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Ford Tractors Discussion Forum
Show Parts for Model:

Re: 12 v positive or negative ground

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equeen

03-22-2013 16:42:39
209.102.248.236



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really don't matter.. just polarize gen for whatever bat polarity you have, assuming a mechaincal vreg.

now.. is that charge system B circuit? you said you jumped arm to field. that indicated B circuit.

Okay....
1. I'm assuming a mechanical VR. Arm in back, Fld at top side, Bat at middle side, Lights at bottom side. What other type VR is there for these old tractors?

2. Polarize gen for negative ground (currently)? Instruction I have is to temporarily ground the gen FLD to the case or frame; then momentarily flash jump from VR BAT to the VR ARM term. (Should get small spark.)

3. What determines battery polarity?

4. What in the world is a "B" Circuit?

Thanks

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soundguy

03-22-2013 17:35:19
108.112.158.246



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 Re: 12 v positive or negative ground in reply to equeen, 03-22-2013 16:42:39  
yuo are all over the place.

your last post said you jumped arm to field... which indicates a B circuit system

NOW you are saying you are jumping bat to arm.. which indicates an A circuit system.

you REALLY should become familiar with your machines functions.

A and B circuit refer to field circuit types int he genny / vreg combo.

As for regulators.. there are mechanical vibrating regs.. and in some cases.. you can get solid state vregs. solid state vregs are generally NOT polarity agile.. the mechanical vregs, even if designated / designed for a polarity type, generally will work with either polarity.

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equeen

03-22-2013 18:03:48
209.102.248.236



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 Re: 12 v positive or negative ground in reply to soundguy, 03-22-2013 17:35:19  
Yes, I see that I was all over the place. Back to my notes.

Jumped from ARM to FLD and had voltage.
Jumped from ARM to BAT and had NO voltage.

Exactly opposite of what I was expecting to find.



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soundguy

03-22-2013 18:09:34
108.112.158.246



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 Re: 12 v positive or negative ground in reply to equeen, 03-22-2013 18:03:48  
if it's A circuit and you jump arm to field.. you may have cooked your vreg.

you just cant grab wires on tractors and start touching them together without knowing what you are doing.

IF it is A circuit.. you ground the field, and should read max on the armature.

IF it is a B circuit you can jump arm or bat to field and that will make it charge max at armature.

I don't konw which field type your machine is.

apparently you don't either.

I encourage you to find out what type it is so you don't roast a vreg.

if you flip the vreg over look for a bias resistor between ground and field.. if it has that one only.. it is an A circuit regulator.

if it has one from arm to field and perhaps another ( optional ).. it is B circuit.

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equeen

03-22-2013 18:27:32
209.102.248.236



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 Re: 12 v positive or negative ground in reply to soundguy, 03-22-2013 18:09:34  
Thanks for all your comments.

Will visit again and inspect VR with brother before new one arrives.

Notes were from some forum year or so ago regarding a 6 volt negative ground system. Is there a problem with these instructions for "Quick Test of Voltage Regulator with engine running and wires to generator connected":

1. Using volt meter momentarily jump the ARM and BAT terminals. Charge should be about 7.8. If not, then replace the regulator.

2. Jump the ARM and FLD terminals. If there is a charge, then replace the regulator.

Still learning and taking notes.

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soundguy

03-22-2013 18:53:14
108.112.160.44



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 Re: 12 v positive or negative ground in reply to equeen, 03-22-2013 18:27:32  
they both DO NOT apply to the same type of field circuit.

you can't use generic info, mixed togehter like cookie dough, and then apply it to stuff it does not apply to.

i gave you info in my last post how to determine what circuit type your reg is. if that reg is the specified one for your machine..and you have the oem genny.. then you know what circuit type the machine is.

from there.. you know how to polarize it

( bat to arm, when not running polarizes 'A' circuit.... when running, field to ground provides max charge test )

( bat to field, when not running polaraizes 'B' circuit.. bat to field when running provides max charge test. )


It's simple...

throw that note you have away.. it's only good for roasting vregs.

you can't blindly sift thru a forum for generic electrical info and then HOPE it applies to what you are looking for. do your tractor a favor.. get a service manual for it. it will love you for it. :)

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equeen

03-22-2013 19:01:55
209.102.248.236



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 Re: 12 v positive or negative ground in reply to soundguy, 03-22-2013 18:53:14  
Always appreciate your advice, even when I rile you up.

Thanks.



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soundguy

03-23-2013 13:22:13
184.240.245.141



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 Re: 12 v positive or negative ground in reply to equeen, 03-22-2013 19:01:55  
i'm not riled up.. i'm trying to HELP you.. but you can't mix n match shopping bag style when it comes to some repair advice.

gotta match up like applications...



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equeen

03-23-2013 13:31:23
209.102.248.236



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 Re: 12 v positive or negative ground in reply to soundguy, 03-23-2013 13:22:13  
I understand.

I did check some spare VRs for my 8Ns and its easy to see the bias resistor of which you wrote.
"A" circuit.

Checked a cut-out for the cubs and....well.

I'll check the one on the MF 35 next time I'm down at my brothers.

And, no, I'm not following all your advice. I'm not throwing all my notes away. Your advice appears sound and worth retaining.

Me



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soundguy

03-23-2013 13:40:42
184.240.245.141



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 Re: 12 v positive or negative ground in reply to equeen, 03-23-2013 13:31:23  
you can throw the one away that tells you 2 different things on that genny without telling you what circuit type they apply to.

cutouts and vregs are setup differently. the bias resistor is a field circuit component.. cutouts don't have that.

that cub is likely A circuit using a tickle ressitor in a lamp switch or similar...



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