How could hydraulic fluid get in engine coolant?

Greg1959

Well-known Member
1953 Ford Jubilee with Sherman backhoe and Wagner loader. Radiator had leak so I
installed a rebuilt one I had in storage. Flushed the coolant system with water and
vinegar mix and then flushed with water several times.

Water in radiator has some small globs floating in it. When I stick my finger in and
feel it, the globs feel slick and smell exactly like the hydraulic fluid. To me
hydraulic fluid has a distinct acrid smell.

Anyway, there is no 'milking' up of engine oil in the crankcase(it's clear as new
oil). Vane style hydraulic pump.

Hydraulic fluid in sump is cloudy.

How can hydraulic fluid make it to contaminate radiator coolant?

Thanks
 
You would almost have to have an odd crack in the block that some how is in the same area as the hyd pump for that to happen
 
Old- Yup, it's pretty strange. I can't see anywhere for cross contamination.

Also, I forgot to add to the original post was that the 'cloudy' sump oil cleared up after running the tractor for a little bit. I always attributed it to rainwater getting into the sump via a loose fitting dip stick plus condensation.

Thanks for the suggestion.
 
Either what old said, or a previous owner was really sloppy and spilled some into the radiator, or absent minded and started pouring it in the radiator before he realized it wasn't coolant.
 
Old antifreeze (Stuff that has been sitting on the shelf or in a warehouse for over a year) will have things looking like that in it but I don't remember it having A smell like oil.
 
Flush or not I'm guessing leftover contamination.

If you are not making coolant or hyd oil, and not loosing coolant or hyd oil, and neither emulsifies.... I'd put it on the 'watch' list.

Also watch engine oil for emulsion
 
Okay guys, Thanks for the responses.

Here is my next plan....I mix some dish-washing detergent(low suds) with some water soluble degreaser. Add this to the water in the radiator and bring the engine up to temp.

The way I see it is, one of two things things will happen....either it will clean the coolant system of residual oil or, if there is a small leak, it will make it worse and I can find it. While, all the time monitoring the crankcase oil and hydraulic fluid compartments.

If all compartments are 'clean' then I will flush cooling system with clean water and good to go!

If I gain water in any compartment, well, that will give me an idea of where to start.

Because, if it has a weak area and is starting to go, I'd rather have it do it now while I have the tin off and everything is pretty easy to get to. Sure beats putting it all back together and then have another problem arise.

What do y'all think about my reasoning and solutions to addressing this situation?
 
(quoted from post at 19:42:37 04/02/15)

It sounds like a plan! However there's an obvious here that no one has addressed, maybe even two.

1. It is extremely unlikely that Lube and/or Hydraulic systems will cross contaminate with cooling systems because of one leak. Both lube and hydraulic systems run at significantly higher pressures than cooling systems do. therefore if you're seeing oil in the cooling system, it's unlikely you'll be seeing the opposite.

2. I cannot conceive of it being in any way possible on this tractor for hydraulic oil to be entering the cooling system, nor for coolant to be entering the hydraulic system . . . unless it's got some weird add-on we don't know about.
 

My analysis is that as everyone else is saying, getting hydraulic oil in the radiator is maybe a one In a thousand likelihood. being able to ID the type of oil by smell is probably a one in a thousand likelihood. 1,000x1,000=1,000,000. To me, one in a million chance means cross it off the list and go on to the next item.
 
.
.
Was there ever - or was an add on available
as an oil cooler transferring heat from radiator to hyd oil?

Similar to today's transmission coolers buried in the radiator?

Just thinking out loud :)

.
 
(quoted from post at 11:07:10 04/03/15) .
.
Was there ever - or was an add on available
as an oil cooler transferring heat from radiator to hyd oil?

Similar to today's transmission coolers buried in the radiator?

Just thinking out loud :)

.

Not that I have ever heard of on an NAA, but that doesn't mean there wasn't one.

The first dual core radiators that I am aware of on Ford tractors were for the 1965-1975 S-O-S and torque converter (auto reverser) transmission models.
 
Keith- That makes a lot of sense. The rad did have a small leak and I took it to the rad shop to get pressure tested and soldered. Got it back home and put it up on a shelf until I needed it to replace another rad.

I wonder if the PO might have put in stop leak and as you said, that is what I am now seeing.

I'm going to clean and flush the coolant system and keep and eye on my fluid levels.

Thanks
 
soundguy- Thanks for the suggestions. I will clean and flush and just keep an eye on the fluids.

Thanks
 
It is impossible to get Hyd Fluid Into the Radiator without other symptoms.

1. If it were leaking from the pump seal it would go into the crankcase. Overfilling crankcase. Then it would have to find its way into the cooling system through the block or head. At any rate, it would be mixed with regular oil in the Radiator.

2. If it were leaking from the hyd reservoir then the transmission oil would have been cloudy as well. And then it would still have to make its way into the crankcase, and it would be leaking from the infamous cotter pin hole.

3. Front pump for the loader has no point where it mixes with anything, unless its leaking from a cylinder and the radiator cap is off.

4. Assuming the Sherman runs off of a pto driven pump and is 3pt attached? Even if it was connected to the regular Hyd system it would still have to travel through the trans, bellhousing, crankcase...

5. If you had a big enough leak in the rear main to allow hyd oil into crankcase you would likely hold no oil pressure, and have other issues.

There just isn't any place where the two systems can connect without going through another system first. So as long as you don't have an engine that seems to be making oil, then its probably not hyd fluid.

If you want to be 100% sure, you can get a kit to check for exhaust gas in your radiator. Its a plastic tube that has a bulb on it, you drop some chemical in it, its blue to start, if it turns brown, then you have exhaust getting into your coolant, and possibly oil as well.

Long story short, it pretty much has to be left over stop leak of some sort, or just residue built up.

My recommendation would be to take the radiator to a shop and have them boil it to get it super clean and see if there is a pinhole leak somewhere that can be fixed the correct way.
 
64frd4000ind- I agree with you too, no way for hydraulic fluid to get in radiator. The
radiator was taken to a radiator shop and repaired. I also wanted it boiled but, I
guess the shop did not boil it (I paid to have it boiled).

Guess I'll have to find a new radiator repair shop next time.

Thanks
 
Buddy of mine runs a shop in Beecher City, IL, he says depending on what they used, it can take 2 or 3 times being boiled and rinsed to get it all out.

They may have just done it once.

This time of year they get hectic with the farmers bringing in stuff that 'has to be done yesterday' so they can get into the field.

I had him fix up my radiator, and coat my gas tank this winter while I'm working on my tractor. Two really good investments if you have it apart already.

I was lucky though, I did some computer work for him, for his business in trade for the work on my tractor.
 
64frd4000ind This was a radiator that I had the work done on 3 years ago. Since then it
has been sitting on a shelf.
 

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