Gas valves, absolutely DAMN RIDICULOUS!

I bought a replacement valve for my 841 ca. 2005 when I was refurbishing the old devil. I bought it from this YT website. I didn't put it on for several months due work being done - It didn't last 6 months before it started leaking from the stem (piston type valve). Of course by that time the 1-year warranty was us, so I was SOL.

I mickey moused it by pulling out the stem and pluging the hole with copper nipple - not a valve anymore but the carb doesn't leak so good to go.

Several months ago, the carb started leaking - fine, time to rebuild the carb, get a new valve.

Many threads on this forum have talked about these junky valves, but one or two have said "Hey, I get the OEM vavles and they last a long time. No problems." Right.

$109 and change from the New Holland dealer for the OEM valve. Turns out, this was the same Zenith valve I bought in 2005 (only cost about $45 YT then). How long do you think this one lasted. Not three damn weeks. Leaking gas from the carb with the valve shut off. Of course that also means the $%#@(* float valve is also leaking!

On top of all this, just finding the right parts takes ten times longer than doing the work on these gems.

I've had this tractor since 1991, not sure how much longer I'm going to have it. My wife has never said it in so many words but I know she thinks it. "That tractor is an old piece of junk." I am begining to think she is right.

Maybe it is time to switch to the "Today's Tractors" forum. Or, move to a condo and take up watching sports all weekend,and playing golf.

Its part of the challenge of keeping this old stuff running. I went to Oreillys last week for a radiator cap for my 2600. It had a Napa cap on it, a typical 7lb cap. Kid behind the counter said "no cross reference, sorry". I tried to explain it was a std 7lb cap but it seemed as though I was speaking a foreign language. Just before walking out the door an older guy grabbed it and walked to the parts shelves and started opening boxes until he found one.

Several people have asked me about buying 8ns and I told them unless they enjoy wrenching on them it wasn't for them. A long time ago I was getting parts for my Opel GT and the guy behind the counter said you know you are an car enthusiast when you work on your car every week.

This will not fix your valve, but the carb. float may have a hole in it. Take it out and stick it in some hot water and look for bubbles. Solder the holes and install. I have found a heavy float several times because of some gas in them.

Put a ball valve in line. Leave the original in place and open. Problem solved for 10 bucks.

jb

had the same problem with my original? valve, i tightened the nut on the thumb wheel, then found a place that it was open and didnt leak, then i installed a shut off valve in the gas line where it was easy to get to, its worked for 5 years so far this is on a jubilee, but it has a very similar fuel system, i wouldnt run it without a fuel shut off, my carb didnt leak either, but there was 1 time... it did, after changing oil, plugs, lost gas, ect i have shut it off every time i leave the tractor for more than a few minutes

hurley,

If I don't tow this to the junk yard and I bother opening up the carb again, I'll look for that.

When I had it apart last month, there was no liquid in the float, but It may have been out of the gas for several days, so a small amount inside might have evaporated before I took the carb apart.

Tim

i restore the orinal gas valves, this is the only right solution. The new valves must be remanufactured before using.

Tim:

Welcome to the world of mid 50s Ford fuel shut off valves. All new valves are made by the same manufacturer, and both designs (screw type and lever type) are trouble prone.

I have spoken to CNH about this issue on more than one occassion and have been told: "It's a known issue." Apparently CNH is not interested in solving this problem.

The best solution appears to be modifying a leaking valve such that you can replace the O-ring periodically. Though annoying, this will address the issue of fuel leaking around the stem. It will not address the failure to shut off problem common with the lever type valves.

I have found that the valves last longer if they are used regularly rather than rarely. It also seems to help if lubricant is sprayed onto the shaft periodically.

Dean

If they are TISCO valves the warranty is 18 mo. for what its worth (grin) I don't think I will ever try a new'n again... all I have had a dealing with leaked.

(quoted from post at 01:24:31 02/18/09) i restore the orinal gas valves, this is the only right solution. The new valves must be remanufactured before using.

