ford 860 -- trying to figure out what is normal ...

(sorry for the reposts -- my last post had some
links that are not allowed, so this version should
display on both classic and modern forums).

Hi, bought a ford 860 last winter. Have not used
it a lot other than some snow plowing, grading,
and pulling logs for firewood. When I got it, it
was running rich as evidenced by the soot from
exhaust.

Some observations since I've had it:

1. when I first got it, it would sputter when I
revved up engine

2. cleaning the air cleaner seemed to help with
the rev-up some

3. someone told me to spray carb cleaner into the
air intake while running, so I did that -- did not
notice any huge changes after that.

4. at some point, I was doing some heavy grading
on a hot day, and the tractor started to backfire,
and would not run unless I had the choke out. That
has not happened since, but I've probably not run
it that hard since. I've also installed a temp
gauge since then.

5. perhaps in early summer, its started running
rougher

6. checked the spark plugs -- the front one (by
the way, is that #1??), and it was oily. The rest
were somewhat black with some carbon buildup, but
dry. I cleaned all the plugs with a brass wire
brush, and it runs much better now -- very smooth,
and a lot more power than before I cleaned the
plugs.

7. checked compression the next day -- ran it
until it was warmed up good, pulled all the plugs.
Compression was around 147 lbs on every cylinder -
- the readings were very consistent -- I could not
tell any difference between the cylinders. Front
plug looked about like the others, but it might
have been slightly wetter -- could have been my
imagination.

8. when engine is cold, it blows a little black
smoke when I rev the engine, but it revs decently.
When its warm, and I rev the engine, I notice a
very small amount of light colored smoke. Under
moderate load (run in higher gear while pressing
the brakes), it runs good and I don't notice
smoke.

Questions:

1. Is the black smoke on rev normal when its cold?

2. is a little lighter colored smoke on rev normal
when warm?

3. does compression of 147lbs sound about right?

As the plugs are getting fouled, it seems like I
still have some work to do, so appreciate any
suggestions on the next steps. Thus far, I've
refrained from messing with the carb adjustments,
until I get through the other basics.

Thanks,

Cliff

colored smoke is likely oil burning.

your awesome compression numbers may even be because worn oil rings are showing wet compression.

as long as she is not too rich, burning a hair bit of oil ain't a deal killer. a puff on rev aint either. might have bad vss.

sounds like the average everyday non rebuilt runner you see working...

if you have not worked her hardsince you had her or she has sat alot.

put a quart of atf-f or dex 3 into the oil pan and some in the gas tank and go fog skeeters pulling a disc or plow or hogging weeds.. do that an hour, then treat her to a 15w50 oil change and service air cleaner too, clean plugs, etc.

see what that 20$ service gets you.

sounds like a decent tractor to me too.
As SouNdguy said,
And just do the normal maintenance thing.
Go thru the ignition and timing (If your parts are good, leave em, clean and adjust/set)
In my experience, a lot of headaches can be avoided by cleaning/rebuilding the carb as soon as you get it home.
(I adjust the valves always too, but that is up to you and your comfort level)
A little oil smoke wouldn't bother me in the slightest.

We get spoiled by our modern machines, the old ones need some care now and then.
Good ignition timed right, clean carb with a good clean fuel supply,
and that 860 will run/start fine and pound the ground.

Hey Guys,
I'm new to this forum and this is my first post so I hope I'm doing this right.
I bought an 860 a couple weeks ago. It cranked and ran good for a couple days. This is mostly a toy and really haven't pulled anything like a plow yet. I was using a bucket scoop to move an ash pile across the property and was going up about a 20 degree grade when the engine started cutting out and lost power. I was able limp back to the shop. First I thought that maybe the carb had picked up some trash in transporting the tractor home or going up grade. I noticed that the sediment bowl was clean so I looked at the distributor. The cap was very loose and the points looked burnt. I replaced the plugs, distributor cap, rotor, points and wires which needed to be replaced anyway and it fired right up and runs great. The point is that my first thought was carburation but it was ignition all along. Easy fix and I thanked the "Tractor God" for taking it easy on my poor inexperienced soul.

