New Terrified 841 Powermaster Owner!

Tankstew

New User
I'm very excited to be a new 1958 Ford 841 owner. However, I'm terrified of the issues that I may not have identified prior to the purchase that will cost me down the road but I'm sure that at the end of the road, I'll love her even more. ha ha ha. So a few items for thoughts on this tractor. First the good. The tires have air (the rears have water too) in them, the engine runs and sounds pretty good, the engine oil looks good (no milkyness), the lift works and the pto works. Now the "I'm not so sure" part.
1. The hydraulic fluid is milky. The PO told me it was likely water that had condensed in the hydraulic system. I was planning to drain the fluid then refill to see if that resolved the issue.
2. The lift will stay up while the tractor is running but falls down within 20 seconds of the tractor going off.
3. Right before I bought the tractor, I looked in the radiator and could see no water above the fins. I asked the PO and he said he hadn't checked it but it never ran hot while he plowed a field the other day. Fast forward to the delivery yesterday. I drove the tractor 1/4 mile into my property to park it and I opened the radiator to add water and antifreeze and saw foam down in the radiator. He said that he had not added any water since the other day when I saw that the radiator looked low. I plan to drain the radiator, refill with distilled water and run to see if it foams again. I've read that foam can mean a blown head gasket or cracked head or block EEEEEK!!!
4. The glass fuel bowl filter has been replaced with a cheap throwaway inline filter. Should I replace it with original or keep using that type of filter. He said that I should keep several in the tool box and when it started to lose power or run rough, just replace the filter.
5. The starter foot button has been bypassed and a key starter is used. Does this bypass the transmission safety? Should I rewire the starter button back in?
6. The hood (center opening hood) looks like it is about 1" too narrow. The prongs that fit into the holes on the fenders don't line up. Is it possible that someone put a hood from a 600 series on this tractor? The fenders don't look like they are further apart than they are supposed to be.

Anyway, I just toss all that out there because I know that I will get good sound advice from someone on these. At the end of the day, I'm a happy new tractor owner. I bought the tractor for doing work around some river property we bought a few months ago. Bushhogging, hauling wood around and other general man stuff that requires more horsepower than a lawnmower. :)

I'm in the process of trying to get a pto shaft for the 5' bushhog that I got with it. Not sure of the bushhog's brand yet but it looks like it was built like a tank and the shaft spun very nicely.

Thanks in advance of all your help!!
 
I like 841s. Buy a manual at your local tractor supply store. it will help you immensely.

1. thats common, and your approach seems right

2. does the lift bob around at all while it is running? there can be a few causes. Will it hold somethinh heavy steady while the tractor is running? You might remove the inspection ports - the round plates on the sides under the lift cover - and look to see if there is fluid spraying out of the lift cylinder, which would suggest an worn o-ring, which is common and not a difficult fix. Do not stick your hand or anythign else in there while the tractor is running.

3. did you see foam or did you active bubbling while the tractor was running?

4. your call, theres folks here who feel striongly about it but I do not. I replace mine wiht a proper sediemnt bowl.

5. yes and yes

6, probably need a picture.

good luck!
 
1, I'd not have driven the tractor without checking the water. If you are ultra lucky, it is just low, and perhaps has a bad cap that is letting it boil it off faster than normal.

My advice is to fill it full of water, all the way to the neck, and run it with cap off watching it. if it has compression in the radiator, it will show up soon. No water in the oil? First good thing you've seen so far. :)

On the metal fit at the hood, post some pics. might even be swapped out tin, tank, or both.

Check the transmission code to make sure it is even an 841. I've seen lots of tractors sold as different machines.

Hyds ? before you can fully diagnose the hyds, you need to get real oil in there, and not oil and water.. who knows.. may be mostly water!

I would dump in a quart of cheap atf type f or dex/merc III, and then a couple pints of 90% rubbing alcohol, and then a quart or 3 of diesel, run it around the yard to mix well, slosh around and such and then drain. Refill with utf fluid. can be the cheap stuff if you are in an area above freezing. then lets check the function after having new oil in it and running it a bit.
 
As said if it is in fact an 841 it will have a 4 speed transmission and non live PTO which means you NEED an ORC on the PTO for brush hogging or you may end up going swimming with it or run into a fence etc.
#1 Never fill a cooling system if warm or you can crack the block or head. Me I would fill the cooling system and watch it for a few days.
#2 I would get rid of the in line filter and get the correct sediment bowl for it.
#3 as for the 3 point dropping that is pretty common and you may get by with it for years or 10 days one never knows. Me I would change o fluid and run it till it does not work any more.
Now if it is in fact an 841 does it have a lever on the side of the bell housing just forward of the clutch pedal if it does your lucky you are likely to have a Sherman combo which would give you 12 forward speeds
 
