or two try rocking the wheel back and forth.
Click to expand...

I'd like to try this. Any ideas how the shifting pattern works? I can vaguely see it says:

432
51R

The gear shift rotates around a pivot, so I'm not sure how that translates. I could only find 4 gears.
 
The shifter pivots side to side and
slides up and down. All the way down
it will be in neutral, 4th or 5th. Put
it in neutral and it should kinda
spring up to the top for reverse,
neutral, and second. Then half way up
it'll be 3rd neutral and first. Not
the greatest explanation but hope it
helps.
 
(quoted from post at 16:39:50 01/19/17) post us a picture of the trans.

is it an up/down with 3 gates?

the throttle is on the dash.
Click to expand...

So this is the gear shift. (I presume). As far as I can tell there is not side to side or up and down. It rotates around in a clockwise counterclockwise fashion. So towards the steering wheel all the way should be what? And then rotation back towards the seat each gear should be what? And like I said I can only find four spots
 
Does it look like this? Grabbed the
pic from tractordata. It should go
straight up and down if so.
a149065.jpg
 
Looks to me like the shifter is all the
way up. So towards the seat should be
reverse, middle neutral, and towards
starring 2nd gear. Not sure how there
are 4 positions? Put it in the middle
and you *should* be able to push it up
and down.
 

Oh I see, the gear shift goes up towards the sky, down towards the ground. So when it's up the gears would be

Steering column
4
2
3
Seat

And when it's down it's:


Steering column
5
1
R
Seat

Like so?

Is the fourth gear I'm feeling just neutral?
 
(quoted from post at 17:12:12 01/19/17) Looks to me like the shifter is all the
way up. So towards the seat should be
reverse, middle neutral, and towards
starring 2nd gear. Not sure how there
are 4 positions? Put it in the middle
and you *should* be able to push it up
and down.
Click to expand...

Hold on I think this is it. Is this correct?

"Push the shifter all the way down and pull to you 5th
Push the shifter all the way down and push away from you 4th
Push the shifter half way down and pull to you 1st
Push the shifter half way down and push away from you 2nd
Shifter all the way up and pull to you reverse
Shifter all the way up and push away from you 3rd
Middle is always neautral"
 
Yep that's correct. The lever on the dash is the throttle. Toward the seat for more throttle, push away from the seat for lower throttle. Choke should be down by the
starter button behind the shifter.
 

That the correct way it shifts.
Now jack one of the rear tires off the ground, shift to neutral and see if the tire will roll (brakes not dragging). If tires rolls ok shift trans into 5th gear, remove all spark plugs and rock the rear tire back and forth.
It's said that acetone and atf make the best penetrate, dad always used kerosene to free up a stuck engine.
 

Awesome, now I just put five new quarts of oil in there, should I drain the oil, put the acetone in, then put the oil back in? And do I put it in the cylinders or the crank case?

Thanks so much guys :)
 
Pull the spark plugs and put a couple of tablespoons of 50/50 acetone/atf mixture into each cylinder. Easiest way is to use a turkey baster. Put the spark plugs back in while it sits so nothing else gets in there, but pull the plugs each time you try to get the engine to turn. Stick your finger in each spark plug hole each time you pull the plugs to see if the liquid is still there, and if it isn't add some more. Pull the plugs and try to turn the engine a couple of times a day. May take a couple of days before you get any movement, longest I know of to where it freed things up was a week. No one I know of has had the patience to wait any longer and ended up tearing the engine down.
 

This is all a bit confusing to say the least. (except for the photo tracto man shared)

Top gate from steering to seat 3 N R
Mid gate same deal 2 N 1
Bottom gate same deal 4 N 5
 
Judging by the dash, it looks to be an 850 or 860.
Both had the 5 speed, 860 had live PTO via a two stage clutch.
Clutch pedal would probably tell us which it is.
Model and serial number would be on a flat spot on the trans.
Right above the two threaded holes just aft of the starter.
 
The water pump may be wrong because in 1971 Ford started selling a different water pump and to install you had to also buy a new spacer w/ 4
long bolts, pulley and 4 blade fan to convert. Aftermarket companies continued to sell the old style water pump that used a press on pulley
and 3 blade fan. Both are still made aftermarket, you just need to determine which one you need.
 
"So it's an 800 and not an 850?
Also, how can I know the year?"

800 is the series; 850 is the model.
Serial number 71442 makes it a 1955.

Check out John Smith's excellent website [b:ecdaae22e3]here.[/b:ecdaae22e3]
 
You're welcome, glad to help.
John also has good used parts for sale if you need them.
There's a lot to explore on his site!
 
(quoted from post at 20:13:06 01/19/17) Pull the spark plugs and put a couple of tablespoons of 50/50 acetone/atf mixture into each cylinder. Easiest way is to use a turkey baster. Put the spark plugs back in while it sits so nothing else gets in there, but pull the plugs each time you try to get the engine to turn. Stick your finger in each spark plug hole each time you pull the plugs to see if the liquid is still there, and if it isn't add some more. Pull the plugs and try to turn the engine a couple of times a day. May take a couple of days before you get any movement, longest I know of to where it freed things up was a week. No one I know of has had the patience to wait any longer and ended up tearing the engine down.
Click to expand...

