C113 head studs

Mr. Farmall A · Aug 3, 2014

Looking around online for head studs I could only find one place that sells them for $20 a piece. It would cost $180 to replace all nine studs, is that a good price or can I do better elsewhere?

The reason I am replacing the head studs is that they may be streched since the motor keeps blowing head gaskets even after the head was planed.

Bob · Aug 3, 2014

Do the studs "take torque" or just stretch so you can"t reach torque "spec."?

What torque value are you using... it takes a bit more than the old "specs" from the day to get the head sealed.

I"m sure someone will come along with a recommended updated torque value.

Red Dave · Aug 3, 2014

I'm not sure I understand how new Head Studs would correct your problem. Unless they are visibly damaged, or somebody along the way replaced them with something unsuitable, I would tend to look elsewhere for the problem.

Are you using sealer on the new gaskets, torquing to 80 ft/lbs and re-torquing after the engine is run a bit and warmed up?

Is the deck of the block flat?

gene bender · Aug 3, 2014

STUDS arent your problem.

pete 23 · Aug 3, 2014

I see no one has mentioned the sleeve flange protrusion. Many sleeves manufactured in the last 20 or so years protrude over the blocks too much. This is common on all sleeved engines. Once you blow a gasket they will have a definite tendency to blow in same place again due to slight erosion of block and sleeve flange. I don't like sleeves to protrude more than .002 and that is often hard to obtain. I have a friend who left the sleeves in the block of a 300 and had the block planed because the flange was .008 over block. The wet sleeves are not usually as bad but they are still a problem.

Mr. Farmall A · Aug 3, 2014

(quoted from post at 09:44:38 08/03/14) I'm not sure I understand how new Head Studs would correct your problem. Unless they are visibly damaged, or somebody along the way replaced them with something unsuitable, I would tend to look elsewhere for the problem.

Are you using sealer on the new gaskets, torquing to 80 ft/lbs and re-torquing after the engine is run a bit and warmed up?

Is the deck of the block flat?

I used copper spray sealer which the head gasket instructions said to use, however their are mixed reviews about copper HG sealer on the net. Some guys say the copper sealer is failure prone and that either using silver paint or installing the head gasket dry is better.Torqued the head nuts to 80Lb, then ran the engine to warm up the head, then retorqued the nuts to 80 Lbs.

One of the studs is mismatching from the others, just a tad shorter. Looks like the old owner had taken the head off and replaced a stud for some reason. Maybe overtighten the head nuts stripping the one stud which was why it was replaced, and stretched the others?

I don't know if the deck of the block is flat but I will check it. If that needs planing, would that mean a complete engine tear down?

I have also replaced head gasket on my small block Chevy V8 which uses shim head gaskets without sealer and no problems with that after 7 years running 9.5:1 CR. Which has me confused why a much lower compression motor with a thicker gasket keeps blowing.

Mr. Farmall A · Aug 3, 2014

(quoted from post at 10:06:56 08/03/14) I see no one has mentioned the sleeve flange protrusion. Many sleeves manufactured in the last 20 or so years protrude over the blocks too much. This is common on all sleeved engines. Once you blow a gasket they will have a definite tendency to blow in same place again due to slight erosion of block and sleeve flange. I don't like sleeves to protrude more than .002 and that is often hard to obtain. I have a friend who left the sleeves in the block of a 300 and had the block planed because the flange was .008 over block. The wet sleeves are not usually as bad but they are still a problem.

As far as I know the engine has not been rebuilt and the sleeves are original, or at least older than 30 years. I did not see any signs of erosion on the block or sleeves. This will be the thrid time I had to replace the head gasket. I owned this tractor for 13 years and it started to have this problem in the last 4 years. (It sat for 11 years before I bought it, and I knew the last owner who was a guy who ran stuff ragged rather than rebuild things).

teddy52food · Aug 3, 2014

If it is blowing in the same place each time, chances are that spot is low. Use a straight edge and a feeler gauge & find out.

Mr. Farmall A · Aug 4, 2014

Is it possible that coolant could leak up through the threads where the studs screw into the block and cause gasket failure or otherwise leak into the cylinders?

I know with some motors the head bolt/stud hoes go into the water jackets and require thread sealant.

Other wise, if it is a wraped block then I am looking at a full engine rebuild?

mkirsch · Aug 4, 2014

Yes, if it is a warped block you are looking at a complete engine disassembly. There is no way to plane the block with it still in the tractor, and you don't want the moving parts anywhere near the chips, as you'll never get them cleaned out, and then you WILL need a full rebuild.

While it's probably not the best idea in the world, I would think you could re-use the existing parts if you were very careful about keeping track of where everything came from and its orientation. You'd need new gaskets and o-rings of course.

Putting in new sleeves pistons and bearings is one of those "may as well while I'm in there" things, though. You've got it apart, so maybe you'd want to consider that.

Mr. Farmall A · Aug 4, 2014

I hope it is not that then.

The other thing I am thinking, can coolant seep through the threads of the head studs? I know with Chevy V8s that if you do not use sealant on the head bolt threads, then coolant will seep through the theads and ruin the head gasket seal. Do the head studs on C113 motors also screw into the water jacket and require sealant like SBCs? Could it be the thread sealant has gone bad allowing coolant seepage to mess up the head gaskets.

C113 head studs

Mr. Farmall A

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