Ford 800 starting problems

Greetings, I have a 1956 ford 800 tractor that was converted 5 years ago to 12v. Generally speaking it runs fine. In august, I replaced the solenoid because the terminals were zapped. After that the thing ran great. I have been using it to push snow without fail. Over the last week, I noticed it starting to have some starting problems and I cant figure out what is going on. Generally, my process is, I open up the gas valve set the throttle to about 50% and hold down the clutch and push the start button... click. thats all she does. So, then I start to get creative. I'll put it in 5th gear, rock it back and forth a couple times and try starting it again. Sometimes that works. but boy does it crank over slow but once its running, it runs smooth.

Then I had to take it to the next level when the rocking didnt work. I actually took off the starter and inspected it, gears on the starter look good and the crank gear in the engine looked fine. (Although it was dry, I wasnt sure if that area of the engine is supposed to have oil in it. I simply put the starter back on and tried again and it started fine, although it still cranked super slow.

Finally, yesterday, I thought it must be a battery problem, the battery is 5 years old. I took my old one to Autozaone and they tested it and said it tested fine, I described the problem and they said, maybe its not holding a charge. I got a new one and no change. Thankfully the nice people at autozone let me return it and get my old one back. So now I'm getting worried. The engine has enough oil, the transmission has enough oil. If I put it in 5th gear the engine rotates when I rock the wheels. I'm afraid that its the early signs of a seize.

I've been looking around a lot and may people point to the solenoid of valve compression. Since the solenoid is only 5 months old, I'm leaning away from replacing it, but it is way easier to replace that than adjust the valves.

I should note that it has been very frigid here the last few weeks, ranging from -10 to 20 degrees.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Here is what I would do ...
1. If it was fine and slowly got worse I would
suspect the battery or bad battery terminal
connections so check them first. Make sure
they are clean and tight.

2. Put a jumper pack or jumper cables from a
good battery on your battery. If is spins good
then then the battery is probably weak even
though it tested OK. A five year old battery
in cold weather is likely to be getting weak.

3. When trying to start it feel the solenoid
and starter terminals to see if they are
heating up. If so the starter is probably
dragging and needs attention.

4. If it was fine before the solenoid was
replaced and now isn't then that should be the
next suspect. Its easy to test with an OHM
meter. Just disconnect the cable to the
starter, put your meter across the two big
power terminals and press the starter switch to
engage the solenoid. Resistance should be 0
ohms. Try it several times and if it isn't 0
every time them replace it again. I have found
that even an old grungy one is likely to be
better that the new ones we get nowadays.

Somewhere in all of this you should discover
the problem. Good luck.

Clean tight bright at all battery cable connections. Or in other words clean up all connections and see if that helps. If it does not help try a jumper from the 2 big terminals on the solenoid. If it spins over then the solenoid is bad. If it does not spin over then pull the starter and have it checked it maybe going bad. If all that checks out you may have one or both battery cables bad and that you can not see

Norm,

Per your instructions, I disconnected the cable that goes to the starter and pushed the start button. The click still occurred. I then (with the starter still disconnected) used an ohm meter and made contact to both sides of the solenoid and the meter started spiking as I hit the start button, so I will replace the solenoid again and see if that solves the problem. Thank you.

Before replacing the solenoid try a jumper across the 2 big studs of the solenoid and see if it spins over. If it spins over yes solenoid is likely to be bad but if it does not spin over good chance the starter is bad

There is some good advice here, but I had similar trouble with my
Farmall a few years back. After converting to 12volt, it continued to
get worse. I replaced the starter, starter switch and cable ends.
What I didn't check was the wis inside the insulation. The battery
cables were badly corroded and once I replaced them, it would
crank like nobody's business. Just peel off a little insulation and you
will know. If you do replace the cables, even on 12 volt, stick with
the big wires.

It sounds like Ed might be on your problem. Many people don't realize that too small or badly worn cables can get resistive and cause problems. First, if you haven't already done it, clean every connection that carries starter current till it's bright and shiny. Make sure they are all nice and tight. If you're still having problems, consider your battery cables are too small of a gauge. Are they just the standard off the shelf cables from Autozone? I would either make or buy some 2 gauge cables. Tractor supply sells them. I have it in bulk and I prefer to make custom cables because it's cheap for me.

Remember anything in the starter circuit that could resist current flow can cause a problem. Check all your connections and for goodness sake, don't use those clamp on battery connection terminals. LOL

I took "old"'s advice and tried to take the

solenoid out of the equations and it still did

nothing. I decided to take the starter out and

look at it under some light. here is what I
found.
Looks like plenty of pitting.

There is your problem, you may get by with new brushes and cleaning the armature. That is what I would do. Be sure to clean out the spaces between the windings.

^this. maybe there's a place near you that rebuilds such things that has an old-school armature lathe. That's really what you need to straighten out that commutator and undercut the insulator between the windings.

Looks like you're narrowing it down.

Before finally taking the starter apart, I did
replace the cable from the positive battery post
to the solenoid, and the cable from the solenoid
to the starter, the braided steel cable from the
battery to the body was still good so I just
cleaned it up. I'll get me a rebuild kit and see
how that goes.

The easy way to check starting system is to check voltage. Put the + lead of the volt meter on the battery post and the - on the starter lug and try to crank the volt reading should be less than 1 volt. If more start moveing the - lead back toward the battery like the out put side of the solenoid then the battery side and so on when ever the voltage reading drops you found your problem.

Good news everyone, I received my starter rebuild
kit this week, put in the new brushes and the
starter works like a champ now. Thanks for the
help.