Click to expand...

"i restore the orinal gas valves, this is the only right solution. "

You got that right!

My new one is back on the shelf & the 'restored' one back on the tractor (not leaking).

Ron,

Is this (below) the way you do it ? I had copied this from this board a few years ago. How does one know if the o-ring is ethanol resistent?

Copied post as follows:

This works for the screw type valve.
The fuel shut off valve with the screw is a piece of doggie do. I do not know how they can sell those things for 40+ dollars and look at their self in the mirror. Rebuild yours and save your money.
Look on the bottom of the valve and you will see a brass drift pin. This pin holds the shut off screw from coming all the way out. You can try prying it out with a knife but that may or may not work.
What I did was to grind the head off the pin so I could see the actual size of the pin. I then drilled out the pin with the correct size drill bit. Once you get the pin out you can back the shut off screw out all the way. You will see a slot on the screw where the pin fits into. There will also be a o-ring on the end of the screw. Replace this o-ring with a new one. Make sure the o-ring is fat enough to protrude out from the screw a little so it can seal. Install the shut off screw back in the valve and put it at about half way from closed to open. This will line up the pin slot with the pin hole. I used a #12 screw in place of the drift pin. You want it long enough that it fits in the shut off screw slot but does not touch the screw. I used washers to adjust the length of the #12 screw.
If it ever starts to leak again you just take out the #12 screw and back the shut off screw out and replace the o-ring again. Total cost is less than $1.00 for the #12 screw and a o-ring.
Found this in the search, Red

The valves using orings can be rebuilt.

In the last 5 years i have replaced 3 valves on my 5000 and 7610s tractors.. 2 in the last 6 months. i attribute this to the new biodiesel .. as I also had to replace orings all over the fuel systems.

I am guessing gas ( ethanol) valves are having the same problem.

Any more I just pull the old valve and swap in a 'rebuilt' one.. and ten when i have time, clean the old valve and slap new orings on it , oil it and throw it in a ziplock baggie and set it on the shelf till needed.

This last batch of nitrile orings I've put in has lasted over 6mo now.. so I am hopefull that they are finally making something that ethanol and biodiesel won't eat up right away..

soundguy

My guess is that the Orings are coming in from China and are cheaply made and not fuel resistant. When I used to work in the Foundry business we ordered viton seals in everything, they were virtually indestructable and resistant to most everything. They used to be brown in color but that was a long time ago.

I just repplaced the valve on the 2600. Sounds like I need another on the shelf.

Tim,

I replaced one on a 58 861 about 3 or 4 years ago, I shut the fuel off everytime I park it, still not leaking - knock on wood.

I think I"ve gone this long without problems because I am the only one who tuns the screw on and off, and each time I stop turning the screw as soon as I feel the least bit of resistence - I never over tighten the screw.

HTH
Matt

John Bud
You are correct
I Used A Quarter turn ball valve
in ,line at the carb. No more problems
Very easy to get to shut it off.
Yes I know this is not orignal.

I'd have to agree with you.

While the orings claim to be nitrile.. I guess they may not be.. or it may be a low grade batch.. .. or poorly made.. etc.. and I'd agree they are very likely from china.

soundguy

Just finished this replacement process on my 850. Learned all about this from you folks. But I am trying a new wrinkle.
I put in an allen screw so I can take it out when the valve begins to leak. I have another valve rebuilt so all I need to do is replace the thumb screw and tighten the allen screw. At least I don't need to drain the tank.
Also found some gas without ethanol. We'll see in a month or two.

its not the gas

Fwiw, on my Jubilee the OEM valve allowed me to unthread the "thumbwheel/shaft" all the way out, and instead of the ~5mm-long cork/rubber sleeve seal, like it came with, I used a piece of ethanol-proof 1/4" fuel line from my dirtbike supplies. Has worked beautifully now for several months.
I also only open the thumbwheel 1.5 turns out, no more, since u all told me that this would extend the life of the seal, too.