New guy with a tranny question

1963ford

New User
Hello everyone. I bought my first tractor about a year ago for bush hogging and other uses on my 9 acres. It has performed perfectly since I learned they made an overrunning clutch, it doesn't have live power. The first couple of times bush hogging were interesting! I have a 1963 Ford 2000 4 cyl. gas engine with a 4 speed transmission. It also has a FEL that come in very handy. Not sure of the brand since there is no tag or stamping #'s on it anywhere. The last time I was hauling a roll of hay I noticed a knocking noise in the tranny area. I first thought maybe something in the clutch or pressure plate had come loose. The noise would go away when you pressed the clutch pedal in. Then it seemed to lock up when placed in gear and begin to roll. I could still drive it but did it very slowly. I took the top off of the tranny and found one of the gears(possibly 3rd gear if I done my research correctly) had some teeth broken off. I am considering breaking this thing apart myself and trying to repair the tranny. I know once I do there may be other issues that I may not be able to see until it is apart.
My question is: what other Ford 4 spd. tranny internal gears will interchange with my tractor? In other words I have found a complete gear cluster, which has all the gears for the top shaft on them, for about the same price as the 1 gear; but it is from a 8N tractor. Will a 8n, 2n, 9n, or any other model tranny gear or gears interchange in my tranny? Thank you in advance for any wisdom you could share. :D
 
An alternate question (which I am NOT the guy to answer) might be "what entire transmissions could I swap in here" - you might be able to upgrade from the junkyard, since what little I do know is that the 4 speed was a pretty basic transmission, and they made others that were/are considered more desirable.
 
Would changing the whole tranny just involve exchanging it or would there need to be other modifications? Would it effect anything else? Would it effect the value up or down? Your response makes sense but it begs more questions from me. I am mainly looking for the most economical way to repair. I have no knowledge of tractors but would like to get advice from those of you who have spent years using and working on them.
 
(quoted from post at 23:23:31 12/02/14) Hello everyone. I bought my first tractor about a year ago for bush hogging and other uses on my 9 acres. It has performed perfectly since I learned they made an overrunning clutch, it doesn't have live power. The first couple of times bush hogging were interesting! I have a 1963 Ford 2000 4 cyl. gas engine with a 4 speed transmission. It also has a FEL that come in very handy. Not sure of the brand since there is no tag or stamping #'s on it anywhere. The last time I was hauling a roll of hay I noticed a knocking noise in the tranny area. I first thought maybe something in the clutch or pressure plate had come loose. The noise would go away when you pressed the clutch pedal in. Then it seemed to lock up when placed in gear and begin to roll. I could still drive it but did it very slowly. I took the top off of the tranny and found one of the gears(possibly 3rd gear if I done my research correctly) had some teeth broken off. I am considering breaking this thing apart myself and trying to repair the tranny. I know once I do there may be other issues that I may not be able to see until it is apart.
My question is: what other Ford 4 spd. tranny internal gears will interchange with my tractor? In other words I have found a complete gear cluster, which has all the gears for the top shaft on them, for about the same price as the 1 gear; but it is from a 8N tractor. Will a 8n, 2n, 9n, or any other model tranny gear or gears interchange in my tranny? Thank you in advance for any wisdom you could share. :D
ay be others, but 8N, 9N, 2N won't interchange with your 2000. You can spend some time comparing part numbers on CNH site or used parts places like Wenger's & very likely answer your questions.
 
They are not hard to work on but you do need a little
understanding of how they work. If you decide to change
be sure your pedal configuration is exactly the same.
the other is whether the output shaft is coarse or fine
spline. you won't know that until you till you take it
out. I do have a good four speed with course spline out
put and later model pedals. live on the east coast.
Ron
 

There is a four speed from a 601, which is nearly identical to your 2000, on ebay now for $350.00 it is in CT. Be sure to put new input, output seals in it and a new clutch release bearing. Also a new rear freeze plug on the motor. When splitting most of us secure the front with blocking and roll the rear. The easiest safest way to do this is with HoboNC's trailer jack with bracket. This is not meant to be a comprehensive guide.
 
