Please Help, adding live hydraulic pump to a Super W6

Redturbo

Member
Hey there, Scott here from Alberta. Since its winter, & we have snow this yr. Need to do something with hyd's on this old tractor. Been in the family since 1953, but doesnt have factory pump. Back in 50's Grandfather had a char lynn pto driven pump. It failed in the 70's, Dad found a used setup & made parts of it work, driven off the crankshaft to a hyd pump out front. Now fast forward to 2012, time to repair. Old pump was leaking, not secure. Went our local TSC type store, got a $100 pump. Had shaft made, read did alot of it. Made it look better in the process. Problem is shaft seal on pump comes out, then leaks. Tried another pump, couple seals. Likely my shaft is off causing the seal to leak. Thought had it fixed, plowed farm yard twice with no leaks. Plowed on the 24th, have oil leaking again. So im tired of this idea, looking to add live hyd pump in front of the distributor instead. Do I need any other parts other than the pump? Another issue were having is hyd's are slow, engine only turns 1450rpm. This 100 pump range is 1000 to 4000, image not turning it fast enough. Thanks for any help on live pump.
 
In addition to the pump, you need the adapter block that the hoses attach to, a reservoir, at least one spool valve, hoses, and fittings to hook it all up.

You're going to choke at the price of a live pump... It's around $900.

I would recommend going with a new pump. You're taking a huge chance on a used pump, and people tend to drive the prices of those well up over 1/2 the cost of new. Get one bad used pump, and you've spent way more than you would have on a new pump.
 
I have a used hydraulic pump that should fit your tractor. I have the adaptor block as well. It spins and the bearings feel tight. I'd let it go for $200. My email is open. 740 four zero seven 1430. Picture is in parts photo ads.
 
I have the original complete factory setup you need, came off a Super W6. The pump, reservior, hoses, and control valve are all there. Sold my tractor and don"t need anymore. Will take just what I paid; $400 plus shipping. Email if interested.
 
Hi Scott

I see your from Alberta, have you checked out the Hydraulic dept. of your local Princess Auto Store. They have a lot of neat stuff.

Cheers

Russ
 
(quoted from post at 15:10:40 12/27/12) Hi Scott

I see your from Alberta, have you checked out the Hydraulic dept. of your local Princess Auto Store. They have a lot of neat stuff.

Cheers

Russ

IIRC he said that is where he got the second pump (It was on RPM)
 
Be careful of the direction of spin. A seal system on a hydraulic pump is always set so it has intake (suction) on it, not pressure. If the pump is turning backwards, it will leak. Also if the hydraulic system is not vented, less expensive pump seals will blow from moderate system pressure on the suction side. Best of luck. I would probably go with the 400 dollar option below. Freight needs to be looked at carefully, but it is a deal. Jim
 
(quoted from post at 18:52:33 12/27/12) Be careful of the direction of spin. A seal system on a hydraulic pump is always set so it has intake (suction) on it, not pressure. If the pump is turning backwards, it will leak. Also if the hydraulic system is not vented, less expensive pump seals will blow from moderate system pressure on the suction side. Best of luck. I would probably go with the 400 dollar option below. Freight needs to be looked at carefully, but it is a deal. Jim

Aren't quite a few pumps bidirectional? Or is that only hyd motors?
 
Some can be but the seals are usually not designed to take the high pressure side of the system. thus the end spacer plate and seal are usually on the outside of the end bushings. The space between the bushing and the seal is open (or ported) to the low pressure side to prevent seal blowout. Hydraulic motors are often designed much differently and often have substantial Oring seal systems. Jim
 
The pump did come from Princess Auto. Only problem with that, they know less than me. Which doesn't take much in hydraulics. From what I have read on here, must be pressuring up the center section. The pump is suppose to be able to turn both ways. Had to take apart & change rotation. Maybe I have screwed that up.
 
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I took pictures of the tractor in the shed. Its dark out, tractor not plugged in. Best I could with pictures today. I wish knew alot more about hydraulics. Truck techs dont have much to do with fab up a system. More replace the broken part. P/auto does sell those couplers like Jim B suggested. I have been thinking it might need it.
 
(quoted from post at 01:58:57 12/28/12)P/auto does sell those couplers like Jim B suggested. I have been thinking it might need it.
I was just looking back through this thread and noted that in my first post I suggested the coupler with no explanation. I'm sure you got the point, but I should add a little explanation for anyone else that might be reading this.

If the pump shaft is not perfectly aligned with the crankshaft, the shaft connecting them together may be putting some side force on the pump shaft. Such force could damage the pump, including but not limited to damaging the seal. Couplers like this are commonly used on hydraulic pumps because perfect alignment is nearly impossible.

Other discussion in this thread has been down another path that seems more likely as the fix for the current problem. But adding a coupler like this is still probably a good step for long term use.
 
Changed up a few things today. Moved the oil filter to the inlet side of the tank, raised the 6". Got rid of the hy-tran, only reason used it. Had some left over from 560 oil change. Hy-tran is like snot in the winter. Put in everyday hyd oil, nice & thin. Its only going to run the ram on the blade ever. Upgraded the pump also, went from 12 to 20. The 12 needs 4000rpm to make 12. Since this engine is lucky to get 1400, the 20gpm max input is 2200rpm with pressure of 2000psi. Made up new suction line, changed some fittings. Poured oil in, rev for couple mins to get rid of air. Then reved up engine. Old man was beside tractor. He jump when the blade moved. Laughed to myself, blade has never moved this fast in its life time. P/auto also sells a different seal to convert this pump into a motor. Im not going to reverse the pump, but like the idea of a seal with a back washer. For the heck of it I put it in. Then replaced the spool valve, another just incase. Plowed snow down the drive way, no leaks so far. Really impressed with the response of hyd's & speed. Hopefully its fixed for awhile. Found punp flow calcuations, its going to do 13.75gpm. Image this in perfect world settings. I have no idea if old engine is doing max rpm anymore, if my lines are the rights side, etc.
 

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