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Ford Tractors Discussion Forum
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Ford Light Industrial tractor saga

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Norm43

04-01-2014 18:20:39
97.126.200.188



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Well ... I found another tractor that wasn't what I expected. I went to look at a tractor advertised as a 1953 Jubilee parts tractor. Turned out to be a early 4000 light industrial. Its ugly but does have some redeeming graces like, 174 motor, power steering, cast iron wheel centers on the rear, some sort of Sherman (probably a reverser looking at whets left of the shift lever), heavy duty front axle, hydraulics and PTO, foot throttle, and a new exhaust. It does not have a hitch. It has a 12V Alternator system.
The fenders are huge and I think they may be from a David Brown. Tires are huge also, one is a 14.9x24 and the other a 16.9x24.
All the oils look clear and only the transmission had any water in the bottom which I drained out.
I have not tried to start it.
Most of my Ford experience is with Funk's, Jubilee's and the 100 series row crop (740 and 960).
The question is ... Is this one worth trying to save? Or is it truly a parts tractor?
Comments and advice from the experts on this site would be welcome. I would especially like to learn more about the cast iron wheels, what they might weigh, are they rare, etc. Also, what hitch is proper? I will try to upload some pictures.

Thanks in advance ... Norm43

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Norm43

04-03-2014 17:34:21
97.126.205.115



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-01-2014 18:20:39  

Here are the pictures of the maybe donor tractor that I promised last night. Serial numbers are close. Got to get one or both of them running before making any final decision on how to proceed with restoration. This one also has 24" wheels and 14.9x24 turf tires. I'm not sure if they would work out with the heavy cast iron wheels on the other one. Any ideas? They are 6 ply rated.

Thanks ... Norm43

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TONY JACOBS

04-03-2014 21:27:10
172.162.212.115



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-03-2014 17:34:21  
Hello Norm , This tractor has all of the correct sheet metal in the correct colors with the correct decals just so you know if you decide to go the distance with it . The Plastic emblem (which says Industrial and has the Gear on it came out in production in mid 1961, the late 1960 and early 1961 Industrials just used the Wheat stalk emblem that the Ag tractors used) on the front is correct also for both tractors Yes both tractors have the Double Bevel rims and the cast centers will interchange with no problems . Just have to Love the condition of the Old Iron out your way where it is nice and dry , not like the Rust Buckets out here in the East . Thanks Tony

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Norm43

04-05-2014 16:16:46
97.126.205.115



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to TONY JACOBS, 04-03-2014 21:27:10  
Thanks Tony ... Haven't gotten time to work on them yet. You sound very knowledgable.



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nsfab

04-03-2014 05:23:00
67.141.163.118



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to cdmn, 04-01-2014 18:20:39  
I am definitely going to be following this one. Im new to this old iron thing, but it makes me giddy to hear stories like these. Subscribed!

-Greg



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Sean in PA

04-02-2014 13:30:47
76.98.64.154



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-01-2014 18:20:39  
According to John Smith's site, C0NN-6015J should be a late 1960 through 1964 172 ci engine, and the 2C16 casting code means it was cast on march 16, 1962, so it is the right time frame for being original to the tractor, but it may or may not be the exact one that was actually installed in that tractor at the factory. Probably never know for sure unless you have a crystal ball.



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showcrop

04-02-2014 05:40:13
75.67.231.80



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-01-2014 18:20:39  
It sure looks like a keeper to me. You don't see many of those light industrials. It apparently has had the motor replaced, you can tell because the tank supports and hydraulic pump are not blue.



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Norm43

04-02-2014 06:25:39
97.126.200.188



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to showcrop, 04-02-2014 05:40:13  
I agree that the motor has probably been changed but I also know that the head gasket was changed about 10 years ago and that the tractor has not been run much since then. In fact the blown head gasket was still sitting under what was left of the padded tractor seat. This came from a small town in central Utah and several people came to see it leave. One of them told me that he was the one who replaced the gasket. (small world) The motor codes out as a late 174 but I don't know what code an original motor might have been.

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Texas!

04-02-2014 10:03:36
201.151.251.155



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-02-2014 06:25:39  
By the SN it"s a 1962 model so on the RIGHT side of the engine block there should be a C0NN-6015-? casting number. On the LEFT side of the block just above the oil pan there should be a date code cast into the block in raised numbers. If you can post photos of those two numbers we can tell you if it is the correct block for the tractor.



