3000 hydraulic annoyance

Royse

Well-known Member
I have this set up with the front blade lifting and lowering from
an original dual remote valve under the seat. The other pair
of hoses is ran out the back and currently not connected to anything.
Picture of the valve is before I hooked up the front blade hoses.

When I lower the front blade using the remote valve, the back
blade on the 3pt hitch instantly drops to the ground.
Front blade can still be in the air, simply letting it down.
As soon as I let off the remote handle the 3p hitch picks itself
back up. Quickly enough that it bounces the tractor.

Raising the front blade does NOT cause any change in the 3pt.
Dead heading the other set of lines doesn't affect it either but
I haven't tried hooking them up to an implement yet.

Obviously this shouldn't happen at all, but why would it happen
in one direction only? That isn't making sense to me.
Hydraulic fluid is new and at the correct level.

43307.jpg


43308.jpg
 
Hi Mr. Royse,
I am not sure of the utility of my reply, may just be more to think about..... That stated, I have been looking to add at least a single spool aux valve to
my 73 4000 and have been wondering, if it replaces the selector valve that selects 3 point, both 3 pt and aux, or just aux, then do you loose the ability to
select and it seems to me that you do, at least in part. When you lower the front blade, it must open the circuit draining off pressure to the 3 point and
then when closed, it immediately puts the pressure back. If that is what happens, the other option would be to keep the selector valve and tap off of it to a
remote mounted spool valve. Again, I am working to figure this out myself and the best over-all option, so I may not of been any help what so ever.....
Perhaps someone that knows this stuff well will chime in.

Good luck sir,
George
 

Looking at the pic it looks like the levers are real close to the draft control lever. when pushing forward on the hyd lever is it hitting and pushing the draft control lever enough to cause the lift to drop.
On my 4000 apparently the hyd valve lever was doing the same thing as someone had cut the draft control lever leaving a short nub just below the hyd valve lever that can to worked with a boxed end wrench.
The hyd valve you have is like mine, these where designed for the older pre 65 tractors that had the draft control lever mounted lower on the diff housing.
Later model hyd valves like I have on my 4000SU have levers designed not that to hit the draft control lever.

A simple way to test is move the draft control lever down to draft, then operate the hyd valve and see if the lift stays up, most times if you move the draft control lever with a implement raised the lift will drop then raise back up, it's not as noticeable with empty lift arms.
 
" When you lower the front blade, it must open the circuit draining off pressure to the 3 point and
then when closed, it immediately puts the pressure back." It is all in the plumbing....internal in this case. While your 'selector' simply tapped into the 3 point cylinder input/output circuit & diverted it, these remote hyd control valves typically (probably always) tap into the pump output.Unless you try to operate both simultaneously, they function independently.
 
"is it hitting and pushing the draft control lever"

You know, I didn't feel it hitting, but to be honest I'm not looking
down there when I'm operating it. I'll check that and see.
 
Thanks George, you'll like the remote hydraulics once added.
This is the third tractor I've had this particular valve on.
I swap it to the current work tractor and keep going.
It hasn't affected the 3 pt until now so I must be doing
something wrong this time.
 
Independent is good to know. In Royse's case, with the valve assembly looking to be for a pre 65 tractor, would the ports be wrong or an internal malfunction
that looks to be integrating the return side?

George
 
(quoted from post at 12:12:44 12/18/16) Independent is good to know. In Royse's case, with the valve assembly looking to be for a pre 65 tractor, would the ports be wrong or an internal malfunction
that looks to be integrating the return side?

George

The plumbing at the blocking plate where you install the remote valves is the same for the '65-'75 tractors as it is for the '55-'65 tractors and the remote valves are interchangeable, except for the external considerations like the remote valve control handles interfering with the draft control handle.
 
Well Mr. Royse, looks like you may be on yer own a bit. But, your thread did help me..... sorry : )George
 
"But, your thread did help me"

Wonderful! It may have helped us both. Call it a two-fer. :)
 
I agree, Destroked. They will do that.

I have the identical valve on my 64, 4 cylinder 4000, and have no such issues.

