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Detergent oils a no no?

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motorv8N

12-01-2007 08:30:59




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Thanks to everyone for the continued support for a new old tractor owner!

Today's task is trying to get up to speed on oil issues. The previous owner of my 51 TEA20 says the crankcase is filled with 30wt oil and the rear end with Dentax SAE 80W90 type G1. He also said not to use detergent oils in the engine although he didn't explain why.

Now that winter is upon us and I was thinking I should have a thinner oil in the engine if I hope to be able to start it. I've heard some people suggest 10w-40. Is this not a detergent oil? Is it a good choice for a machine that will live in an environment that will dip regularly to -20 C? Could I use this oil all year around? What is the detergent issue anyway?

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MF Poor

12-01-2007 13:08:19




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 Re: Detergent oils a no no? in reply to motorv8N, 12-01-2007 08:30:59  
Once upon a time people said you shouldn't sail too near the edge of the earth or you'll fall off. We know better now.

Same sort of logic applies to oil. We know better now. Why use technology that's been made more or less obsolete?

There is no GOOD reason NOT to use oil that is better than what was available "back in the day". The ONLY issue I know of that would make anyone think twice about using a detergent oil is it will dislodge dirt/sludge left in an engine from years of using non-detergent oils. Just change the filter on a regular basis and get that stuff out of the engine. It shouldn't be there in the first place.

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RN

12-01-2007 13:03:41




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 Re: Detergent oils a no no? in reply to motorv8N, 12-01-2007 08:30:59  
Try 10/30 for winter/spring, change oil filter. Change oil again in couple months if working it with snowplow, scraper and oil seems dirty. 15-40 or 30 wt in hot summer work-plowing, field work- otherwise 10-30 for light work in moderate temps for summer also. Could take off oil pan and scrape old crud out, did that with a F-20 IHC and found layer of muck. Good non-detergent oil would be appropriate for a engine without a filter. RN

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Bruce(OR)

12-01-2007 10:21:03




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 Re: Detergent oils a no no? in reply to motorv8N, 12-01-2007 08:30:59  
Pardon me while I will throw in my two cents worth. Recently I have read that diesel/heavy duty oil is a better lubricant than the energy saving oil due to it ability to cling to metal parts after the engine has been shut off. It does not drain away like the energy saving oil does. This in turn makes the camshaft and lifters much happier when starting the engine. If you have an engine with roller cam and lifters then using an energy saving oil should not harm the cam...

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Jerry/MT

12-01-2007 09:44:43




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 Re: Detergent oils a no no? in reply to motorv8N, 12-01-2007 08:30:59  
I agree with Gerald. There is no good reason not to use modern lube oils in your tractor. There is a lot of unvalidated anecdotal information about someones 3rd cousins neigbor"s brother-in-law who changed to detergent oil and imediately had some sort of lube sytem related failure. The change in oil type most likely got blamed for something that was immenent and had nothing to do with change to a detergent oil.While I don"t want to imply I"ve seen it all, I have never seen any validated technical data that corroborates changing to a detergent oil will cause a lube system related failure.

I don"t know about the Standard engines in the TEA"s but if you look in the Ferguson Owners Manual, there is a statement to the effect that Premium and Heavy Duty oils (early detergent oils) have advantages over regular grade(non-detergent) oils, and says that they( Premium & Heavy Duty) oils maybe used. It goes on to say that they "hold carbon and other particles in susupension untill the particles are removed by the filter."

So go use a good,modern, detergent oil in your old tractor.

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Gerald J.

12-01-2007 08:53:24




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 Re: Detergent oils a no no? in reply to motorv8N, 12-01-2007 08:30:59  
I am of the opinion that running nondetergent oil is active abuse to the engine. It lets sludge build up and block passages that need oil. It has no additives to prevent corrosion between different metals (like the copper and silver of the bearing inserts against the steel of the crankshaft and camshaft). It has no additives to lubricate the cold start after the engine was shut down hot.

Those who don't think you should change to a modern detergent oil believe that the seals and gaskets are fortified by the grunge and sludge inside them. But if the detergent oil loosens the sludge and cause those seals and gaskets to leak, the seals were worn out already and the gaskets were rotted already.

Changing from nodetergent oil to a detergent oil means the detergent oil will need to be changed frequently until the engine is cleaned.

Based on readings from Texaco's Lubrication magazine years ago and other sources, I believe that the fact that car engines last 150K or 200K miles these days instead of the 30K they did in 1949 has more to do with the modern oil quality than changes in engine design, though the short stroke engine does accumulate piston travel miles at a slower pace.

Gerald J.

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