1974 ford 4000 pto shift problems

I have just bought a 1974 Ford 4000 gas tractor. It was owned by a older man he said he always had to cut the tractor off before being able to engage the PTO. It is a dual range 8x2 with a hand break on the left side.
Every thing works perfectly with shifting and the clutch he bought it in 1980 and said it has always been that way.

I'm going to look it over tomorrow I got it home after dark tonight and plan on asking a buddy to compare it to his 3910 but the hand brake ( he called it a parking break) will not stay engaged when you pull the handle up but the rear breaks pedal and parking ( right side on the foot plate) work .

Model D1123C
Transmission 4C08C
Rear axle 4A12B


I saw the left side break could be removed any thoughts?

Are you certain your model numbers are
correct?
D1123C tells us it must be a 4110 LCG
tractor with live pto.
Does it have the wishbone style front end
and steering?
A 4110 is quite different than a standard
4000 and derivatives.
Also, did he mean you have to shut off the
tractor to hook up an implement to the pto
because it was spinning all the time?
Answer those questions and we can help you
better. Or post a photo of it.

Well, assuming it's a 4000 LCG then it will basically be a 3000 with a 4000 engine.... so assuming it has live PTO... you likely have a stuck
PTO clutch. The first thing to check is that you have proper free travel and indeed proper travel of the clutch pedal... but if that all
checks out, then you're looking at a split to free the PTO clutch disc from the pressure plate.

Rod

The PTO is not running all the time but to engage it I have to cut off the engine engage the lever then start note when restarting after engaging the PTO it is running even with the clutch pushed in. I was told it was originally set up to mow for the city park department.

Pictures

pto clutch is stuck or out of adjustment.
Pedal looks low for a two stage clutch, clevis pin may be in the wrong hole.

As Rod says, your tractor is essentially a
3000 wirh a bigger than standard engine.
So when buying parts for it order them for a
3000 not a 4000. And no one will even know
what a 4110 is so don't even bother.
Your tractor supplies power to the pto by
means of a dual clutch. One clutch disc
provides power to the wheels while the
second clutch disc provides power to the
pto.
When you push the clutch pedal half way down
the tires should stop turning. Push it all
the way down and the pto will stop.
I had a similar tractor to yours that the
pto started to slip. So I adjusted the
pedal. After that I had to shut the tractor
off to engage the pto lever. But soon after
the pto started to slip again and I had to
split the tractor to put in a new one.
Nothin much can be done to the clutch
without splitting the tractor.
They sell those double clutch kits here at
YT. They're $400 or thereabouts.

Destroked, they used that double clevis only
on the early models. Later ones did not have
it.
Not sure when the change occurred - I doubt
it lasted past the tin change in early 68.
Ford also did away with the internal pedal
return spring and went to the external one
mounted on the left side of the
transmission. And they did away with the
adjustable upper pedal limit.
I suspect the 3 changes - clevis, spring and
limiter - occured simultaneously but can not
say that with authority.
I wish Photobucket wasn't so screwed up
lately as I have photos of the differences
there.

I believe your tractor has independent PTO because it has the square 4000 rear axel. A 3000 would have the two stage clutch for live PTO with a round rear axel.
There really is no clutch in the independent PTO system. You need to slow engine to idle and sort of work or feather the PTO lever to engage and the bring the engine up to PTO
speed. You should be able to disengage PTO at any speed.
You may need manuals for both 3000 and 4000 to understand what you have - engine and front 3000 / rear 4000.
I hope this helps you. I have both a 3000 and a 4000SU.

Has lots of hours or clutch rider for as smooth as pedal is. As trans disc wears it throws pto links out of adjustment as both clutches work off same fingers.

Nooooooo. Not trying to pick... but be very careful of clutches and 4110's. There could be differences there in the clutches between this and a 3000. One will need to pay very careful attention to the parts book but the 4110 will likely be listed separately among the 15 options... There could be differences not only for model but production date. Enough to give a bad burn too...

Rod

No, it very clearly has the single reduction axle with drum brakes... No wet PTO clutch in there; just the dry one on the flywheel.

Rod

You might try taking it to a shop that has a dyno and push the clutch down while under a load.

You have your tractors backward.
4000 series have the larger round trumpets for the planetary units and wet brakes.
2-3000 series have the smaller short trumpets like in the pic.
According to Tractor Data and parts search a 4110 LCG (low center of gravity) is a 2-3000 series tractor with the larger 4000 engine that uses shorter front spindles and smaller rear wheels to lower the height of the tractor. Live pro models use the same double clutch as 2-3000 ag models.
Many highway depts used this model with side mount mowers for mowing road sides back in the day.

I believe your tractor has independent PTO because it has the square 4000 rear axel.

Click to expand...

Square vs. round axle housing has nothing to do with it. Most 3 cylinder 2000's and very early 3000's had a round axle trumpet, and most 3000's and I believe some late 2000's had the square profile, but they all had outboard drum brakes and single reduction rear ends, and never had independent PTO except for the ones with the S-O-S transmissions.

The regular 4000 that had independent PTO with the manual transmissions had the double reduction rear end and inboard wet brakes, and the axle housing was not truly trumpet shaped, it stayed at the wide diameter for about the first 12 inches nearest the center housing.

Thank you everyone I'm going to look over the clutch and
probably plan to replace it.
What does the brake on the left side do? he called it a aux
brake I saw it listed as being on a lot of European tractors
and something coming in the states. Also read where it could
be removed is there a need for it. My buddy's 3910 does not
have it.

The brake on the left side is called a transmission hand brake. It locks the output of the transmission rather than the actual brakes out at the wheels. It was standard on tractors sold into a lot of European countries where it was required, and was an option in other countries like here in the US.

I can't tell you too much about that brake.
Have heard they are a very effective auxiliary/parking brake though.
They are a disc brake setup. I had one on a Brit 4000 once but it was badly worn out and parts were cost prohibitive to replace. They have an oil seal where they enter the rear end and mine was allowing water to enter. So I just removed it and covered the hole with a standard 6" round plate with 4 bolt holes from a junk tractor.
It's been a few years ago but IIRC, you remove the outer cover then can access the 4 bolts that attach it to the tractor. Then it just pulls out. Very simple.
They operate off a small right angle gear on the pinion shaft inside the rear end. My impression of it was it was a well engineered little unit. I would try to save one if it wasn't too far gone.
I think new discs for the brake aren't too expensive.

I have been running the tractor hard grading driveways I
different gear and Rpms hoping the clutch would brake loose
no luck. I talked to the old owner today he said it has never
been adjusted since he had it. It was bought new by his
brother then he bought it only used to finish mowing and drive
way grading. He said since he had it The PTO would only shift
in to gear with the tractor off and when you crank it the mower
would turn also.It has 2640 original hours.
Should I plan to split her or get a try to adjust it some what
could be the worst thing adjusting would do?