advice requested

moran

Member
I have an NAA with a Wagner WM4 loader at the front and a Woods Mower currently mounted on the rear. I have about 20 acres of weeded fields to mow and am dealing with an overheating problem I believe is caused by a leaking radiator. I tried Bars Leaks pellets which requires running the engine for half to three-quarters of an hour. During that period, although there was minor leaking, the temp. gauge never got out of the green zone, even after an hour of running in place and at idle. However, when I went to mow it wasn't long before it overheated and started losing substantial amounts of coolant. Normally, I'd remove the radiator for repair or replacement but with the loader cross-member just above the hood, I'm prevented from raising the sheet metal more than an inch or two (I can only open the hood opening just enough to add fuel). Removing the loader is probably going to call for dealing with rusty bolts and with snow coming soon I'm hoping to find some way to run the mower long enough to at least do the field edges. If I were to try Alumaseal or some more modern stop-leak product I guess I'd have to flush out the Bars Leaks as there's probably a compatibility problem. Has anyone been able to remove the radiator with that loader in place ? Of course the leak could be a head gasket, water pump, slipping belt or thermostat problem. But the thermostat is new and it seems that it only leaks when under load. It didn't overheat and the thermostat held the temperature when it only idled during Bars Leaks installation. I'm thinking of trying to mow with the radiator cap loosened to lower pressurization. All in all I'm looking for advice on a strategy to follow to get some mowing done before I pull the loader and the radiator.
 
Do you have a leak???? If not adding sealant will only plug the radiator more and make it overheat worse. Are you getting compression gasses into the radiator? Are you losing coolant or only when it boils over? Is fan belt tight and not worn? Fan shroud intact? Is radiator core clean of chaf and dirt?
 
Have you checked the front of the radiator, is it covered with grass and weed seed,

Wash radiator out from the fan side be sure it's clean first, my friend ruined the motor in his Ferguson by letting weed and grass debris build up in front of the radiator, front hood grill was clean, but not the radiator
At least you are looking at the temp gauge and apparently it is working

Coolant should be 50/50 mixture for best heat transfer
All the things others have said fan belt tight, fan shroud in place
One guy had a tractor that the water pump shaft came loose from the pump impeller so no water was moving inside the coolant system, when your tractor is at operating temp can you see water movement inside the radiator?

I keep the cap loose on my radiator, keeps the pressure from building up and blowing coolant out, might try that

Need to get it fixed before you ruin your motor as my friend did, cost more to rebuild motor than the old tractor was worth, but it had been in the family since new so they fixed it,
Fixing a bad radiator or water pump is no cost compared to rebuilding a motor,
((((((Hire the weeds cut)))))
Remember,
Fastest way to ruin a good motor, let it run out of oil,
Second fastest way to ruin a motor, let it get hot
 
I've just gone and tightened the alternator/water pump belt. There's another oddity you should know about what happens when you mount a Wagner WM4 on the NAA. The drive hub required for the pump comes so close to the frame member that you can't get a new belt to pass by. Therefore I've had to use one of those segmented belts that despite careful measurements of the old tattered belt has required me to remove a segment twice to tighten it. It's no fun. If that weren't enough, though there's room on the alternator bracket slot, the alternator's large diameter bumps into the block when you loosen it to fit the belt over the pulley sheave. I had an indication that tightening accomplished something when I noticed the voltmeter showed around 14 volts when started where it was barely above 12 until itd run for a while. One last variable is the six bladed reverse fan I use to keep the seeds from plugging the radiator when I mow the weeded fields. Despite my tightening of the belt I can still rotate the fan by hand which concerns me. So the tale continues. I'll update the struggle if there's changes for anyone still interested.
 
Thanks. I should've mentioned that I hosed out the weeds from the radiator this morning as I was surprised to see the buildup given my reverse flow fan. It was because I had to repeatedly hose out the radiator that I installed the reverse six blade. Coolant is 50/50. I may do a little mowing this afternoon with the cap loosened.
 
So instead of sucking seeds and debris into the front of the radiator, now you are blowing them into the rear of the radiator with the reverse flow fan. If you can easily turn the fan, the belt is too loose. Nobody has mentioned the fan shroud. Do you have one? If not, the efficiency of the fan, especially a reverse fan, is crippled. How about the coolant flow characteristics of the radiator itself? Is the core clean internally, or are the tubes partially plugged?
 
Thanks for your suggestions. My experience is that the reverse flow fan keeps the seeds from entering the radiator whereas the regular fan drew them into the fins where they eventually clogged. Yes, the belt is to loose so I'll have to either remove another segment from the belt or modify the bracket. Yes I have the shroud installed. Expect the core is somewhat "restricted" and may try flushing.
 
Does your radiator have the proper flat-fin industrial core?

Such radiator cores are designed to allow most debris to pass through without clogging the core. Attempting to bush hog anything but short, clean, green grass with an aftermarket radiator having an automotive type core is an exercise in futility, reverse flow fan or otherwise.

That said, the fan belt must be suitable to drive the fan and water pump regardless of the FEL pump drive. Removing the stinger so as to install a proper belt is not a big job.

Loosening the radiator cap will be counter-productive as lowering the pressure lowers the boiling point correspondingly.

Dean
 
I believe the radiator is original but mowing in late fall and sucking in those week seeds and stuff used to end up with big wads of flops blocking airflow through the core. The reverse flow fan seemed to avoid this. Not sure what you mean by "removing the stinger" but I couldn't see how to get enough space to slip a proper belt by. Of course I should have recalled that lowering pressure will allow the coolant to boil at 212. Thanks for your advice.
 
Once the stinger (pump drive shaft) has been removed you can gain the necessary clearance to install a proper belt (if necessary) by jacking up the front of the tractor, removing the radius rod caps, loosening (do not remove) the 4 bolts attaching the front bolster to the engine and moving the bolster about 3/8" from the engine.

That said, my money is on an aftermarket radiator or core.

Dean
 
Thanks for the specifics on getting enough space to slip a proper belt on. Come spring my money as well will be on a new radiator, fuel tank, etc. when I remove the loader completely. I've learned two new part names from you. First the stinger and now the bolster. Thanks -
 
I'm thinking of trying your method of making room for a proper belt. One question, what should I use as the jacking point? Thanks -
 
Moran,

Those segmented belts have about half the power transmission capabilities than a properly fitting and tightened belt. They get you by until you get to the shop or the night shift comes on.
 
Only reason I used a segmented belt was that with the loader pump mounted the frame bolster together with the pump hub blocked slipping on a regular belt. On the advice of another person on this forum I've learned how to get the additional 3/8" I need to mount a normal belt. I've also found after removing a couple of segments to tighten the belt that I can still turn the fan by hand. I guess that's evidence of the loss of power transmission capability. Thanks for yourdomment.
 

We sell tractor parts! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today.

Back
Top