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Norm43

04-02-2014 12:30:08
97.126.200.188



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Texas!, 04-02-2014 10:03:36  

Thanks Texas ... I lived up in the mid-cities a couple of times and have a native born Texan son. Live out in Utah now.

Do you have industrial tractors?

Here are the numbers and thanks for the info.

Does that look like a cracked block to you? Just noticed that with this picture.

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Texas!

04-02-2014 15:15:45
144.9.56.131



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-02-2014 12:30:08  
It certainly looks like the original block. 2C16 translates to March 16, 1962. The F inside the C is the logo for the Cleveland Foundry. The earlier blocks had DIF cast in them- Dearborn Industrial Foundry if I recall correctly. That looks like casting "flash" to me, not a crack.
I don't have any industrials but I'd sure be fixing that one up with some of the spare parts I have laying around if it were mine.

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Norm43

04-02-2014 18:20:22
97.126.200.188



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Texas!, 04-02-2014 15:15:45  
Thanks Texas for the info. Here is what may be the story. Someone probably wanted to make it a blue tractor because the newer ones were blue. So while the engine was out they painted it blue, I have found a couple of red spots around the edges. And they painted the front tin blue but never got around to stripping and painting the rest of the tractor. At least it makes a good story.

Now here is another chapter. I got referred this morning to another 62 light industrial in Salt Lake City. Originally it was a diesel but now it is a gaser. Engine smokes but it has awesome tin including almost pristine rear fenders. Serial number 167665 and code 40303 DS. Has 14.9 24 turf tires as well but the rims are toast. So ... I probably have enough parts to really make a good one. Pictures to follow.

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NNP

04-02-2014 05:29:01
66.66.112.196



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-01-2014 18:20:39  
I'd save it, or sell it to somebody that would.

In my low budget operation, I'd get it running, clean it up some,

put some Ford fenders on it and use it.
It would be fun having other Ford guys walk around it, scratching their head.



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Norm43

04-02-2014 06:55:53
97.126.200.188



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to NNP, 04-02-2014 05:29:01  
That sure would be fun, I agree. Any idea what the proper ford fender might be?



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Fordfarmer

04-02-2014 08:19:33
207.118.211.120



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-02-2014 06:55:53  
I'd fix it up, too. As far as I know, the correct fenders would be the common "clam shells", same as other Fords of the era. The ones you have look like they -might- be from an English '65-up model.



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TONY JACOBS

04-01-2014 23:36:43
172.129.33.113



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-01-2014 18:20:39  
Hello Norm , What you have is a model number 40303 serial number should be between 131000 and 171500 putting it between late 1960 to mid year 1962 before the change to the blue and buff Industrial colors . The Sherman lever is modified Combo shifter not a reverser lever it still could have a reverser in it . The foot throttle is the correct 1st design for the red and buff Industrials . 14.9 and 16.9 were both optional sizes and either could have been correct . The Industrials came with a fixed drawbar setup but could be ordered with a swinging drawbar setup also . What ever the fenders are from they are not Ford and just scrap metal . As for the wheel weights Ford did make one piece cast center weights for the 28" wheels that weighed 600 lbs each during 1958-1960 listed only for the Heavy Duty Industrials 1801/4040 (I have a set of those and have only seen about 6 or 8 sets) but I have never seen ones for 24" wheels and Ford does list them as available but it does not mean one of the Foundries didn't cast some and sell them especially if you are on the west coast or if the tractor could be traced down to have been on the west coast . Where are you located ? Get it running and see what it sounds like it could be parts or a runner . I have both Light Duty and Heavy Duty Industrials both Red/Gray , Red/Buff ,and Blue/Buff Loaders , Loader/Backhoes , Dozer/Backhoes , Crane booms , Forklifts and Four Wheel Drives . Thanks Tony

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Norm43

04-02-2014 06:51:31
97.126.200.188



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to TONY JACOBS, 04-01-2014 23:36:43  

Thanks Tony .... I had heard from my friend Jim out here in Utah that you might have an expert opinion or two or three about Ford Industrial tractors. As I said this is my first encounter with one. Its been very interesting. Here are a couple of more pictures (hit the limit last night I guess). One shows the serial number and model number, you were right on both. The other shows an angle shot of the inside of the wheel. You can see how far the casting comes in. Is this how your 28's are? Do your 28's have the same casting pattern? I have found one picture on the internet that looks like the same pattern as these. Interesting that you should mention the west coast. In talking with the gent I got it from and some of his buddies the story goes that this tractor came to central Utah from a Dairy farm in California up to Utah. The gent who replaced the head gasket claims to have worked on that dairy farm and now lives in Utah. I have no reason not to believe that story. Someone has painted the tim blue but underneath it is the buff color. What would the grill have been? Doing internet searches I have seen mostly the later square pattern design but have seen two or three with the earlier Jubilee style grill. I see different fenders on the internet as well, what fender did this come with originally, the 800 series or did it have the 900 series?

