TEA20 sump, pump and mains question

chippy610

Member
Hi
I'm new to this but hopefully someone will help. I have low oil pressure when hot and (good when cold) so I'm going to check the mains/big ends and I have questions as follows:

1. Is the sump simple to remove?
2. Can the mains be replaced with the engine in situ from beneath?
3. Can the oil pump be inspected easily and replaced from beneath?

Many thanks

Chip
 
(quoted from post at 03:52:06 04/23/18) Hi
I'm new to this but hopefully someone will help. I have low oil pressure when hot and (good when cold) so I'm going to check the mains/big ends and I have questions as follows:

1. Is the sump simple to remove?
2. Can the mains be replaced with the engine in situ from beneath?
3. Can the oil pump be inspected easily and replaced from beneath?Chip

Yes the sump is easy. But, remove the screen filter from the right side of sump first. It is the oval cover. The screen fits over the oil pump inlet and will prevent dropping the sump.

Yes the bearings can be done in place, but you should do a few things first. Do a compression test first. You could do the test on a cold engine and then when good and warm. Get back to us with some numbers.

Also, what is your oil pressure when cold and when hot. Note the pressures at 1500 RPM and at idle.

The oil pump can be inspected but you would have to take it apart and measure the gear clearances.

Now some thoughts before you make yourself a lot of work. :)
My 1st Fergie that I bought in the early 80's had poor oil pressure. I Plastiguaged the bearings and they were very worn. I even found a broken ring and part of the piston skirt.

I replaced the pump with a used one. Adjusted the oil filter pressure adjust to get better cold pressure, about 50 PSI. Finally I was able to get about 5 PSI when the engine was hot at idle. (I had about 15 PSI at 1500 RPM). The compression was not great but it started and ran pretty well. I finally did an overhaul last summer.

If your tractor starts and runs well, even if the bearings are worn some, wait until you can do the whole job, and do it well.
 
Thanks for that - The sump is extremely sludged when viewed through the oval hole so I need to get it off to clean and while I'm there I'll get a cap off to see the bearing condition. Its been running well
when hot but I don't have a gauge that measures pressure - just low/normal/high. On idling its well into the 'low' and at 1500rpm the low side of 'normal'. It was well above these up until a week ago. I cant
do a compression test as the oil/battery/leads are off at the moment but it runs well to the ear.
My plan is sump off, check mains and big ends, check oil pump and take it from there.
 
(quoted from post at 07:20:13 04/23/18) Thanks for that - The sump is extremely sludged when viewed through the oval hole so I need to get it off to clean and while I'm there I'll get a cap off to see the bearing condition. Its been running well
when hot but I don't have a gauge that measures pressure - just low/normal/high. On idling its well into the 'low' and at 1500rpm the low side of 'normal'. It was well above these up until a week ago. I cant
do a compression test as the oil/battery/leads are off at the moment but it runs well to the ear.
My plan is sump off, check mains and big ends, check oil pump and take it from there.

Make sure you are prepared to "torque" the bearing nuts to spec. when you are done.

Five PSI on my gauge was about one needle's width above zero.
So, you are probably in good shape, oil pressure wise.
 
PICS: TEA 20 ENGINE S # S105046E

Do you own a TEA-20 SERVICE MANUAL?

Do you own a PARTS BOOK?

Bob...Retired Power Engineer.....Owner operator TEA-20 and other colored Tractors:
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chippy610......

Try placing a Socket & Ratchet on the Retainer Bolt / NUT that holds the Vibration Dampener / Pulley to the Crankshaft.

With Distributor CAP REMOVED turn Crankshaft CCW and then CW. Turn Crankshaft only enough to verify how many degrees the Ratchet has to move CCW & CW before the ROTOR / Distributor drive moves?

Estimate the number of degrees or inches the RATCHET has to move before the Distributor drive moves:

You are checking the condition of the Timing Chain, and drive sprockets.

I've lost track of how many Timing Chain, drive sprockets and Governor fly weight assemblies I have seen and replaced that had FAILED on the TEA-20 Engine.

I had a situation were the Engine would NOT return to ideal until the throttle was forced towards min speed. The Governor weights were ready to fall off/detach from the holding pins. I rotated the crankshaft CW/CCW and noticed 4 TEETH on the FLYWHEEL had to move past a reference point before the DISTRIBUTOR ROTOR would move. Now only one tooth on the flywheel will pass before the Rotor moves. The governor was sticking at full throttle and would not idle down. Cheers:


Bob....
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Info:

On an old Engine with many running Hours...........I would not turn Crankshaft over with head off for any reason....$$$$$ and time to replace Siamese seals at base of Liners:

Bob...TEA-20 Engine....
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Info:

On an old Engine with many running Hours...........I would not turn Crankshaft over with head off for any reason....$$$$$ and time to replace Siamese seals at base of Liners:


Bob...TEA-20 Engine....
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I've had the sump off and desludged - no metal bits there. Cant see how to do the front and rear mains from below as the rear look captive with the casing and the front is inaccessible so I'll check the centre bearing tonight.

I have the Service Manual and Dealer Shop Manual but neither have the procedure for oil pump removal - I presume I tape the rotor arm to lock the distributor and remove that first??

Thanks for the photos John D - looks interesting.

In another tread someone suggests increasing the relief valve pressure but I cant see how that would help with the low pressure issue.

Photos of front and rear (and cam looks good) plus on bit I did find buried in the sludge!!!
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(quoted from post at 02:06:35 04/24/18)

I have the Service Manual and Dealer Shop Manual but neither have the procedure for oil pump removal - I presume I tape the rotor arm to lock the distributor and remove that first??

In another tread someone suggests increasing the relief valve pressure but I cant see how that would help with the low pressure issue.

You do not have to do anything special to remove the oil pump.

The slotted screwdriver adjustment with the locking nut should normally have about 6-7 threads showing. You can turn this CW to raise the oil pressure. It compresses a spring on a ball valve that opens when the pressure is too high. Do not, however, tighten it all the way. Leave at least 2 threads exposed.
 
Why remove the Distributor?

Distributor is presently timed:

Drop the OIL PUMP and leave the Distributor as is:
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Does anyone know the tolerances for wear on the oil pump?

I presume this is rotor tip to body and body tip to rotor...
 
See below info from ORIGINAL FERGUSON SERVICE MANUAL:

Coventry England:

Section B
page B.6 / B.7

July 8, 1953 Update:

Bob......
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Thnaks John D, very helpful.

I've got about 4 thou clearance between the inner rotor tip and outer as it passes. This was about 6 but I rotated the inner by one segment relative to the outer and got it down 2 thou. I think this is OK and probably better than a newly produced one?

The end float is about 3 thou whats the best way to relap?

I'll check the bearings later

Thanks again

Chip
 

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