Ford 5000 Industrial not moving? Where do i start?

Hi folks.
I'm a newbie and look forward to following a number of topics which I see and am interested in on this Forum.

Anyway, I have just done the king pins and front axle pivot pins and bushes on this old 5000 Industrial but now the old girl won't move and inch!

It engine started ok.

Its front bucket will only lift when the crowd ram is fully extended & I understand that it will be a separate problem.

But to move the running tractor it doesn't make any difference if I put the lever in forward or reverse, it wont move even an inch!

It tractor was moved around the yard after the front axle work was completed but for some reason now, its a no go.

What could the problem be?
It doesn't leak Hyd oil from anywhere (that i can see) and hasn't been a prob for the last 10 years.

I haven't changed the hyd filters for a while so I guess that the 1st place to look but if someone can offer other suggestions, that would be really appreciated.

Does anyone know of a Link to a Workshop manual on the Net for these machines?
I've never needed one before now but i gets the feelin' that thats gonna be needed with this prob. I've been pretty damb hopeless with hydraulics in the past but I tinks that now is the time when I need to learn some thing about them.

Cheers

What transmission do you have? By chance is
it a Select O Speed?
You don't usually hear people speak in terms
of a 5000 industrial. So I'm not sure what
you have. Does it have a 4 cylinder engine
or is it a 3 cyl.
Welcome to the Ford board. If you're willing
to answer questions someone here will likely
know your tractor and be able to help you.

"5000 Industrial" would most likely be a 5500 or 5550, both of which show in the parts site as having the torque converter power reversing transmission as the only transmission choice available. That trans has a mechanically controlled reverser valve controlled by the F-N-R lever.

Check the mechanical linkage from the lever to the transmission first.

Then get a service manual and follow the procedures in there for testing the hydraulic pressure.

Sorry I can't help with finding an electronic copy on-line, that's probably why the hard copies are still pretty expensive. Here's a guy on ebay who is selling a complete set of service manuals for the 1965-1975 Ford tractors for a fairly reasonable price, including the two part main service manual that covers all of the ag tractors and the things that your Industrial model has in common with them like the engine, and a separate manual just for the Utility and Industrial models (3400, 35000, 3550, 4400, 4500, 5500 and 5550):

[u:ab9073bfc1]Ford Service Manual set on ebay[/u:ab9073bfc1]

Thanks UltraDog,
Im feeling fortunate in getting a response to me query SO SOON !
Many thanks for your interest.

The Ford model as per the writing/Decal on the Bonnet is that its a 5000. I haven't heard of the On the RH side of the Bell housing, it has E1017C #8
On the LH side it has 0C25B which means (after ding research somewhere on line, that its a 1970 model.
Its a pommy (UK) made tractor.
Personally, I have not heard of the term "Selector Speed" on a Ford. I have a David Brown also and that one is a 990 Selectamatic but as for the Fords, I'm most definitely not up with the play on models.
It has a torque converter trans' with a lever up by the steering wheel for forward and reverse. It has no PTO pr rear hydraulics, which is a bugger hence the David Brown is also kept.
I'll try to up load some photos with this.
Cheers

Good morning 'Sean in PA'
You mentioned to 5500 & 5550 models. Not being up with the play of Fords, Im scratching the noggin here. This is an English tractor. Would those models you wrote of be US models?
I have just answered a previous answer and tried to download some photos but it didn't work out. I'll try again here.
These UK built 5000 machines were VERY popular over here.
The model on the Bell Housing says that it is a E1017C #8 built in 1970

Yes it does have a torque converter and fed/rev lever.
I have checked the Fwd & Rev lever & linkages and although a tad tired and worn, seem to be moving the last selector lever outside the box ok.

I tinks me needs to find that book you wrote of.
I'll go look it up and see how bad the sting is. I'd have thought that for the age & the popularity of these 5000's that some nice bloke has scanned it to a web page for imbeciles like me to plunder.
Thanks for such a prompt reply and taking an interest in my predicament. Its much appreciated.
Cheers

PS, How the blazers do you upload photos on this site?????!!!!!
Is it from the Advanced Posting Box or the box below that called "Upload Photos/Videos" box.
The guys that try to write "user friendly" web sites need to ask a dumb fella like me, if its gonna be successful or not.

E1017C is the model number... E101 is a 5000 utility
diesel.... but the 7C falls into one of the gaps in my
information.
If you're new to this site, you have to have a certain
number of posts before uou can post pictures. An
anti-spam measure.

E1017C, as Fordfarmer has said, is a regular ag chassis 5000 with a diesel engine, not an Industrial model. The 5500 was the first Industrial model of the 5000 series ans the model number for that would start with E50, not E10. The 5550 was the replacement for the 5500 partway through the 5000 series production run, and the model numebr for that one would start with E55.

The 7 in the 5th position of model number indicates an independent 540 RPM PTO, and the C at the end says tyhat it has an 8 speed transmission which has 4 forward speeds and 1 reverse on the main shifter, with a secondary hi/low shifter for a total of 8 forward speeds and 2 reverse speeds.

You said that it is an Industrial 5000, and then you said "it doesn't make any difference if I put the lever in forward or reverse, it wont move even an inch!" I assumed that there was an actual lever that switched it between forward and reverse.

So now I assume that you meant that it doesn't make any difference shifting the main shift lever into any of the forward or reverse gears, it won't move in any of them.