If it starts and drives I will probably try to bring it back to life, especially if it is a rare specimen. I just can't stand to see these good old things get scrapped so I may just pass it along to someone else. Iv'e collected a few old jewels along the way saying they world make good projects when I retired. Well at retired last year at 70 and now don't have as much enthusiasm to tear a tractor clear down, especially a heavy one like this. My Ford collection includes a 740 row crop with a creeper Sherman, three Jubilee's (1952, 53 and 54), a 960 in progress and 4 8n 6 cylinder Funk conversions.

Thanks again for your information and advise. ... Norm

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TONY JACOBS

04-02-2014 21:26:10
172.163.16.118



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-02-2014 06:51:31  
Hello Norm , Yes my 28" Cast centers do you look like your 24" ones . The Sheet Metal on your tractor is just standard 801 sheet metal NOT 800 or 900 sheet metal . The grille is the one everybody calls the EGG CRATE GRILLE your standard 801 series grille . 800 series sheet metal and fenders are not the same as 801 series sheet metal and fenders although they bolt on between the two . As far as the colors go it is the EXACT SAME as a red and gray 801 Ag tractor just replace the gray with buff paint . They are not rare but production numbers are far less then Ag tractors so they are more uncommon . My 1960 40303S GAS #131217 with Elenco 4x4 kit is now in Texas , and I still have 2 other 1962 4030's #166069 4 spd/combo and 170028 SOS both 4x4 . With the exception of the rear fenders everything looks to correct and original including the engine . If it runs and drives good fix it if not well part it out or go get the other Industrial you were talking about . If you were closer I would like the wheel centers if you were going to part just because they are for 24" wheels which all but my 2 1958 tractors have on them . The 58 1841-D-S has the cast centers on it . Thanks Tony

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Sean in PA

04-01-2014 18:40:55
76.98.64.154



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-01-2014 18:20:39  
I've never seen wheel centers like that. Are you sure they're not just weights? Whatever they are, it looks like one's been cut in half and is hanging on the nose of the tractor in the first picture.



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Norm43

04-01-2014 19:53:37
97.126.200.188



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Sean in PA, 04-01-2014 18:40:55  
Thanks for the comment. The rear wheels are in fact a single piece and extend inside several inches beyond the brake drum. The front weight is a homemade deal of some kind made from a different type of weight. Hopefully someone will be able to clue us all in as to what is really here. This is my first experience with an industrial tractor and I am seeing some differences already. Fun to learn.

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tom new jersey

04-02-2014 14:22:30
71.48.107.42



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to Norm43, 04-01-2014 19:53:37  
I have a TLB that is a 1961 model 4030 3, with an aux Sherman transmission. It has always been in low range as I have no reason to take it out, might be concerned I could not get it back in. It has no tractor hydraulics, no 3PTH,no PTO,and no drawbar ( front pump for loader/backhoe ). It has heavy front axle, regular wheels, regular fenders and PS, and a different type of seat, I think original. I never saw wheels like you have. Also my original color was tan and red. This is just for info.

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Norm43

04-03-2014 17:42:40
97.126.205.115



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to tom new jersey, 04-02-2014 14:22:30  
Thanks for the info. I have another one now that just happened to come to my attention. Posted some pictures above. This is likely the same color as yours, I think they call it Buff and Red.



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TONY JACOBS

04-02-2014 22:04:00
172.163.16.118



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 Re: Ford Light Industrial tractor saga in reply to tom new jersey, 04-02-2014 14:22:30  
Hello Tom , Your tractor originally had three point hydraulics and a pto and a drawbar because model number says so but could have been removed by the dealer to save a couple of bucks when sold new . If your Sherman will come out of low gear it will go back in , no reason not to if it was broken it would not stay in gear either . Thanks Tony



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