Alright, so I did all this for almost a week, then I broke down and tried to push start it, figuring that when I dropped the clutch it would turn the engine. I started really slow and worked my way up, but no improvement. We dragged that thing all around with the clutch in and out with no results. So I gave up today and pulled the head off. The cylinders were completely full of acetone/atf fluid, so nothing was draining out. Now that I have the head off I tried putting it in gear and turning the tire, and with a lot of force they will both spin in opposite directions, but the pistons do not move. What should I do now?
 
(quoted from post at 19:32:45 01/28/17)
(quoted from post at 20:13:06 01/19/17) Pull the spark plugs and put a couple of tablespoons of 50/50 acetone/atf mixture into each cylinder. Easiest way is to use a turkey baster. Put the spark plugs back in while it sits so nothing else gets in there, but pull the plugs each time you try to get the engine to turn. Stick your finger in each spark plug hole each time you pull the plugs to see if the liquid is still there, and if it isn't add some more. Pull the plugs and try to turn the engine a couple of times a day. May take a couple of days before you get any movement, longest I know of to where it freed things up was a week. No one I know of has had the patience to wait any longer and ended up tearing the engine down.
Click to expand...

Alright, so I did all this for almost a week, then I broke down and tried to push start it, figuring that when I dropped the clutch it would turn the engine. I started really slow and worked my way up, but no improvement. We dragged that thing all around with the clutch in and out with no results. So I gave up today and pulled the head off. The cylinders were completely full of acetone/atf fluid, so nothing was draining out. Now that I have the head off I tried putting it in gear and turning the tire, and with a lot of force they will both spin in opposite directions, but the pistons do not move. What should I do now?
Click to expand...

Well, I recommended that you be gentle, but. Turning in opposite directions means that at least your differential is working OK. You may have pulled the center out of your clutch dragging it. You will have to split the tractor to repair the clutch, but before you do get under the tractor and look for a hole with a cotter pin in it in the bottom of the bell housing, approx. straight under the hub of the steering wheel.
 
(quoted from post at 04:06:18 01/29/17)
(quoted from post at 19:32:45 01/28/17)
(quoted from post at 20:13:06 01/19/17) Pull the spark plugs and put a couple of tablespoons of 50/50 acetone/atf mixture into each cylinder. Easiest way is to use a turkey baster. Put the spark plugs back in while it sits so nothing else gets in there, but pull the plugs each time you try to get the engine to turn. Stick your finger in each spark plug hole each time you pull the plugs to see if the liquid is still there, and if it isn't add some more. Pull the plugs and try to turn the engine a couple of times a day. May take a couple of days before you get any movement, longest I know of to where it freed things up was a week. No one I know of has had the patience to wait any longer and ended up tearing the engine down.
Click to expand...

Well, I recommended that you be gentle, but. Turning in opposite directions means that at least your differential is working OK. You may have pulled the center out of your clutch dragging it. You will have to split the tractor to repair the clutch, but before you do get under the tractor and look for a hole with a cotter pin in it in the bottom of the bell housing, approx. straight under the hub of the steering wheel.
Click to expand...

I'm ready to open the tranny if it's necessary, but I still think the engine is seized, and I want to get the engine moving before I take on another project. I threw a 15/16ths wrench on the crank shaft bolt and gave it a good yank but no movement. Is this a good way to try to move the engine? What else can I do to get it unstuck? I have the head off now, as was recommended, but now what? Can I get into the crank case? Do I do something with the pistons? Is it possible to sheer off the crank shaft bolt or can I throw a 3 foot pipe on it and get some leverage?
Click to expand...
 
(quoted from post at 22:29:41 01/28/17)
(quoted from post at 04:06:18 01/29/17)
(quoted from post at 19:32:45 01/28/17)
(quoted from post at 20:13:06 01/19/17) Pull the spark plugs and put a couple of tablespoons of 50/50 acetone/atf mixture into each cylinder. Easiest way is to use a turkey baster. Put the spark plugs back in while it sits so nothing else gets in there, but pull the plugs each time you try to get the engine to turn. Stick your finger in each spark plug hole each time you pull the plugs to see if the liquid is still there, and if it isn't add some more. Pull the plugs and try to turn the engine a couple of times a day. May take a couple of days before you get any movement, longest I know of to where it freed things up was a week. No one I know of has had the patience to wait any longer and ended up tearing the engine down.
Click to expand...

Well, I recommended that you be gentle, but. Turning in opposite directions means that at least your differential is working OK. You may have pulled the center out of your clutch dragging it. You will have to split the tractor to repair the clutch, but before you do get under the tractor and look for a hole with a cotter pin in it in the bottom of the bell housing, approx. straight under the hub of the steering wheel.
Click to expand...

I'm ready to open the tranny if it's necessary, but I still think the engine is seized, and I want to get the engine moving before I take on another project. I threw a 15/16ths wrench on the crank shaft bolt and gave it a good yank but no movement. Is this a good way to try to move the engine? What else can I do to get it unstuck? I have the head off now, as was recommended, but now what? Can I get into the crank case? Do I do something with the pistons? Is it possible to sheer off the crank shaft bolt or can I throw a 3 foot pipe on it and get some leverage?
Click to expand...

No need to open the tranny. It is not likely that you would be able to cause a problem with the clutch with a bad tranny. It takes time to do it without doing more damage. If you really cannot wait, get your BFH and a four inch diam. block of hardwood, and just beat on the tops of the pistons, until it breaks loose or you break something else. Remove the oil pan, determine which piston wants to go up as you are trying to beat one down, and put a jack under the rod for some help.
Click to expand...
 
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