Dean
 
(quoted from post at 06:49:39 12/18/16) Hi Mr. Royse,
I am not sure of the utility of my reply, may just be more to think about..... That stated, I have been looking to add at least a single spool aux valve to
my 73 4000 and have been wondering, if it replaces the selector valve that selects 3 point, both 3 pt and aux, or just aux, then do you loose the ability to
select and it seems to me that you do, at least in part. When you lower the front blade, it must open the circuit draining off pressure to the 3 point and
then when closed, it immediately puts the pressure back. If that is what happens, the other option would be to keep the selector valve and tap off of it to a
remote mounted spool valve. Again, I am working to figure this out myself and the best over-all option, so I may not of been any help what so ever.....
Perhaps someone that knows this stuff well will chime in.

Good luck sir,
George


A remote valve is a great add on to any tractor, I have six tractors (881, 4000, 4000SU, 4500, 5000, 6610) with five having remote valves and I have late model double remote valve on the way that I found on ebay for $250, that's a sweet deal for a factory valve.
Being able to operate remote cylinders on mowers, trailed brush hogs, wheel disc, log splitters and many other implements is very handy.

With a remote valve mounted hyd oil goes through the valve first then to the 3 pt lift, The lift control and remote are independent of each other but share the same oil, there forth the remote can not make the lift raise or lower and the lift can not cause a remote valve function.
Operating the remote while raising the lift will cause the lift to stop or slow down temporarily.
Only thing I've see that will cause the lift to drop is internal leak or linkage adjustment which you notice with the engine shut off, or moving the draft control lever enough to shift the internal linkage.
But then I haven't seen it all, probably never will.
 
Destroked 450 you were correct. I'm using the #2 lever and it
does indeed hit the draft selector lever. The #1 lever does not hit.

I may swap the hoses around and use the other ports for now.
Then I'll figure out how I want to fix it. Maybe heat and straighten
the draft select lever a little bit so it doesn't hit. I don't want to
cut it off.

I wasn't overly pleased to see this when I went out to check it
either. Brand new tires. Still have the paper tags on them.
Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug.

43335.jpg
 
Sure makes a quirky hyd fall down lower on the hierarchical pyramid doesn't it? :(
I hate flat tires! Especially tractor rears!
 
(quoted from post at 19:31:45 12/18/16) Sure makes a quirky hyd fall down lower on the hierarchical pyramid doesn't it? :(
I hate flat tires! Especially tractor rears!
Yes it does. Not to mention all those weights to remove.
I soaped the whole tire and valve stem/core.
Couldn't find a leak, but it is still losing pressure.
It does have a tube in it, so not a bead seating issue.
For tonight I changed out the valve stem hoping that is it.
Aired it up, recorded the pressure and set it back on the ground
with the floor jack about an inch below so it can't crush the side
wall if it goes flat again. If it does, I'll take it off and to the tire shop.
Current temperature 13F, windchill of 3F. Awesome timing. :roll:
 

other thought... is it set to go into float mode by the adjustment on the rear of the control valves... some remotes have detent and float settings that can be turned on or off?????? And its usually the long lever that had float.. iirc.... but then again, i get to meet new people everyday.

float will do weird things in some cases to the system...

but the draft lever is probably the true cause..
 

Thought that was it, I learned about moving the draft lever one day when I went to flip it down and almost dropped the grader box on my brothers toes.

Rear flats are a pain, two years ago I had both rear tires on the 6610 go flat twice while baling first cutting, over $250 repair charge each time the tire truck came out.
Any more no matter what tire I'm running it gets heavy duty radial tubes, standard bias tubes are junk anymore, we've had two split open at the seam within a month after being installed and the smallest grain of dirt will eat a hole in a bias tube in no time.
I've got two that need fixed, a spare 16.9x30 that needs to come off so I can clean and paint the rim, then put a new tube in and a 18.4x26 that as a broken stem with about two threads holding the valve in so it also needs a new tube.
 

I was looking at Messick's site and it showed your valve was used until 1970 but had different handles that curved around the draft lever, don't know if their still available or at what cost. There is a good pic you could reference if you wanted to try heating and bending the ones you have.
 

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