Is the Hi/Low shifter (shorter shift handle) in its Neutral position by chance? If not, Have you tried all gears on the main shifter with the Hi/Low in both the Low and High range?

My apologies. I responded after reading the model number in your last post without reading the rest of that post. If it has the torque converter transmission with the Fwd-N-Rev lever then the last letter of the model number should be an "F", not a "C".

The 5500 and 5550 were the true Industrial Loader/Backhoe models of the 5000 series. They would have been sold everywhere that the 5000 ag chassis model was, including Europe and the US.

As far as I know, the ag chassis 5000 was never sold with the torque converter transmission, only the 5500 and 5550 Industrial models (in the 5000 series) had that transmission from the factory. I am thinking that the original 8 speed manual transmission must have been replaced at some point with the torque converter trans, and whoever replaced the transmission stamped the flat spot with the numbers that were on the original transmission.

Is the foil sticker still there on the under side of the right side hood panel, above the battery? If so, compare the model number there with the one on the bell housing, and if they match, then my guess is becoming more of a probability than a guess.

There is the possibility that a custom fleet order might have been placed by a highway department or very large corporation whereby Ford might have made some 5000 ag chassis tractors with the torque converter transmission, but they were never sold like that through dealers to the general public.

Hello there again guys and thank you again big time, for you knowledgeable & willingness to share. The input is much appreciated.
Its disappointing that the photographs weren't able to be up-loaded. They show the tractor & the Transmission linkage layout.

There is indeed two gear levers on the top of the Trans'
plus the Fwd / Rev selector lever at about a fingers length away from the LH side of the steering wheel. This Fwd/Rev lever works its way down to the RH side of the Trans' through a number of pivoting linkages and turns a round shaft of approx 5/8" (at a guess) shaft.

The tractor was bought new by my now deceased cobber & purchased from a local Ford agency/dealership.

The questions that have been asked do have some interesting points. Something I did find when researching the tractors actual model a yr or so ago, is that it has mudguards off an earlier model (pre Force) but I read somewhere on a Ford tractor site (might even have been this one) that the engine is classed as a Force model.
I really don't know what I am talking about here, 'cause its always just been called, "the 5000".

Re the model & its identification...
On the LH side of the Bell Housing, the numbers/letters are OC25 B and AG7020

As for the Foil Sticker under the RH side bonnet, No, sorry but there is no sign of the sticker.

How many cylinders the engine has. It is a 4 cyl engine.

When finding if it would move...
I was asked if the gear levers were indeed still in gear.
Yep.
I didn't try all gears on both levers but did try several.
I will have to do that again 'cause I must admit that I didn't check to see if the High /Low range had been accidentally moved. Generally I haven't ever needed to move that one. It's always been used in High. So good point. Thanks.
Its presently hosing down with icy rain at present so that will have to be checked within the next couple of days. (yep, I'm a woosh, today preferring the room with its fire goin')

I have just managed to find a free Workshop Manual on Line.
ford_tractor_2000-5000_1975_1975.pdf

It took a while to down load it so patience is needed. (Me patient? hmmmm yeah right)
I have yet to look but hope that this particular model is in it.

Thanks again

That service manual should cover most of your tractor (engine front axle & steering, rear axle, etc.) as I believe that one is for the Ag chassis tractors, but I don't think that it will cover the torque converter transmission or the loader or backhoe, as those should all be in the Industrial Tractor supplemental manual, which is the third manual in that link to the ebay listing that I posted.

I am still perplexed why a torques converter transmission is stamped with a model number that says that the tractor should have an 8 speed manual, but my best guess is still that someone replaced the transmission at some point and stamped the old numbers into the new transmission.

Getting back to your problem with the tractor not moving, let's hope that it's just the hi/low shifter being in neutral. If not, the torque converter trans has its own internal hydraulic pump that powers the forward/reverse functionality. The torque converter is driven by the flywheel, and the torque converter in turn drives the transmission input shaft and the pump. The F-N-R lever moves the spool in a control valve that directs the hydraulic flow to a hydraulic clutch pack that is spring loaded in both directions so that when no pressure is getting to either side it is in neutral, and when it has pressure on one side it is in forward and on the other side it is in reverse. I would doubt that all of the mechanical gears would go out at once, so I would think that the problem would have to be in the front of the transmission, either the reverser system or the torque converter itself, or else it would have to be after the manual gearing of the transmission, like at the output shaft or in the differential or rear axle.

Thanks Sean PA.
What you explained I feel is what I need to know to start with.

I'll take a trip to where the tractor is today and take a nosy at what the transmission details are stamped on the Trans Housing.

I'd expect that the trans will likely have its own spin on (hopefully) type oil filter so I will see what i can find and look there for a start.
Or do they have an internal gauze somewhere in the boxes sump?

Could you also tell me, if there is anywhere on the tranny that I can plug a gauge into, so as to check the oil pressure from the Trans Oil Pump?

I have never needed to work on a Ford 5000 before I did the front axle pivot pins and king pins. Although its rarely used, its been a reliable old girl which means that even though Ive had it for a decade or more, I'm totally new to them other than grease and oil & battery. Consequently, other R&M is a little stressful at this stage.

Ta

Follow the oil lines from the left side of the transmission up to the front of the tractor. They should go to an oil cooler in front of the radiator and there should be a spin-on filter up there as well.

Sorry, I don't know the details on testing the pressure in that transmission, but the service manual for the Industrial tractors that has the information on that transmission would have the place(s) to plumb a test gauge and the procedures to follow and what pressures to expect.