The sediment bowl issue and or clogging filter etc, check the condition of the fuel tank. Aside from what it takes to remove it, if you are getting the typical coffee grain rust particulates or similar rust sediment, it may pay to clean the tank. I've cleaned some rusty ones by using some crushed stone, or a small piece of thick rusty old chain, just by sloshing it around. Given the shape of the tank it might be a bit cumbersome, smaller tanks are easier to deal with. Can be done chemically, methyl ethyl ketone, (MEK) but this may not be for the inexperienced, you could corrode a hole through a metal tank. Electrolyis works too, but just using some coarse aggregate, stones, or similar (some use nuts and bolts) then strap it to something that rotates, (nothing too fast or dangerous!!!) like you can with small tank on the side of a lawn tractor tire, mow the lawn, and clean the tank at the same time, some would even use mortar mixer. In any case even a good attempt at doing this by hand may suffice at reducing the sediment to a tolerable level. I've done that as well, metal not shined up, but knocked all the loose rust off at least and did not have to clean that sediment bowl nearly as often.
 
Thanks for the comments. There is an ORC already installed on the tractor. I heard that I'd need one if it wasn't there!
 
I'll certainly try some of these ideas too. I like the simplicity of cleaning and using at the same time!
 
I will follow your recipe to get the fluid right in the hydraulic system. I'll also do the water test too. That sounds close to what I was planning on trying. I'm guessing that with the radiator full and top off, if I have a head gasket or cracked head issue, it will show up as bubbles in the water?
Thanks again!
 
Yup, it lets you see a few things, IE, like if the thermostat is stuck open or closed, bubles from compression, etc.

from there, their are more advanced tests you can do if you suspect a block, or head damage, or gasket damage, like compression and leakdown tests.. etc.
 

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Whose UTF do you recommend? Can I get it at a local auto parts store? Also do you you have a recommendation on a set of stabilizer bars for the 3 point lift?

Thanks!
Bart
 

WRT the hood fit, it appears that the screws and nuts that hold the hood sides to the instrument panel mus be missing. There are supposed to be either four or six, don't recall at the moment.
 
Lots of people have house brand UTF's. basically you see 3 quality levels, which you can usually tell apart by price.

Major brand and dealer name oil, can be 50-80$ per 5g pail

most house and store prands fall in the 30-50$ range

economy oils can be in the 19-30$ range.

The economy oils usually have the worst viscosity numbers vs temperature. IE. the cheap oils are usually very thick when cold. If you are in texas at summertime, not bad at all.. but horrible in michigan during the winter.

MSDS and other data sheets can usually be found with some searching.

The 3 most bargain labeled oils i have seen are accell, generic '303' oils, and 'pure flow'

Some of the cheaper oils don't list specs, they just say ok for older tractors.

For picking specs out, look for M2C134

Tractor supply traveler UTF is fine as well as walmart supertech. Rural king seems to be about the same oil as well. All of those are priced in the mid grade level.

I've been making my own stabilizers from bar stock, since you see different arm lengths from some replacement ford arms and originals.. however hit a farm store with your pin to pin measurement to see what they have.
 
Thanks for the information on the UTF. So as a green newbie to tractors, what are the from and to locations on the pin to pin measurement?
 
pin to pin ARE the from / to measurements.

IE. measure from the center of the pin on the under axle stabilizer bar pin, to the implement pin. measure both sides so you get equal on each side.
 
Finally got down to the tractor at our property and got to work on it a little. Of course when I got there today one of the rear tires was flat. I pumped it up with a small air compressor I keep in the car and it stayed up long enough to drive it around a little. I did the atf, alcohol and diesel mix in the hydraulic system. When I drained the old, it looked like coffee with slots of creamer. After putting in your recommended concoction, i ran the tractor around a little and then drained it. I refilled with O,Reilly's 303. It didn't list the mc2134 but it did list that it met the standards for Ford tractors. After a few ups and downs on the lift to get the fluid moving I was amazed at the result! It flys up now when I raise the lift. Previously it had gone up but was sluggish. Thanks for the advice. I also filled the radiator up with water after draining the old coolant. The water was turbulent in the radiator but I assumed that was just the water pump moving the water. I couldn't say it was pulsing with the engine rotation so still not sure on the head gasket. However it fired right up when I got there today and seemed to run like a top. Next trip I have to remove the tire and take it somewhere to get repaired.
 
So far so good. You can monitor the engine oil for water as you use it and watch rad level. It will naturally puke some out when hot since we over filled it for testing. It should not puke out past coils as viewd cold. It should also not puke out under cap but thru drain hole/hose. Bad fitting cap can let one continually loose water over time.

Good to hear on the Hyds, sounds lil it was mostly water in there.

That 303 fluid is fine for above freezing use. Ps, remember to swap back to mixed coolant when we determine your head, block and rad aren't leaking
 

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