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1958 IH Utility Bac khoe Runs (Barely) then quits

D

drizler

New User
A fellow I know bought an old backhoe that didn"t run. Another guy who is tractor savvy went through the carb but it didn"t run any better. They then took it to a reputable dealer who did the tank thing and rebuilt it and it still runs crappy as before so that"s out. Compression is good. The distributor got checked and is a bit loose but the wrench said that amount of looseness is normal / acceptable and wouldn"t cause such poor running. The usual others were done like points, plugs cap ect. My buddy the savvy old tractor guy is leaning towards valves about this time. I was wondering what else should be looked into as I understand this has no timing chain and the key is definitely not spun?
Symptoms, starts hard idles like crap stalls out when any attempt to move it or rev it at all.
Any likely ideas would be most appreciated.
 
What does the spark look like?? You need a blue/white spark that will jump a 1/ inch gap or more or it will not run as it should. Valves can not be the problem if the compression is good unless they are so loose they do not open up as they should but that is not likely.
 
Replace the oil with a known good one. if no joy replace the condenser. It must throw a 1/4" blue spark !! Jim
 
compression is good.??? what IS the actual compression readings? these engines are a cold blooded thing and till warmed up kid of like to stall. but they will start with just a push of the button. has to be something plugged in the carb. what does "went through the carb" mean? was it taken apart and soaked in carb cleaner, and all passages blown out with air? like pretty vague info to go on. also any old tractor i aquire gets the valves set to spec also, have found many with little clearance or else lots. that is part of a tune up. then i check compression and record readings. then you know if you can smile or use your second language .also the main jet on carb should be 4-5 turns out. maybe its just a carb adjustment?
 
Good points all, sorry I can"t come back with direct answers. Like I said not my tractor nor the guy doing the fixing so I am floating ideas for when he comes back from vacation. I can only assume he had good solid spark but the coil rings a bell. He has only owned diesels for many years so maybe just maybe that one escaped him. Thanks for the ideas.
 
Yeah you can "assume" but you'd be surprised at how many "experienced" guys just "assume" the spark is good and don't bother to check it.

Without actual compression readings and actual spark status, there's really no ideas to float...

If the compression is anywhere near 90PSI it can be made to run. If the compression is even across the cylinders, it can run like a top with good power by simply tuning the carb and ignition.

Timing could be way off causing the bad running.
 
I just talked to Jim and he said they did the whole electrical thing right down to the condenser and it was tossing fat blue sparks and he even swapped out a coil from a currently running car he had. The Comps were between 90 to 105 . The IH mechanic told him it should run ok with those values just like the slightly loose distributor. So I guess unless the carb is totally buggered inside someplace it's the valves. The IH mechanic hot tanked and rebuilt the carb as I described earlier and of course it still runs the same either way.
 
not so, still can have tight clearances and get compression reading. that engine should be up around 120-125 psi. also can get compression reading with valve seats all pounded out and valves like razors. what i am getting at is "what is he calling ok".like eliminate the should, would and could.
just like when a doctor asks you what is the problem today? you answer i dont feel good... well that dont tell him a damm thing.
 
all it takes is for one passage in the carb to be plugged and without finding it you can swear you need a new tractor. carbs just dont buggar up, they are fixable. the compression is a bit low but i would say should not be a problem to get this tractor to move. no mension of valve adjustment?
i can give you a good example i run into. nieghbour had a 460 gas he was selling on auction. i offered the son 1600.00. no not enough, he wanted 2500.00. i said ok i will wait for the auction. then auction day tractor up... wont start, they had carb off and apart and boosting and no go. so auctioneer says sell as is. so ok i buy it for 700.00 and pulled it home with truck. then decided to check the main needle valve on carb and it was pretty much shut. opened it up and tractor started right up , so goes to show that need some one with experience and nohow on these things.
and if he would have taken 1600.00 he would have been ahead.
 
Pull the plug out of the bottom of the carb turn the gas on and wait, if it keeps running the liquid gold out for 1 min., then the fuel system to the bowl is fine. There are a lot of things people over look when they clean tanks, the line, the sediment bowl and shut off valve, the filter in the carb inlet, sticking needle valve etc. And unhook the hose to the carb intake, just to make sure the intake air is not restricted.
 
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