(quoted from post at 20:23:31 12/02/14) Hello everyone. I bought my first tractor about a year ago for bush hogging and other uses on my 9 acres. It has performed perfectly since I learned they made an overrunning clutch, it doesn't have live power. The first couple of times bush hogging were interesting! I have a 1963 Ford 2000 4 cyl. gas engine with a 4 speed transmission. It also has a FEL that come in very handy. Not sure of the brand since there is no tag or stamping #'s on it anywhere. The last time I was hauling a roll of hay I noticed a knocking noise in the tranny area. I first thought maybe something in the clutch or pressure plate had come loose. The noise would go away when you pressed the clutch pedal in. Then it seemed to lock up when placed in gear and begin to roll. I could still drive it but did it very slowly. I took the top off of the tranny and found one of the gears(possibly 3rd gear if I done my research correctly) had some teeth broken off. I am considering breaking this thing apart myself and trying to repair the tranny. I know once I do there may be other issues that I may not be able to see until it is apart.
My question is: what other Ford 4 spd. tranny internal gears will interchange with my tractor? In other words I have found a complete gear cluster, which has all the gears for the top shaft on them, for about the same price as the 1 gear; but it is from a 8N tractor. Will a 8n, 2n, 9n, or any other model tranny gear or gears interchange in my tranny? Thank you in advance for any wisdom you could share. :D
If you have a broken gear on the top shaft you probably have a broken gear on the lower shaft as well.

Mark
 

Where are you located? I have almost all of a 4 speed from an 841 (which will be the same as your transmission) here in Central Texas.
 
Thanks everyone for your posts. Each one has been very helpful. If all goes well I am going to begin to break this thing apart next week to see what all is needed to get her going again. I am definitely going to replace the clutch while it is apart. I think it may have a 10" clutch but will wait till it is apart to verify. Any suggestions on a reliable clutch kit? I have seen prices from $89.00-$350.00 for the same kit. I know you get what you pay for, I just don't want to over pay. Funds are tight this time of year for me.
Thanks for the freeze plug idea, showcrop. I didn't know there was a freeze plug back there. Will definitely do that along with any other seals to prevent having to do this again anytime soon.
Texas!, I am in Kentucky near Tn border, I wish I was a little closer. I am hoping 3rd gear is all I need but like Mark said, I may find more when I get it apart.
Thanks, Hobo,NC I think I have narrowed the 3rd gear part # to 7102/8n which is the same in a 8n tractor.
I am hoping to take some pics along the way in case I need to post and get some more help.

Thanks again everyone!
 
According to the parts site, the individual gears in the 4 speed were the same from the '53 NAA/Jubilee up through the '64 2000/4000 models. Other internal parts varied along the way but the gears themselves are listed as a single part number each for that entire year range.
 
(quoted from post at 06:30:11 12/04/14) According to the parts site, the individual gears in the 4 speed were the same from the '53 NAA/Jubilee up through the '64 2000/4000 models. Other internal parts varied along the way but the gears themselves are listed as a single part number each for that entire year range.

Thanks, that's good to know!

:D
 
(quoted from post at 17:40:12 12/04/14)
(quoted from post at 06:30:11 12/04/14) According to the parts site, the individual gears in the 4 speed were the same from the '53 NAA/Jubilee up through the '64 2000/4000 models. Other internal parts varied along the way but the gears themselves are listed as a single part number each for that entire year range.

Thanks, that's good to know!

:D
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Well
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Well, it took me the better part of the day but I got it apart. Next is to disassemble the trans to see what parts I need then put it all back together. The wife asked if she would get her parking space in the garage back before spring? I told her late winter! LOL
 
That does look like it is easier on the back.

Hey guys, Another question. I am thinking about installing the transmission on the engine first and then installing the rear end. Probably pull the pto shaft out of the rear end to do this so I just have one shaft to spline. Is this a good idea or am I overlooking something? Just seems like it would be easier to me.
Still waiting on parts so I can start putting it back together. Maybe Santa will come next week.lol

Thanks for all your help so far.

Hoping each one has a Merry Christmas! :D
 
(quoted from post at 21:49:58 12/13/14) That does look like it is easier on the back.