Welcome to both of you newbies! This is where you learn and get the knowledge you need to get the experience you want. Learn how to use the search function and in particular, the archive search. There you will find a wealth of knowledge.

Having just gone through the "backfire" thing on my 861, I will suggest checking the timing, too. Mine was off. Setting it by "ear" after finding top dead center with #1 plug took care of that. Oh...I had rebuilt the carb already.

Also check the plug wires, cap and rotor. Make sure you have the dust cover, it's gasket and the little spring clip in place on the distributor shaft or the distributor cap and rotor won't fit right. Be mindful of the notches for the dust cap and distributor cap fitting.

You can use a spare spark plug to check the fire. Should be blue/white and jump 1/4"

Well, still struggling with this issue. Tractor ran pretty well over summer -- had some good rotary mower sessions, and lane grading. Some times it will pull like a champ -- for example pulling a land plane loaded with gravel for over an hour or so. Most of the time, it runs fairly well, but it still occasionally has its fits -- seemingly at random times. This morning, I was plowing 4" of wet snow -- got 1/4 mi out the lane and heading up a hill where it started pulling good, and it just started cutting out again. Will idle, but if I rev or put any load on the engine it stalls. I was able to limp home with the choke half way out. Generally seems to run good when its cold. When it has its fits, its just like flipping a switch and it all the sudden goes bad.

I have replaced the H12 plugs with autolite 437s. The front plug still fouls up pretty bad, but the other three stay cleaner than the H12s did.

I tried the ATF in oil and gas treatment -- that has not made much difference.

Any ideas what I should try next? Thinking about replacing ignition parts next, then trying carb rebuild.

Thanks!
Cliff

Another thing that seems odd to me ...

Most of the time, it seems like its running rich -- plugs foul up, and it will start in the coldest weather without choke. But, when it has its fits, it acts like its running lean.

(quoted from post at 11:46:22 01/21/15) Another thing that seems odd to me ...

Most of the time, it seems like its running rich -- plugs foul up, and it will start in the coldest weather without choke. But, when it has its fits, it acts like its running lean.

Click to expand...

No expert here (my 850 runs better and better the less work I do on it), but if it typically runs rich but acts like it's running lean when you have these intermittent problems, could it be an intermittent fuel delivery problem? Check fuel flow from the carb as soon as this happens?

Brian

I'm not too familiar with your tractor model, but my 64 4000 had similar problems when I first got it.

It was fouling plugs under a light load, and under heavy load it just didn't want to run.

The previous owner had 'adjusted' the carb rich to compensate for what I found to be a pinched fuel line. My tractor has the 3 piece line from the tank to the carb, where its metal on the ends and has a rubber section (original was more like leather than rubber) and at some point someone cleaning the filter had gotten the bottom metal line twisted and formed a permanent pinch in the middle section.

I believe the new line was like $58 from the Ford Dealer and once I got the carb re-adjusted for getting the right amount of fuel I've never had that trouble since. That was 6 years ago.

If yours has a similar fuel line you might check that out, its an easy thing to check, just take it loose from the bottom of the tank and the carb and pull it out and inspect the middle section for a twist.

Also a good time to check the screen in the tank, mine was so plugged it was not worth saving.

Like I said, just using the loader or messing around the yard it was fine, other than fouling the plugs, but under load it was acting just like yours is.

Thanks for all the replies. After lunch, I cleaned the plugs. Front plug was the most fouled. Plugs 2 & 4 were somewhat fouled. Plug 3 was clean. Tractor ran fine for the entire mile of plowing and had good power. Come to think of it, the last thing we did was pull out some logs, which was a lot of idling, and then heavy pulling at low RPM (because could not get one of the logs out) which seems to foul up the plugs the fastest.

I should also note that I've cleaned the plugs quite often the year I've had it. Every time it has fits, I clean the plugs. It seems to run better after that but may also just be coincidence if there is an electrical problem.