Hey guys, Another question. I am thinking about installing the transmission on the engine first and then installing the rear end. Probably pull the pto shaft out of the rear end to do this so I just have one shaft to spline. Is this a good idea or am I overlooking something? Just seems like it would be easier to me.
Still waiting on parts so I can start putting it back together. Maybe Santa will come next week.lol

Thanks for all your help so far.

Hoping each one has a Merry Christmas! :D

You can go thru the inspection hole and line the shafts up... I would not remove the PTO unless I had to for some other reason... Either way you will have to put your hand in the inspection hole.... YMMV
 
(quoted from post at 12:23:23 12/13/14)
(quoted from post at 21:49:58 12/13/14) That does look like it is easier on the back.

Hey guys, Another question. I am thinking about installing the transmission on the engine first and then installing the rear end. Probably pull the pto shaft out of the rear end to do this so I just have one shaft to spline. Is this a good idea or am I overlooking something? Just seems like it would be easier to me.
Still waiting on parts so I can start putting it back together. Maybe Santa will come next week.lol

Thanks for all your help so far.

Hoping each one has a Merry Christmas! :D

You can go thru the inspection hole and line the shafts up... I would not remove the PTO unless I had to for some other reason... Either way you will have to put your hand in the inspection hole.... YMMV

Wrong clutch sent to me :cry: Now waiting for correct one. I am putting the transmission back together.
I am concerned about how tight the countershaft is though. I did not test it before I removed it but it seems very tight now. Replaced a broken gear. Barely able to turn it by hand. Put the same shims in it that came out of it. Will this create a problem or do I need to correct something now before I reinstall it? The IT book show a special tool, which I don't have, to check foot pounds as you turn shaft. Is there another way to assure it is correct? I would rather not have to split this thing again. Better to make sure it is right before I go back together with it.
Thanks in advance for any help and hope each of you have a Merry Christmas!!
 
You can use a fish scale and a string. Wind the string around the shaft and pull on it with the fish scale. Scale tells you the lbs of resistance. All the new scales are digital. Not sure if that makes things more difficult as my old scale uses a spring.
 
(quoted from post at 16:23:59 12/07/14)
If you have a welder this would make life much better...


Hobo, I suggested your stand t him before he started. next time I do one it will definitely be using your stand. So much safer!!


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tractorjack004.jpg
 


20 to 35" lb's is 2 to 3 ft lbs... That is snug you should be able to turn it and it should not fell like its stuck and sticking and you have to break it free to turn it...

If you have assembled the trans its gonna be tuff to set the preload on the counter... You could cut a shim out of paper :wink:
if it's assembled and it would make you feel better add a thin shim out of thin gasket paper and move on...

Did you put new oil seals in the rear main and counter shaft... The aftermarket seals are different than the originals that were double lipped seals... If your replacements were thinner and a signal lip I double them up and put the lips together...
 
(quoted from post at 05:42:58 12/24/14)

20 to 35" lb's is 2 to 3 ft lbs... That is snug you should be able to turn it and it should not fell like its stuck and sticking and you have to break it free to turn it...

If you have assembled the trans its gonna be tuff to set the preload on the counter... You could cut a shim out of paper :wink:
if it's assembled and it would make you feel better add a thin shim out of thin gasket paper and move on...

Did you put new oil seals in the rear main and counter shaft... The aftermarket seals are different than the originals that were double lipped seals... If your replacements were thinner and a signal lip I double them up and put the lips together...

Hobo, I did replace the seals in the shafts but now that you mention it I think they may have been single lip. Should I try to fine and install double lipped seal?
I have only partially assembled the trans. Was afraid to complete it until I am able to make sure it is correct. Are you saying I need to add shims until I am able to get the 2-3 ft. lbs?
I think I could make some shims out of aluminum flashing, what do you think? Or should I just use gasket material?
Thanks!
 
I don't think you will find a the original style double lipped seal for this application so its your call... That's why I use two of the replacements and turn the guarder spring out toward the oil in the sumps. One toward the trans and one toward the hydraulic oil...

On the shim I would think either would work...
 

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